"What would 'closer' mean, if not knowing each other better, being better able to provide what the other person needs and take advantage of what they can provide us, and the bonding emotions that humanity evolved to implement and boost that process?"

Awww. That's kind of nice, actually!

"I agree with that!"

"But I guess I also want to mention, while we're on the topic of why people stay together rather than switching relationships all the time... many people do switch relationships all the time, in my experience. And many who don't switch, stay together because of all of the sunk costs in the relationship. It would be too expensive to get separate dwellings again, for example, or it would be hard on the kids for their parents to separate. And I aspire to better than that, for myself. I want to stay in a relationship because I like the relationship."

"That's exactly right!  And so, one of the primary functions of relationship therapy is to help people realize when at least one person is just sticking around the other person because of switching costs, or sheer ugh fields around the prospect of breaking up, or because they've just never sat down and planned out how they'd exit the relationship if they had to and realized it wouldn't really be that bad."

Is...that...a problem people commonly have? Leareth would have thought the more usual problem - certainly the one he's more familiar with in Velgarth - is more in the realm of 'not being able to afford separate dwellings' like Ramona mentioned, and...whatever Thellim is doing here...doesn't really seem like it would help? 

"Well, fortunately it is not as though either of us is is facing resource shortages in general such that we cannot afford to leave a relationship. I do think it makes sense to aim for a relationship only if it is actively better for both of us than not."

He hesitates for a moment. "...Just to be clear, I would not actually be seeking a different romantic partner, if this relationship does not work. I was perfectly content without any romantic relationships for a long time, but Ramona is - special." He should really be able to think of a more specific word for it than that. "It seemed unusually worth trying." 

"Oh, are you demisexual or demiromantic?  There's some people who find they can only be sexually or romantically attracted to few people, sometimes only one person they can realistically be with.  Then their partner has a lot of negotiating leverage over them, and is also condemning them to a dreadful fate if they ever actually leave; both of which can lead to standard, well-known relationship issues."

That is making a reasonable amount of sense up until WHAT. 

"....I think it would be reasonable to say that I am only romantically attracted to very few people, but I am not sure how the - second claim - follows? I very much do not want Ramona to feel that she would be condemning me to a dreadful fate if she decides not to pursue a relationship!" Apparently he feels surprisingly strongly about this! "I do not think it is true, and it seems - deeply unfair to her as a framing." 

Awwwww, Ramona is melting a little bit. Leareth is defending her honor! She grabs Leareth's hand and squeezes it.

Ramona does have questions about what sort of place Thellim comes from. It's not unheard of on Earth for people to be trapped financially in a relationship, but being trapped demisexually?

"Well, if you say your baseline hedonic state would be fine after losing Ramona, I definitely don't know enough about your history to contradict that, but it does seem worth running a prediction market on it..."  Thellim's voice has slowed for a moment, as she taps a few keychords into her keyboard.  "Huh.  Prediction markets say that you'd probably be fine in terms of mental integrity for a while, but you should try creating an immortal catgirl at some point.  We probably shouldn't dive into that right now, it sounds distracting."

"We've sort of stepped into this part prematurely, but one of the key variables in relationships is how much each side is getting from the other.  One of the big things that potentially goes wrong in relationships is the same as what goes wrong in any other kind of trade: one side or both sides start to feel like they're getting a bad deal.  Sometimes that means you shouldn't be trading at all; but more commonly, if the relationship otherwise has a lot going for it, what you need is a good old-fashioned repricing!  Or even, just to explicitly negotiate, rather than leaving everything down to unspoken individual decisionmaking and relying on good will and large surpluses to make everything work anyways."

"I can talk about the principles underlying that, if they're not already familiar.  For example, as with any other supply-demand equilibrium, the price of what you have to offer doesn't just depend on how much effort you put into it, or how valuable it is to the other person, but also how hard it would be for them to find the same goods elsewhere!  Oxygen is very valuable, relative to its counterfactual absence, but in most places oxygen is so easy to get that you can't get a lot of relationship credit for providing oxygen to your partner."

"Another function of relationship therapists is to oversee negotiations like that, and provide a third-party judgment from somebody who's trying to be impartial about how much pricing power each party reasonably seems to have.  That way, even if you don't get everything you wanted from negotiations, you know it's not just your partner being unreasonable and that a third-party judge helped set a valuation."

"I'll stop here and check if I'm still using concepts familiar to everyone's home dimensions."

(Leareth had THOUGHT he understood how the prediction markets worked, but is suddenly a lot more confused if 'create an immortal catgirl' is a kind of output they can produce! That's not a probability! ...Thellim is also absolutely right that it sounds distracting and now is not the time to get into it.)

Standard action-conditional market, different predicted happinesses if Leareth does or doesn't create an immortal catgirl.  Actually MOST people would be happier if they created an immortal catgirl, but Mornelithe is aware that most people who aren't him don't have that option.

When Ramona had the idea to take the "girlfriend" role and cede the "therapist/relationship expert" role to a third party, she did not anticipate this outcome.

She's trying to imagine giving this speech in particular to her human clients on Earth, who often come in already believing they're getting the short end of the stick in the relationship. She'd explain that they just need to negotiate harder to get their partner to give more because the relationship needs a good old-fashioned repricing and probably most of the clients would break up! Or maybe their outrage buffers would overflow and they'd direct the outrage at Ramona and leave together, united in their eye-rolls at how ridiculous therapy is!

"So... you're saying that your job is to tell us who's getting a better deal, and suggest ways for the lower-performing partner to increase their contribution?" Ramona's voice is incredulous.

"Only if you have that particular problem!  Do you?"

No! Ramona starts to say, but then stops for a moment to check.

Do they have this problem? Ramona has been feeling like Leareth has excellent intentions, but directs his energies less helpfully than he might.

Fuck if maybe Thellim has a point here.

Leareth...kind of feels like their problem is at some level upstream of 'realizing who is getting a better deal' and renegotiating contributions to the relationship, though it's...maybe actually related enough that the question is useful? 

It feels very difficult to put into words, but honestly at least some of their problems happened because something was hard to put into words and so he...didn't...and he doesn't think it's unreasonable of Ramona to be frustrated about that. (Some of the problems were because he wasn't sure something was safe to communicate to her, which he thinks is distinct, but he really doesn't think he can blame everything on operational security concerns.) 

And, well, here they are with a couple's therapist, who can be a third-party judge on whether he's making any sense (even if he's perhaps starting to get the sense that Ramona does not entirely appreciate or agree with Thellim's judgement.) 

"I think I am missing context on ways that people - contribute to - romantic relationships, separate from what it means to be a competent ally working on projects together - well, there is sex, obviously, but I am getting the sense that a romantic relationship is supposed to mean more than being allies who also have sex. I am just missing details on what. Especially since Ramona hardly needs me to provide for our household or defend her from other men, which I think are among the common relationship expectations for ordinary people in Velgarth. Maybe I should be able to figure out the right questions to ask, to clarify, but clearly I have not managed to do that." 

"Defend Ramona from other men?  I don't know how relevant that is but it sounds confusing enough that I'm going to ask for context on why these other men are attacking Ramona."

"As far as I am aware Ramona has not had any problems with that, which is why I think defending her is not a -" how would he put it in the framework Thellim is using, "- a high value contribution to the relationship."

And since Thellim seems to be genuinely confused about this, "...In many countries of Velgarth men have more rights than women, and tend to have more resources - not to mention that men are usually physically stronger than women, and traditionally men learn combat skills and women usually do not - and some unethical men use this to coerce sexual favors from women, so one role a husband might be expected to serve is in protecting his wife from other men's unwanted attention."

Wait, has he ever actually checked... "Ramona, have you felt threatened by anyone during your time in Velgarth? I realize I have been assuming you are obviously competent to take care of yourself and get what you want, and - I am probably assuming that because I respect and admire you, but I actually have no idea if you feel equipped to defend yourself..." 

"Thank you for asking! Velgarth is somewhat terrifying, actually! There's a whole magical playing field I can't even perceive, and I would not feel so safe on Velgarth if I did not have you and other allies to protect me!"

"I mostly stay out of areas where men might be tempted to assault me, so that's never happened, but it could. I think by now everyone knows better than to bother Leareth's girlfriend with the purple hair."

"Would it be fair to say that Ramona has not finished fixing Leareth's planet and this is a key underpinning of your ongoing relationship?"

That is a pretty good question, actually?

"Leareth, do you see improving Velgarth as, like, the thing we do together as a couple? As a hobby?"

That is a surprisingly good question, actually! 

"I...am not sure I would have called it a key underpinning of our relationship, but - yes, probably? It has been my main project for a very long time, and - much of why I admire and respect you so much is because you succeeded, in a short period of time, where I had failed for -" centuries, millennia, but he hasn't actually told Thellim about his immortality, "- a very long time."

Short pause.

"...I would not be upset if you preferred to have different hobbies, to be clear?" 

"Should I maybe... make a list of potential other hobbies that I would enjoy, and you can tell me if any of them are the slightest bit appealing?"

Ramona wonders if Leareth could maybe get into baking? She is having trouble imagining getting Velgarth sufficiently advanced that there will be a thriving escape room industry in the next ten years.

....Leareth glances at Thellim. "I - sure, that could be useful, but I am not sure if there is an earlier thread that we should finish addressing first?" 

"Just to be very clear, here, I wasn't saying there was anything wrong with fixing planets!  I'd fixed three before I got into Milliways!  That's a perfectly reasonable foundation on which to build a relationship!  You just want to make sure you also have things to do when you're tired and winding down at night; and that you know you'll have other things to do together when you're done fixing the planet, so that neither of you is tempted to dawdle or hold off about finishing that."

Thellim doesn't want to dump on Velgarth in the process of doing relationship therapy!

Leareth is finding it kind of hard to imagine being tempted to delay or hold off on fixing everything in Velgarth because - what - it would mean there was less to do? Having nothing at all to do for a while sounds like it could be wonderful, actually. Not that he's spent much time before now imagining it, since it really hadn't seemed helpful...

He glances curiously at Ramona.