"What makes a use of power necessary?"

"Hmm. If - it is the only way to prevent crimes or harm. Tantara has a Guard to enforce the laws, and sometimes doing that takes, well, force. We would raise an army if there was a war and we needed to protect our citizens. ...And I suppose leaders have a useful role in coordination, asking for taxes is a use of power but it lets Tantara build new bridges and roads and such that serve everyone." 

"And someone has to decide where the bridges go, right? And someone has to mint coins and someone has to make sure we're getting along with the neighbors and someone has to fund schools if they aren't paying for themselves so people will learn to read, and someone has to coordinate weather magic and someone has to evaluate new ideas and see if they're worth public support and someone has to decide how members of the guard are trained... I think that sounds very different from being a warlord, I don't believe those mint coins at all."

Urtho chuckles. "Yes, it is certainly very different! The day to day work of running a country is - well, for one, it is done by hundreds of people, the King does not personally decide which schools get how much funding. And it is tedious and mostly made up of meetings and ledgers and committees debating the merits of different paint colours. The world benefits a great deal from people who are passionate about accounting and I am very glad I am not one of them. I - think that taking satisfaction in a job well done, in the endless essential details of holding a country together, is quite different from - enjoying power, per se." 

"So if a mage thinks being on committees and appointing ministers of education sounds fun that's probably very different from thinking being a warlord sounds fun and the real problem would be if one thought being a king was like being a warlord and tried to become one to make it that way?"

"In - very broad terms, yes. Though I think most who seek power do not call it that to themselves - it sounds like an ugly motive, after all, it sounds much nicer to say you want to - do great things, leave a mark, those sorts of things." 

Ma'ar definitely believes that Azabel is making progress here and he's very impressed and should ask her how she's doing it, later, when it won't distract her - but also he wants to SCREAM. 

:Does he not get that the point of trying to make a country better isn't whether it's fun?: he sends, even though probably Azabel's already noticed that on her own. 

:I might not get to that part today: "People who say that don't always mean politics, is that the only dangerous kind of mark to want to leave?"

"...Well, no, though I think it has greater risk of coming to like feeling powerful and renowned, since it involves parades and speeches in front of applauding crowds far more than, say, writing the next great treatise on Mindhealing. Also I am not claiming that wanting to - accomplish something great and important with one's life, is always bad, it can be a noble drive as well. It is just that...when doing large things, it is easier to do harm then good, even by accident, and so humility is very very important." He smiles slightly. "Even if one is only trying to be a great teacher, it is essential not to feel better than one's students." 

Aza giggles politely and sits back down. :I'm going to leave it there for now:

:If you think that's best: Ma'ar is still frustrated and also so confused but he's not going to interrupt. 

A few beats pass in silence and then some other student raises their hand and the discussion moves on. 

Azabel has done enough monopolization for now and has plenty of notes to go over and comb for loose ends after.

After class is dismissed, Ma'ar peels off with her. He's gotten the frustration calmed down at this point. :I still don't get what he actually believes, here? He thinks it's good to...do good things with power you have...but bad to want to be more powerful or try to get that way on purpose so you can do important things?: 

:I think he thinks a lot of people who want to do big things want to do bad things, or are bad at telling what things would be good, and the more and bigger things you want to do the bigger the risk of that:

:He could've just SAID that!: That fits and even kind of makes sense and he completely was not getting that from Urtho's explanation. :I - do you think he's right? I guess he could be right, just... I still want to fix Predain. No one else is doing it: 

:No, I think he's wrong, I just think it's easier to have that kind of conversation when I pretend I'm right about to believe whatever he says as soon as he answers my questions. He has like a little bit of a point where if you just charge in because you want things to be different and aren't careful and ready to learn a lot of stuff you'll probably break stuff?:

:...That does seem right. Things are really really complicated: 

:Yeah, and I think most people who think being a warlord sounds fun are not also appreciative of how complicated things are. Also maybe sometimes people think even sitting on committees and appointing ministers of education sounds fun, and then they try it and it's not but they don't want to go do something else, so they get sloppy and start throwing orders around to make problems go away and stop being annoying?:

:That's - just - none of it is about whether it's fun? It's about fixing things that're bad? And if you're trying a thing and it's not working or it's just making different problems instead then you notice and you stop and figure out why and do something else?: 

:I think probably he mostly runs into people who... want to do good things, but can't see themselves doing them forever if they aren't also at least kind of fun? I think I have that a little bit, like, I would dig ditches if for some reason that were REALLY the best way to do things but I would take a lot more convincing than I would if there were reason to believe the best way was reading books or being a queen or something cool like that:

Shrug. :I think digging ditches would be a bad use of a you and if that were the most important thing you'd be better off - making a lot of money by, I don't know, writing a book or inventing magic or some other thing you're really good at, so you could pay hundreds of people to dig ditches: 

:I mean, yeah, in real life, sure. It's a little convenient, isn't it?:

:I guess?: He seems confused by this claim. :I don't know, if for some reason I were the only one in the world who could dig ditches and it was really important, I - wouldn't mind... Honestly it sounds way less stressful and scary than being a King: 

:I think I would really like being a queen, not that I have an obvious way to do that without actually attacking people or something. So there's sort of a point there that I should think pretty carefully about whether also believing I'd be good at it is just wishful thinking: