"Civilization's cults are in the middle of a centuries-brewing theological civil war about what parts of civilization are the salient ones to be supporting and I suspect they wouldn't enjoy further wildcards. ... Honestly, better than even odds they attack you sometime in the next decade if you're still in this city, we're a plausible target for conquest by the Lord of Light and his empire. Forge will expect you to be good at making things if you want to follow him. Hearth's following tends to be oriented to the local culture. Formal Void-cults are few and often in isolated places, I don't know what might provoke them to act." 

"Torture is absolutely on the weaker and more vulnerable side as far as gods go and 'suffering instils virtue and discipline if correctly aimed' is essentially a summary of why his priests endorse being tortured as well as torturing. That said I would like to encourage you to follow some path that does not involve becoming a god of torture, because I do not think even a notionally-benevolent god is going to make the world a better place if they're doing it by torturing people." He's genuinely pretty concerned about this, though not quite as much as his facial expressions about it might imply. 

"Ah. I can help clarify a few points here. In this world, souls grow as living things grow and strive, from the meanest mold to the greatest dragon. One way this can happen is as part of the mundane process of growth, but souls - especially the souls of mortal humanoids, can also grow as they experience risk and achievement. When we die, our souls fall in a direction orthogonal to the earthly ones into a space where, in ages past, they dissolved into homogenous soulstuff. The god Firmament invented godhood as an intermediate step in creating the toolset that he needed to instead divert dead souls to his afterlives - the firmament central to his domain is specifically the homogenous soulstuff and more generally the substance of worlds like afterlives or fey-realms that run on the logic of soulstuff rather than the logic of matter. Outsiders are, as you say, the people in the afterlives, their bodies composed wholly of soulstuff, unlike the balanced harmony of mortals or the tainted improvisation of the fey. Though we normally distinguish between petitioners, who are just their own soulstuff give or take the damage from the death process, and other outsiders, who have absorbed the substance of their afterlife to become more than they were at the cost of parts of them not related to that ideal. You haven't described how you're structured on a spiritual level, so I can't say if that applies to you. Nothing good ever comes of trying to create epic-grade pawns to manipulate - that sort of luck and genius can't be reliably instilled and having a soul of that level of power naturally comes with great ability to resist manipulation, so they will most likely turn on you, or simply transcend you. If someone other than you bears the risks of ascending, then someone else will also have the power. As far as the differences between ascending for mortals and for outsiders - outsiders have another path to becoming an Imperial Power other than godhood, and many find it easier to become idle or safe in ways which preclude accruing the power needed to win conflicts with gods - and don't doubt, you're hardly the sort of legendary once in a generation epic hero who could actually plan a *campaign* to become a god, you need to be miles stronger to manage that. So very few outsiders become gods, so it goes. Mortals, who burn bright and grow fast and then take their rest, or a higher path of their duty, in the afterlives if they fail, are much more common." 

"Civilization doesn't guide their followers to Their preferred interpretation?"

Would shaping people according to Marra count for Forge? Sounds like no.

Torture already sounds pretty cool, actually. "What particular sorts of virtue and discipline does Torture or His priests encourage? Is there a church of Torture near here? Is it dangerous for me to approach with thoughts of overthrowing Him in my mind?"

Even mold has a soul, this universe is so bountiful! "Your description of outsiders and petitioners sounds very similar to what I'm used to, as does souls getting stronger. I'm not in a hurry to gain power; I'm not going to die of age, as far as I know.

What kinds of outsiders do petitioners become?" If she's not going to ascend for a while, if ever, her best goal might be to steer people towards her preferred afterlife, even if the mortal actions look contrary to Marra.

"There is politics involved - the theology is tied up in various national and imperial mandates, I think. You'd have to ask someone who pays more attention to contemporary geopolitics for details." 

"Torture mostly encourages obedience to the existing social hierarchy, with a thin veil over that of pragmatic martial and personal discipline. His priests are mutilated and tortured to prove their faithfulness. He lacks influence outside drow states, which we should be thankful we are not in one of, and so he would have no local true temple, though I would not be surprised if immigrants had constructed one or more shrines to him somewhere. Gods sometimes have some ability to detect hostile intent around their temples, but only very rarely does it apply to such abstract plans as opposed to immediate attempts at looting or harming followers. After all, what concern does a fisherman have for the possibility that minnows wish to usurp their ship? It is idle fantasy for nearly everyone at your power level or mine." 

"Not being in a hurry to gain power is the key impairment, yes. Death comes swiftly even to those ageless if they seek true power - few adventurers die in their beds." 

"The species of outsiders are more varied and numerous than the species of adventurers - to describe even the most common sorts would leave us here all day and the uncommon sorts all year, let alone true obscurities. The common theme is that you are growing in power by absorbing the nature of the afterlife in which you dwell, allowing it to bolster and replace your selfness, drowning you own distinctions and filling in your weakness with a purer self. One in the Mire who saw their sword-arts as thier best path to power might cut away ever aspect of themselves not used for swordplay to become a Cursed Blade, while one in the Shining City might become an angel devoted to the form of kindness they most enjoyed in life. As in all things, variation is the rule." 

Obedience to the existing social hierarchy, whatever it is? Hierarchies can be Good or Evil, Lawful or Chaotic, feudal or tyrannical or hardly enforced at all... But Kireh can set up cult that's Evil and Lawful and feudal.

"The priests - the people whose faith is not in question - are the ones need who prove it? Does Torture like that, or is it something the priests came up with to impress each other?" Ick, mortal status drives. "Overall Torture seems like a god I could profitably deal with, but not one I would devote myself to. I am utterly opposed to all forms of mutilation, physical or psychological." Gofiere marrenai are sometimes made out of pieces of souls, but it's the best option for some petitioners in a world where all outsiders lose most of themselves.

"Is there a list of afterlives and outsider types, or an expert I could hire to search for the type of outsider I prefer people to become, once I have some money? Is it possible to create new kinds of outsiders just by shaping souls towards a different core? Are souls shaped by gods and their vassals at all - it sounds like souls shape themselves without external guidance? Do gods care about the afterlives?

To be clear, if I traveled to an afterlife, I expect that nothing would happen to me, or that the nature of the plane would damage me. But I would not change into a different type of outsider, and would not grow in power since I am already a 'finished' outsider, fully soaked with infernal essence?"

"Devotion isn't a binary thing. You can always have more of it. Torture is not a good god to try and deal with. Are you aware that torture generally has an effect on the mind not unlike mutilation? Torture-Acolytes say this is a good thing but I'm fairly confident they're wrong." 

"Many scholars have spent their lives compiling such encyclopedias at varying points on the readability/specificity tradeoff. You should be able to find one at a library - the Order of Edification might even have one available to read for free in their public library. If not for free, certainly in the outer library. They, or another one of the adventurer's guilds, will have many scholars who can be hired for that sort of research work." 

"New kinds of outsiders are created all the time, for varying definition of new, in such a way, yes. Gods can shape souls if those souls are suitably vulnerable to this. It's a short-cut on actually studying whatever soul-shaping you'd normally do to get those powers, mostly. Understanding doesn't like it. But some gods consider, for example, granting healing skills to someone in a small town with no master-apprentice line of healers to be of sufficient use to bypass the distaste and expense, and apparently shaping souls to emulate your own nature and powerset on a mortal scale is - a very simple intuitive action, if you are an Imperial Power, so many lesser Imperial Powers bargain with would-be servants for power delivered in this way. Gods have lots of opinions about afterlives - many have private realms, or staging grounds, or similar, within the afterlives. The engines of divinity were first built as an intermediate stage of the process of constructing the afterlives, so many things relating to the afterlives are easy for gods. Finally, there is a process whereby weaker outsiders become stronger ones, while it is opaque to me, and I see no reason why it would not function for you."

"It generally mutilates the mind? ...I suppose that's true in my world, even not counting Hell. But you can avoid that with sufficient mind-reading, sufficient practice and occasional mind-reading, or sufficiently prepared subjects in a controlled context. For example, I will not be harmed by punishment from my superiors, because I know they will calibrate it to correct my mistakes and no further, and will not do permanent damage. I'm not afraid of their whims, because they're Lawful and bound by their duties to their subordinates.

At one point, I was afraid of lying or breaking rules. Now, I am not afraid. I simply cannot lie or abandon my duties. I suppose you might call that mutilation, if you're Chaotic, but I am glad to be shaped to be reliable."

"Wait, what's a priest, then? I assumed it meant a person who is given powers by their god, but that's something different?"

"I think most people would consider you pretty severly harmed by the process of achieving that mindset even if I assume that you're correct in your self-assesment on the matter, which, taking the outside view, you almost certainly are not. You yourself described your superiors as evil - why would you trust them with that amount of power over you? It's perfectly possible to do tremendous harm without lying or breaking rules, even if the rules were designed for harm minimisation and it really doesn't sound like they were." 

(It might be noticable, here, that the abbott is thinking of her as the victim of an abusive cult, and is responding to this with the best toolkit he has short of offering somewhere to stay which isn't a cult lair, which doesn't seem like it would help in this case, which is honest discussion about the cult's ideals and why you should do other things with your life. This has worked for him as many as several times in the past, and if people need unconditional comfort they should go to another temple.) 

"There isn't a precise definition of priest, or rather, it's a word refering to a wide array of titles, many of which are precisely granted and defined by relavent religious institutions, and many of which aren't. I'd say, it broadly speaking means someone who is deeply involved with the religious life of thier community, or someone who is professionally a member of a religious organisation, or someone who has dedicated thier life to a god in some other way. The details vary greatly. They often have blessings, but they just as often don't. Sometimes those blessings are predictable, and just as often they aren't. Some warlocks - people shaped by a greater power rather than thier own agency - are priests, but it's common to think of them as theological mercenaries at best, and the process is clearly distinguished from blessings in all cases. Especially since there are entities other than gods which can make warlocks."

"The rules are designed to make everyone Lawful, Evil, vain, feudal, paternalistic, obedient, awesome, and unique. Not to minimize 'harm'." Which is how you end up with Nirvana, ick.

"Rules can be bent; we do not bend them. To be precise, we follow the spirit of rules and agreements as they would have been designed and negotiated given unlimited time. My superiors are Evil because they cannot be guilt-tripped into doing things they didn't agree to, and Lawful because they will do the things they did agree to. I trust the system, the hierarchy, and Marra Herself, not the personalities of my other superiors."

"What do you know about the Lichocracy?"

That's an bizarre set of priorities but honestly he's seen worse. 

"And you've found yourself somewhere far from your superiors or the system in general, so now you're shopping for a new system to embed yourself in. I don't think you'll be likely to find one, with those goals. Few people establish laws with them being evil as an explicit priority. You either get people aiming for good things explicitly, or aiming for bad things by accident of their personal priorities. The Lichocracy is a good example, actually. They're a nearby regional power to our east, a city-state run by a senate consisting of any and every lich who chooses to attend senatorial meetings. Their government policies tend to be a mix of the helpful - those policies which maximise wellbeing and economic flourishing and so forth, and the foolhardy, which are motivated largely by the fact that the median senator is an adventurer and a Name-level mage, and thus cares more about taking risks and studying magic than good governance and is thus willing to divert funds to that. The powers of a country capable of aiming dozens of 6th and 7th circle casters at a problem if it really matters cannot be understated, though. ... also they are when they care to be, an extractive empire, though the things they want to extract are often tangential to the survival needs of the occupied people, which can lessen the suffering this causes somewhat."  

"I'm trying to find a place where I'll be safe, yes, but I'm not looking for a superior. I'm already a perfected outsider and I permanently belong to Marra. ... If She doesn't actually exist, or if there's no way to contract Her, I'll have to think about what I want to do, but I will not betray my duties to Her whatever I experience, whatever seems to happen in this apparent world.

My duties, and my personal goals, are more ambitious than personal safety. I want followers. I want to build my ideal society. I want divine influence, whether that means ascending or merely nudging an existing god towards my values. So I'm looking for a god who's already close."

Instead of perfecting the best, she might act more efficiently in the most boring Chaotic Good area she can find. This is not Marra's way, usually, because Marra tends only to Her chosen vassals and ignores the abjectly broken, and because it would hurt Kireh's own vanity to send her on a mission to a horrible place to improve it to a degree perceptible only with statistics and supposition. But the Lichocracy is Chaotic, Neutral or Evil, and awesome. If they have plenty of wizards who can read Kireh's mind, she can make actual Lawful deals with them. And the power of coordination might sweep through all the elites, which Kireh would certainly be vainly satisfied with...

"Does the Lichocracy post a local diplomat? Is the journey to it dangerous enough to require guards, such as I could be employed?"

"A local diplomat would require a local government, so they do not. When the Dread Wizard Zaxxor and the Grey Legion were in the city, they each had diplomats of all sorts following them, but you missed them by about two months. The Lord of Light did not, but historically the Lichocracy has sent diplomatic messages to the Lord of Light by undead bird or reanimated paladin, depending on how diplomatic they were actually feeling. Caravans almost everywhere require guards, if you're up for defending caravans as they travel places and letting someone else make the real profits." 

Reanimated paladin - she'd smirk if she had the muscles.

"To be clear, a paladin is a warrior with a blessing from a god aimed at identifying and fighting the god's enemies? They are honorable and self-sacrificing?

What dangers do caravans often face? I can prevent mutiny and detect ambushes, in addition to dealing simple violence."

"A common misunderstanding - a paladin is a warrior who has used spiritual arts to alter themselves such that they are irrevocably bound to the terms of one or more lynchpin oaths, with other powers flowing from that. Sometimes those oaths are a generic declaration of honour, heroism, obedience, etc, but not always. The gods who are skilled at shaping the souls of thier followers like to create them as reliable agents. The paladins of the god Civilisation swear to obey the laws and ethical principles of the Empire-That-Was."

"Ambush by bandits, monsters, or elementals are the most common risks by far. Those travelling by major roads are unlikely to encounter anything particularly esoteric." 

Ooh! "Where can I get information on creating paladins? Do their powers vary depending on their oaths?" Sounds like Civilization made a commitment to the laws of the Empire-That-Was when it still Was and is stuck now, which is evidence of Lawfulness. Or maybe Civilization shaped the Empire-That-Was to have Their ideal laws.

"What areas are near the Lichocracy and frequently send caravans there?" If she can't get a caravan there directly.

"I don't know of any specialists in writing paladin oaths and we don't have a local order, but I'm sure there are some paladins of some sort in the city somewhere. Powers do vary by oath, but there's a common core of supernatural resilience." 

"The regions south of the Lichocracy, such that you could reasonably travel there by land as an intermediate step, are the March of Teeth - gnolls, proud but poorly organised, the Free Realm of Kingfishers, holding out against the Lord of Light for now, and the Principate of Violets, who are largely occupied by the same, but who when free had a very good line in alchemy and leadership effects." 

"Is there a way to recognize paladins if I see them?"

Leadership effects! "Do they still teach leadership in the Principate of Violets?"

"Specific orders of paladins will have specific heraldry but there are no universal signs."

"I assume they do, occupations take decades to finish beseiging holdouts if they ever do, and the Lord of Light isn't engaging in conquest to wipe out regional specialities. Mostly, at least." 

"Okay, anything else you want to talk about?"

"I would like you to remember that, no matter how it feels from the inside, you always have options other than continued loyalty to an evil power. And I would like a detailed description of the signs and omens of your god for the records. But other than that, no."

"I'm not sure exactly what you mean by signs and omens. Her holy symbol is a blue knife crossing a red piece of wood, half whittled into a shape chosen by the bearer. She uses a fox Herself, which is Her sacred animal, but that's just symbolism - She can't control foxes or spy through their ears or anything. She is the only god in my world who gives my spell to read thoughts at a touch, but that would be easy to fake. She gives a small blessing to dedicated followers, which would also be easy to fake: each morning, if you think of three things you like about yourself, three ambitions, and three duties to focus on, and contemplate them while doing something painful, arduous, or otherwise requiring willpower (often involving your sacred dagger but that's not required), for the rest of the day you're slightly better at resisting fear, charm, and compulsion effects, except when legally inflicted by other followers of Her."

Back to the city to look for a caravan! "Seeking employment as a caravan guard to the March of Teeth, Principate of Violets, Free Realm of Kingfishers, or Lichocracy. Also available as a bodyguard, mind-reader, tailor, teacher, and other legal occupations." She keeps an eye out for brothels with staff resembling herself, martial art schools, and lawyers or scribes who might want mind-reading to verify agreements.