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you gave me nothing at all
cam meets some fastfairies and the thread authors take no position on the presence of an adorable romance arc
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They observe some humans summoning a magical spirit one day. 

It's hard to tell all the details when you have to watch in shifts over the course of several weeks and when you can't hear anything they're saying, but the overall picture seems clear. First, their barn burned down. Then, they stood outside watching it sadly for a while. Then a woman went away into the forest, and wrote some things on the ground, lots and lots of detailed human words. Then a magical spirit appeared. Then the magical spirit walked back with her and replaced the barn and filled up the new barn with food. Then she had sex with the magical spirit. Then the magical spirit disappeared.

 

It makes sense, in the way human things often don't make sense. It seems like the kind of thing you could perhaps try yourself.

 

They carefully copy the human words onto the ground in a fairy circle. They carefully draw a circle in the dirt around the words.

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"- hello? - you know, summoning in languages you don't know isn't a best practice."

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There are three people watching him from the edge of the circle; all three of them jump delightedly to their feet. They're wearing really weird clothes -- blue and silky and shimmery and loose -- and sandals which might be made from leaves. 

"It worked!"

    "I told you it would."

"Hello!"

One of them steps into the circle to touch the wings. 

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The demon permits this with only mild surprise. "Leave the tail alone, please. You realize you can look up in any responsible source what media are known to be valid for circle-drawing and 'in the dirt' is not nearly as creative as people have gotten."

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"Oh, I can't read," the person who finished the circle assures him. He too steps in to touch the wings. "So I don't know where I could have looked it up, really. We were just copying some mortals."

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"- okay I'm not sure being outright illiterate makes it worse than just summoning in a language you don't know, but, uh, wow. What do you mean, mortals."

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They glance at each other. One of them nods.

"Mortals," the one who finished his circle says seriously, "are the slow people who live in towns and on farms and keep animals and cut down trees and die."

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"I don't feel very enlightened over here."

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"If you would like I could show you some mortals, as a favor."

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"I'm not sure that would be enlightening either. What are you supposed to be?"

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"We're faeries. Some people thought you'd be a faery, since you make trades and can contact the mortal world in circles, but you aren't, I don't think."

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"I'm a demon."

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For some reason this seems to slightly annoy the faery, but he nods. "Welcome."

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"I confess I'm not, uh, familiar with faeries?"

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"We'd noticed."

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"...did you, uh, want something, or is this just an experiment, or..."

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"I want to take you back to my court and show people! And you could make us a feast. Can you do that? Make feasts?"

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"I can, yeah. Your court?"

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"Faeries live in courts. Most of us do, anyway. If someone doesn't have a court then they'll run into trouble eventually and there'll be no one who really minds."

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"...you're not very good at explaining things."

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"Well, maybe when you meet my court you will understand what courts are."

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"Sure, let's try it."

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"Can you see the paths from here?"

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Cam looks around.

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The forest looks like a normal forest.

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"Nothing's obvious from here. I mean, I guess there's a fairly clear way in that direction for a while." Gesture.

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"Huh, okay. - mortals can't see them either but faeries can. I think if you eat our food you'll be able to, because that works for mortals. Want a berry?"

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"...this is setting off some alarm bells," Cam remarks.

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For some reason this statement seems to absolutely horrify the faery. He steps into the summoning ring and punches Cam in the face.

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Cam falls to the ground. "- excuse me?"

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The faery seems distressed in some way still, and kicks him. 

"There were not any alarm bells," he says indignantly after a minute.

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"Ow, cut it out - it's just an expression!"

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"You shouldn't say things that are not true."

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Cam can't read his binding, but manages to materialize a little bell and ring it. "Does this help."

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"...if you want to say that there are bells ringing and you ring the bell and then say there are bells ringing that'd be fine, yes."

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"So you'll stop kicking me now?"

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"When we're even. I don't think I'm hurting you very much or we would be already."

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"When we're what the fuck now?"

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The faery stops kicking him. "Even. For lying to me. I could've enslaved you."

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"I can't read this binding and neither can you."

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"Well if you can't read either then I don't know why you're lecturing me about it."

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"I can read, I just can't read this language. Neither of us knows what I'm stuck with, here, I made the bell just fine."

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"It's a very nice bell but you didn't give it to me so it doesn't actually help you at all here."

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"- here, do you want a fucking bell!"

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" - sure, all right."

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Cam gives the faery the bell.

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The faery takes it and takes a step back. "We still can't take you along the paths if you can't see them, I don't think. - maybe we could carry you?"

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"I'm not super sure I want to go anywhere with you since you just kicked me a bunch for translating an idiom."

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"Go back to the court and tell them about the demon," he instructs one of his friends.

The friend runs off. He - literally gets smaller as he runs, until he's weaving among sprouts of grass. The other faeries seem to find this unremarkable. 

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"- did he just shrink?"

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"Yes," the faery says, as if demons must be very dense.

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"I'm unfamiliar with this phenomenon."

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"Well, if you come to court, you'll get to be very small and maybe someone there will explain it to you."

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"How exciting."

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"When you can see paths, you can walk along them, and if they get very small, then you get very small."

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"What happens if someone tries to walk in the correct direction without being able to see the path, either because they do not have this magical ability or because they have been blindfolded?"

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"I mean, mortals walk around all the time and just stay big. I don't think a blindfold would be different but I haven't tried blindfolding a mortal. - there's a mortal back at court, I guess someone could try blindfolding her and walking her off the paths?"

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"How'd she get there?"

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"Well, we enslaved her after she came to this faery ring. Running away from a marriage she didn't like, I think, though I haven't talked to her."

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"Marriages are a thing mortals do. They give the girl mortals to the boy mortals and then they both promise not to run off with other mortals. Or with faeries."

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"That wasn't the thing at all."

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The faery shrugs.

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"Lot of slavery going on or is that just interspecies?"

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"Almost all mortal slaves are enslaved by other mortals, if that's what you mean? Most courts can't afford even one."

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"Yes, the economics of every mortal trying to afford a mortal slave would be awkward. But in fact that is not what I meant, I wanted to know about your, ah, court's slavekeeping practices."

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"Well, we're rich enough to afford a mortal overnight so we'll pick one up when they come here. That's not very often, though, maybe twice in a year? They don't live more than a couple of nights usually, a dozen if they're very stubborn, so you're kind of lucky that there's one here now."

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"I assume that if I say I feel indescribably fortunate you'll start kicking me again."

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"I'm not going to kick you if you lie again."

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"Why, do you need lots of bells?"

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"I'll cut out your tongue."

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"Does it count as lying if I say 'good luck' while confident you won't have it and not appreciative of the incredibly remote possibility?"

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"...if you said "I wish you good luck" I think you'd have a problem but if you said 'good luck' all by itself I don't think you would."

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"Good luck!" chirps Cam.

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The faery glares at him.

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"Why would you even bother cutting out my tongue? You can't reasonably think you're getting your feast at that point. It's a testament to my many personal qualities that I'm still up for that after all the kicking."

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"You have a lot of nerve, lying to me and then acting put upon that I tried to get even."

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"That's one of my personal qualities! But also you're incredibly confusing!"

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"I find you confusing, too! Who lies about bells?"

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"You have humans! Rumors of human idiom could conceivably have reached your ears even if you consider them exotic pets!"

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"Mortals lie a lot until you teach them to stop. It's not less bad because it's familiar."

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"I have had plenty of opportunities to observe that you're not deaf. I was obviously not trying to deceive you into believing there were bells."

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"I take it that's the only reason you can think of why it might be bad to lie to someone."

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"...assuming you are, in fact, clear on the fact that I was obviously not trying to deceive you into believing there were bells, yes, pretty much, how are you doing on reasons it might be bad to physically batter people?"

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"Violence against people you're indebted to is wrong."

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"How many bells before I qualify for basic rights?"

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"I want the feast."

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"Then do I get to talk without getting kicked?"

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"I won't kick you."

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"That's very specific."

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"It's what you asked."

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"I should probably stop relying on anything to do with your grasp of conversational implicature."

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"It's not my decision what to do with you anyway, not at this point. It's my court's."

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"Oh?"

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"I don't think they expected this to work or I'd have had instructions in the first place."

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"Oh?"

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"With mortals everything's planned out and there are people who know how to do it smoothly. I've only ever watched. They get them every time."

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"How?"

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"That's secret. ...I guess you could ask the one we've got now."

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"Maybe I will."

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"You still have to eat something so you can see the paths."

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"This wouldn't be part of the slavery process, would it?"

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"I mean, not more than everything else about this conversation, except the kicking you, which was helpful and yet you objected."

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"Fancy that."

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"And the bell," he adds thoughtfully. "I just took the bell because it seemed neat."

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"Enjoy."

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"That doesn't make it worth more, but okay."

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"Or don't, whatever."

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The other faeries come back. They have a cage. "We can take him to court in this," one of them says cheerfully. "If he doesn't want to eat anything."

"I'd rather you ate something," his summoner says earnestly. "It's kind of heavy and a pain to carry."

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"Should I assume that unless I unlock a hidden secret faery ettiquette code we are going to find out how thoroughly this circle prevents me from preventing you guys from sticking me in the cage?"

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It seems to take him a couple seconds to puzzle through that. "You can't fight us," he says when he has. "We already talked about this, hurting people you're indebted to is wrong."

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"I mean, that wouldn't be the first thing I'd try but I can't read this binding and you can't either."

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"Look, I thought you wanted to come see our court and meet our mortal."

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"It sounds interesting! I'd prefer to skip the slavery."

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"And your strategy to do that is to threaten to attack us?"

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"Do you have a substitute idea?"

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"Come back to court. Don't tell lies. Make them a feast. Then offer to make them more nice things in exchange for safe passage home."

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"Are there any more charming rules I should know about besides the lying one?"

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"Don't lie. Don't hurt anyone. Don't break any agreements. Don't - swear to things falsely? I really think this is pretty obvious."

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"Why the actual fuck do you think that?"

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"They're just very obvious."

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"Wow. Is there someone less stupid I can talk to about the options here? It'd be really great if they could read the circle but I'll settle for a three digit IQ."

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"Yep! At court."

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"- isn't that technically a lie since my question included the word 'here'?"

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"Oh, I thought you were referring to "my options here", like your options in this situation. Of the people here, I don't think they're supposed to talk to you. It makes the debts less manageable. They're here to get you in the cage if you can't be persuaded to work with us here."

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"Well, maybe you could go get someone who is prepared to talk to me, and I will... make bells or whatever... if that is called for? Or whatever turns out to make sense after someone who isn't you has explained matters to me."

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"We're supposed to bring you back to court."

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"Is someone gonna kick you if you don't?"

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"No, that's not one of the preferred methods of discipline when it's not an emergency because it's hard to be consistent about how much damage you're doing."

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"Your culture is fascinating. I think that given certain assumptions about the consistency of information density across languages and the number of characters in this circle? Your best bet at fulfilling your instructions is to go get someone who is any good at explaining anything."

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He can't actually follow that but it's not a lie. He sends one of the other people bounding off into the forest.

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"Anyway, I'm Cam, who're -"

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This prompts the remaining people to materialize sticks and attempt to club him with them while trying to drag him into the cage. 

For some reason.

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"Ow - hey - what the hell -" Being hit with sticks hurts, if not very much, and a bunch of people wrestling him is enough to make line of sight complicated.

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They start also attempting to gag him.

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"You know you mrf could have just traditionally done mgrrh!" he says.

- okay. What's the deal with this circle. Interpolation's a no. Fire's a no...

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Cage!

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He cannot interpolate the cage either. He starts trying exotic physics experiments irritably.

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They pick up the cage and start carrying it. They get smaller.

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Cam decides to stop short of trying drugging anybody just yet, since he's not sure how he'd get out of the cage if they all fell unconscious.

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In that case they'll make it uneventfully to - a rabbit hole. 

Inside the rabbit hole there's a city carved out, with bright lights, and music, and it doesn't smell that much either like dirt or like rabbits.

There are a lot of faeries. They peer at him curiously. Then they lever the chain up in the air so it floats and everyone can see him better.

Then they have a lengthy debate about what to do about him. The bell is thrown around and yelled about a lot.

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Yelled about how?

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Some people think the bell is really exciting and his eccentricities should be tolerated in order to get more things like it. Some people think the bell is very nice and all but he's clearly a menace to society and not worth the effort. Some people think the bell means that he will be worth more when they trade him to somewhere very far away. Some people think that they should give him as a present to their worst enemies and stand back and watch the fireworks. 

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Well, this is at least more interesting than his original plans for the day.

Can he make a violin?

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Yep.

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He will play, softly, keeping an ear on the conversation trying to figure out what's up.

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The violin is immediately the central topic of conversation. 

He's clearly too valuable to give up. He's clearly too dangerous not to. He's clearly trying to ENTRAP THEM WITH HIS EVIL VIOLIN PLAYING STOP HIM AT ONCE

The chain is lowered and people attempt to smash the violin through the bars, with spears.

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It's not an especially durable violin. "Mmmf mngh mg mff mgh mvvvf mn." He starts picking at the gag with his hands once he is no longer holding a violin.

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Well then they will have to open the cage and attempt to chain him up such that he can't do that!

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Can they possibly be wearing their own - not chains, ropes? He will stick to ropes.

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Doesn't work. They chain his hands to the walls of the cage and close the cage again.

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Cam sits in tail-lashing annoyance in the cage among the splinters of his violin.

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They have a more heated more panicked conversation about what to do with him. Eventually someone in charge says he'll be sent to some other court, by way of yet some other court, because the first court would be suspicious to get him directly but won't be suspicious at all to get him from an ally. They can throw in the human, too, for that matter; claim they got too many today and can't feed them all all night. 

 

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What, no feast?

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They lower the cage again and put a blanket over it.

There's some muffled yelling.

They open the cage and shove a naked human woman into it too. It's really not big enough for both of them.

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- can't make clothes for her. Poor lady. Blanket, can he do a blanket.

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She blinks bewilderedly at him. 

 

The cage starts moving.

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Come on, why can he do a bell and not a blanket - no, brain, it's clearly not about objects starting with the letter B, that's wrong on so many levels - is this an anti-interpolation protection, can he only make stuff midair? - there, blanket.

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She still looks bewildered but maybe now it's gratefully bewildered? She pulls the blanket close around her. 

"I don't - speak much faery -"

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"Mrrgf," acknowledges Cam.

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"They'll be angry if I take it off. -- could take it off and put it back when we stop, if we're fast."

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Nod nod!

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She attempts this. It is not very hard since it was put on in a hurry. 

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"Thanks," he whispers. "- what do you speak besides faery?"

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She says something that he might or might not recognize as tenth-century German.

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He can guess what it is but not really speak it. "I think your faery is better than my that," he apologizes.

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"You didn't look local."

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"I'm not. Language thing is a magic shortcut. What do I need to know about faeries?"

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Unhappy laugh. "They live in faery rings. You shouldn't go to them unless you're desperate. You mustn't lie to them, or tell them your name, and if you eat their food or ask them questions you will never get to leave."

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"- well, I avoided the food but asked lots of questions. Why can't we leave?"

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"Faeries track who owes who. If you owe them, then by their laws you belong to them. And even if you escape, the rest of the world will be slow. - to faeries the mortal world is slow. It takes a very long time for it to be night. Feels like months and months. And if you look at other humans, it's like they're standing still."

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"And that can't be fixed?"

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"No. Not while you owe them."

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"Do you know why they flipped out when I played violin?"

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"No. But I don't know all the rules. - also don't know what a violin is."

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"Musical instrument."

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"I think music does something. They play me music, sometimes. Don't know what, though."

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"What do they want with people?"

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"I don't think they're all the same. But the ones who don't want much from slaves just don't bother, because we're expensive to keep.

I don't know what they'd want from a man."

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"...ah. Why are we expensive?"

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"Faeries don't need to eat and we do."

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"Oh. I don't."

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"Oh. That's probably good for you I guess. If they say they'll stop feeding you if you keep crying you can just tell them that's fine."

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"- Do they not like it when you cry because it's... loud, or what?"

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"And annoying, yeah. And makes my face ugly. They thought it was interesting at first. I don't think faeries cry very much."

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"I'd believe that."

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"Do you know where they're taking us?"

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"They're giving us to another court because I freak them out and they want me off their hands, I think they're throwing you in as a bonus or you constitute a less suspicious explanation of why they're giving me away or something."

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"Oh. 

 

 

Okay."

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"Sorry, I have no reason to believe this will constitute an improvement for you."

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"When you're new it's hard because everyone's curious."

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"I guess that tracks. I'm not sure how much wherewithal I'll have to help you, I've got a different thing going on constraining my behavior."

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"It's okay. It's nice just to talk to - someone who's not a faery. 

And who's chained up. No offense."

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"None taken."

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She doesn't immediately have anything else to say.

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"You have a name? Or a nickname or whatever?"

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"They call me 'Mortal'. I don't - I don't even know if it's a good idea to remember the name I had before that, honestly."

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"Yeah, that seems reasonable, but, like, if there's another mortal around or anything."

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"I hope there's not. No one can feed two, supposedly.

You can call me Auda. It's my sister's name but she's dead so it should be safe enough."

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"If they have any sense they'll have me feeding you. I'm just... not sure they have any sense.

Call me, uh -" The German's old but not that old, the Bible's around, so not Revelation. Doesn't know if middle names count. "- Apsel for now, I guess."

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"Apsel," she says. "What'd you do to end up among faeries?"

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"Apsels - that's my species - can be summoned. A faery summoned me."

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"Oh. 

Well if you scared them probably they won't do it again, so that's good."

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"I suppose it is."

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She pulls the blanket more tightly around her and watches the ground pass underneath them.

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"Do you have a guess how far courts are from each other?"

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"Some border each other. But if they want to be rid of you they might want you to go to one that doesn't. I bet it won't be more than three or four days because I bet they won't have bothered to bring food and I bet they don't want to hand us off in terrible shape."

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"- hold out your hands and I can drop some food in them probably, I currently think I might have to make things in midair but I seem to be able to make some things."

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She holds out her hands.

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Roast beef sandwich.

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She eats it and stares at him wonderingly. 

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"Do you want more stuff, or anything specific -? You probably have at least five kinds of malnutrition but I don't have any of what I'd need to diagnose it specifically."

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"I don't - I don't know that I should eat more right now. The faeries have feasts sometimes but if I eat as much as I want I get sick. 

I could maybe drink something?"

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"- oh, yeah, don't wanna give you refeeding syndrome. Heck, what are the supplements for refeeding syndrome - phosphate and... I think multivitamins in general - yeah okay - do they give you enough to drink?"

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"Yeah. Water's free, and wine's not but sometimes they want you in more debt so they'll give it to you anyway, and they have these tasty sugar things sometimes. I don't think they wanted me to die. They said it was as likely as not in the night even if they fed me but I didn't die all night and they seemed pleased."

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"Okay, so don't have to go too hard on the electrolytes... catch." Bottle of apple juice with a bunch of vitamins in it, capped enough to not spill but not sealed.

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She opens it and makes herself drink it slowly and then gives the bottle itself a nervous frown.

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"- is that going to be a problem?"

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"They'll probably wonder? I don't know if they'll be mad. It's hard to predict what'll make them mad."

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"You can put it on my lap when we get wherever we're going, if you want, and I can refill it - probably, anyway, still working out the edges here - on the way as necessary."

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"That just means they'll be mad at you instead, and you've been so nice."

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"Yeah, but there's only so much they can hurt me, I'm indestructible."

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Hiccup. "That sounds nice."

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"It is, yeah. So pin whatever we accumulate on me if that seems like it'll help."

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Nod.

 

"Do you want anything? 's not much I can do here, but I could try - if there's anything -"

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"No, no, I don't need anything from you, I'm not a faery, let's not do faery bullshit, okay?"

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...smile. 

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Smile.

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After a while the cage stops moving. She gags him again. Someone pulls off the blanket. They're next to a big leaf heavy with dew.

They open the cage and let her get out and drink some and wash herself. 

"Are you going to attack anyone or talk or otherwise make us regret it if we take the gag off so you can drink?" someone demands of him.

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He has no idea how their lying thing interacts with being mistaken about a statement about his future actions; the fact that they didn't phrase the question to be about his intentions suggests that it's within tolerances, but these people do unfortunately appear to be stupid and evil, so. He doesn't need the drink. He nods irrepressibly at them.

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Well then they won't take the gag off. 

They notice the bottle and argue about it a little and then decide to keep moving as quickly as possible.

They reblanket them.

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Cam internally debates making his computer. He leans in Auda's direction to be degagged.

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She does that. 

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"Thanks."

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"There'll be a feast when we get there, probably. I was going to say you'll want to be cooperative for that because it's the best you'll eat for ages but I guess you can just make yourself things any time so maybe you can keep being scary then."

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"I'm not actually sure to what extent it'll be to my advantage to be scary, it'll depend on their - attitude, I guess."

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Shrug. "I've been to other courts a couple times and their feasts seemed mostly the same but I'm not - I haven't got wings, they know what I am."

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"Yeah, exactly." He tilts his head back and makes popcorn fall into his mouth.

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Giggle.

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"You can try some if you want."

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"Maybe one? They look so funny."

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One popcorn!

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It is crunchy and interesting.

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"If I'm right about where we are, that's made from a grain that grows all the way across the ocean west of here."

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"I never left the village I grew up in until I - ran away."

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"Say," he says, "do you happen to know what year it is?"

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"It's the year of our lord one thousand and thirty two. - that's since the birth of Christ."

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"One thousand thirty two, wow. Thank you."

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"He's been gone for a while. He was supposed to come back."

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"- I don't have any updates on that, sorry."

Permalink Mark Unread

"It's okay. I'm not going to live to winter anyway, even if I live old enough to have been a grandmother if I'd had any children. Because of how faeries are fast."

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Cam nods. "- do you think faeries can't get you pregnant, or that maybe you haven't been eating enough to get pregnant, or are they being careful on their end, or?"

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"Can't get pregnant fast. - and if you are, you lose the baby, which is - they told me about that in advance, it wasn't an accident or anything." She kind of cringes against the side of the cage.

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"- having to make things in midair really limits my options here, but I can give you some little things where if you swallow one as soon as you wake up or first thing before you go to sleep, every time, they will prevent you from getting pregnant in the first place - I'm just not sure they'd let you hold on to them and they stop working if you stop taking them -"

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"It's been more than a year that I've been here. I think they're right that you can't get pregnant when you're sped up like them, and I know they're right that if you speed up when you're already pregnant you lose the baby.

That's - neat, though."

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"It's pretty keen, yeah. I don't know, if they decide to let you go or it turns out I can buy you free with popcorn or something maybe stop and ask me for some of those before you go."

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Sad laugh. "Okay."

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"And a sack of gold. Or whatever."

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"A fancy dress. Men'll pay more if you have a fancy dress. Gold they'll just think I stole it."

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"- if that's what you want. I don't know a lot about current fashion though."

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"I can tell you. If it ever comes up."

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Nod nod. "I don't know a ton about your options if you get loose, I'm just assuming it's better than being a faery prisoner even if I'm available to feed you."

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"I hadn't really thought about whether it would be or not because it didn't matter much but I think if there was a way not to get pregnant then it would be. I could have friends, and a place of my own, and it wouldn't be dark for months at a time."

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"If I can buy you out with popcorn at all maybe I can get enough leeway or someone who can read the circle or something to figure out how to give you a more stable option than the pills - if you lose them or they get wet or anything that's it, but there's stuff you can have as an implant that just hangs out indefinitely."

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"It's a nice idea but I would be pretty surprised if they liked popcorn more than a slave. I guess I could act like I was sick and close to dying anyway."

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"Yeah, I have no idea what exchange rate I'm working with here."

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"Faeries don't make a lot of sense."

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"And they seem completely oblivious to it, too!"

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"I think to them we're making lots of obvious missteps which give them more latitude, and that's funny, and not really something to be prevented. I think they could explain themselves if they wanted to."

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"I kind of don't think that because they could have warned me not to give my name when I asked if there were rules I should know about. They didn't seem pleased to have it."

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"Huh. Maybe they're just stupid."

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"That's my theory. I mean, perhaps they vary."

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"Would it be any better if they gave us to smart ones?"

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"Depends how evil they are."

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She nods and stares at the blanket.

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"I can make you actual clothes, I just couldn't make them on you so I went with the blanket," he mentions.

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"They'd just take them off. At the feast. I think it's probably better if I don't seem - new. But thank you."

Permalink Mark Unread

"You're welcome."

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She closes her eyes. The cage trundles on. Eventually she falls asleep. And some time after that slumps over to sleep in his lap. 

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...he can't make a pillow between them and can't place one manually with his hands tied so he will just sit there, he guesses.

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When she wakes up she's briefly disoriented and then apologetically gets out of his way. "Do you not sleep?"

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"I can, but I don't have to, and this isn't very comfortable for it."

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Nod. 

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"I can make you a pillow next time but I couldn't put one under your head once you flopped over, sorry."

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"I didn't mean to inconvenience you. I don't usually share a sleeping space with anyone unless they want - anything."

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"I'm fine," he assures her.

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"You're very nice but I don't want to take advantage."

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"Making stuff doesn't cost me anything and it's mildly more interesting than watching leaf litter go by underfoot."

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"I guess I'd like something to eat, then."

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"Any requests?"

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"Not really. I'm supposed to eat as much fruit as I can, so I live longer?"

Permalink Mark Unread

"That sounds like the sort of thing faeries would conclude about human nutrition if they didn't start knowing enough about it to keep people from dying of scurvy." But here is a pear.

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"They were better than other courts at keeping humans alive. They bragged about it a lot. - I don't really know what that means about other courts."

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"Well, I suppose it could mean they're even worse at it and their humans succumb to marasmus first, or it could mean other courts kill them on purpose, who knows."

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Nod.

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When she's finished her pear he gives her some highly fortified cheesy bread.

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It's delicious.

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And in this way they may pass the time till they get to their destination.

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It's a couple more days. They actually get handed off to one group of faeries which gets instructed to deliver them as a gift to a second group of faeries. The cage gets swapped for another cage. They get worried about Cam not drinking anything and soak his gag with water a few times. They collect the suspicious materialized items.

 

And then finally they are delivered into another faery court. The blanket is taken off. This court is inside a hollowed fallen tree, but otherwise rather similar. 

The new faeries graciously accept these presents from the old faeries in repayment of the debt between their courts. 

Someone opens the cage, pulls Auda out, takes a look at the chains, decides not to pull Cam out too. 

The table is covered in food. There's music playing. 

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Cam makes a stereo.

It appears, but isn't playing, possibly because it's tiny, possibly because they're accelerated.

He makes headphones, not quite touching his head but with a sproingy enough headband that they snap onto his ears once they appear.

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This is noticed and causes some consternation. 

Someone tries to say something to him.

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Well, he can't hear them. And can't take the headphones off by himself either since his hands are chained up.

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They don't reach into the cage to remove them. 

People crowd around Auda, petting her or feeling her hair or trying to feed her food. 

Permalink Mark Unread

Suppose he drops a cage around anyone who gets close to her. He doesn't start by making them too heavy.

Permalink Mark Unread

That works fine!

It also causes some panic!

 

People will attempt to drag his cage away from the feast.

Permalink Mark Unread

He can put some heavy things in the cage to make that hard! Enjoy your collection of colorful iridium-cored bowling balls!

Permalink Mark Unread

That will sure make the cage hard to move. 

They, instead, toss the blanket over it and try to run.

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Heavy things with velcro on them can be appeared in such a way that most of them stick to the blanket and pull it down.

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Then he can see these intensely bewildered fairies trying to flee their feast. Some of them are trying to drag Auda away too.

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Cages for Auda-draggers!

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Auda ends up with both arms held by people who are now in cages and mad about it. She goes still. If she says anything, Cam can't hear it.

The fairies who are capable of fleeing do that.

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Well. Holding her arms isn't bad enough for him to do anything too drastic about it.

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There's quiet while everyone waits to see if any more cages will fall from the sky.

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Well, he's keeping an eye on things, but has not decided to cage people just for existing.

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After a moment someone walks into view. He looks around at everything and then looks at Auda. 

He says something. The faeries let go of her. He says some more things. 

 

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Cam still can't take off his headphones by himself.

He can place something sharp facing inward from the bars of his cage and slice this stupid gag off, though!

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Then he won't be able to follow any of this conversation. 

 

After a while Auda walks across the room towards the faery.

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"Hey, I can't hear what you're saying to get her to go over to you right now but I'm gonna be pissed off if she disappears never to be seen again or to have a haunted look on her face or anything like that!"

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She jumps.

He nods.

They talk some more. Then someone walks her into one of the little doors on the sides of the tree trunk.

He walks over to Cam.

He pulls the headphones off. 

"If no one has explained to you how faeries work, I'd really appreciate it if you'd let me do that before you say anything. It might have unexpected effects. If you say something dangerous the human girl will get hurt and I can't protect her from that."

Permalink Mark Unread

Cam is listening attentively!

Permalink Mark Unread

"Don't tell me your name. This is most important for the first name your parents gave you, or for the first name you got some other way if your parents didn't name you, but it goes for all names to a lesser degree. Don't say things that aren't true, even illustrative stories. There's a way to do that safely but for now just don't do it. Don't break promises. If you have made any promises you should probably tell me that, first."

Permalink Mark Unread

"I don't believe I have made any promises since encountering faeries but I'm a hundred and seventy two years old and have in that time ever said I promised something."

Permalink Mark Unread

"I have never heard of mortals having problems that had to do with promises they met before they met faeries. 

For faeries, and people entangled with faeries, the universe punishes misconduct. Lying, breaking promises, violence against people you're indebted to. The punishment is usually immediate, but not always, and usually not lethal, unless the incident was unusually bad. It affects you and everyone who is in your debt, or vice versa, or who knows your name, or vice versa. I assume you knew some of that because you only caged the people you were angry with. But had you attacked them, everyone here would have been hit very hard, including the human girl."

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"You know, if the first faery had explained things that well we would have gotten along so much better. But you're mistaken - while I did know some of that, mostly from her, I wouldn't go around dropping cages on people who were behaving fine regardless? Because why would I do that? That has nothing to do with technical debt, since I don't know enough about where it's accrued."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Caging people you're indebted to is - well it causes a lot of problems but the universe does not parse it as an attack and so it did not cause the universe to smite us all. I'm grateful for that, even if it was entirely luck. Do you mind if I get them out now?"

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"My earlier statement about being pissed off if I can't verify the human's at least loosely adequate treatment stands, otherwise I don't mind."

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Some more people come in to effect this. 

"I'm hoping if you're not gagged this can get cleared up before anyone gets a cage dropped on them?"

Permalink Mark Unread

"Probably! Talking does keep having unexpected consequences but maybe this time you've been thorough enough!"

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Nod. "I'm curious who sent you here. I don't think they meant us well. But it wasn't the people who brought you in, I'd have noticed."

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"Yeah, they sent us through a different court so you wouldn't be suspicious. I don't know how to identify them to you."

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"Huh. How long did you travel?"

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"She fell asleep four times."

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"And you?"

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"Don't have to sleep."

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"That's convenient. Supposing I wanted to keep you here what sort of place would you want to be kept in."

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"I don't feel like I have enough information to answer that question in a way that won't turn out to have been misleading."

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Nod. "If the human has travelled for four days it's not safe to put her back in a cage to go lob off on someone else, even if I wanted to do that. So it would be useful to figure out how you both can stay here without this routinely endangering or terrifying my people. I don't have any idea what you're capable of or what'll provoke you."

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"I have a roughly human psychology but am unusually scrupulous among the category and even if you've met a human who has explained humans to you in the past I'm from a very different cultural background. Unsafe how?"

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"Good odds of dying of something along the way or shortly after she arrives."

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"Why?"

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"I think a contributing factor is that humans need to eat quite frequently. But we've never had one, so I don't know for sure, I just know the advice not to keep them in a cage for more than five or six days."

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"I was feeding her, but it will in fact be bad for her health in other ways if you keep her in a cage, yes."

Permalink Mark Unread

"So I can't just find some people I hate and ship you off to give them a headache. Which is fine, but it means I need to figure out what I can safely do instead."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Personally, I think I'm very easy to get a good deal out of, but it being easy might rely on my trading partner not being a moral abomination or whatever is going on. I suppose it's possible I'd be just as appalled by a bunch of humans around here if I wandered off and met some."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Strong language for touching a human we didn't even know you wanted."

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"The kind of logic you just employed is precisely the nature of the moral abomination, actually."

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"I'm afraid you're going to have to explain more."

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"I perceive her to be in her own right as an individual entitled to certain basic treatment such as not being groped by people she has not expressly invited out of her own intrinsic motivation to so grope her, and further consider this entitlement inalienable such that nothing you've finagled about playing music or receiving her as chattel or whatever the hell infringes on it, and neither does anything she's construed to have done. I also consider her to have additional rights beyond those by default that in theory she could be dangerous enough to warrant infringing on, which maybe the whole misfortune business constitutes, if - can I use non-literal figures of speech if I preface them with 'metaphorically'?"

Permalink Mark Unread

"Meaning you're making some kind of analogy? Yes, you can do that."

Permalink Mark Unread

"If I metaphorically squint."

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"You consider it very important that nobody gropes anybody ever, if they didn't specifically ask for it?"

Permalink Mark Unread

"Groping is the salient example, not the only thing in the category, but, uh, approximately. There are non-'specifically-asking-for-it' ways to invite it, like, I don't get on people's cases if they have long-term consenting partners and their relationship therewith involves occasional unannounced ass-grabbing."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Have you got a list of all of the things in the category?"

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"Not handy, but if you really want I can attempt to get some written references and try to turn them into something like a comprehensive list."

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"I would really want that, yes."

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"This might take me some doing because this thing didn't work and that has some implications," he kicks his speaker where it is slightly dented among the bowling balls, "and would be easier if my hands were free."

Permalink Mark Unread

"I have some hesitations about freeing you before I have the slightest idea what's liable to anger you."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Well, I suppose you could attach my feet to something before letting my hands go, if for some reason you think my threat potential is located in my ability to move around the room."

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"Right now our worst case scenario is that the survivors head out to another court that I have reason to think will take them. If you can move, it gets worse."

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Cam waves a foot in his direction.

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He gestures at someone to his side. "Tie him up." And to someone else, more quietly, "tell everyone that my recommendation is that they go to their rooms alone and not do anything or touch anything and certainly don't interact with each other."

Permalink Mark Unread

"I'd love to tell you that's ov- metaphorical overkill but maybe the very first kind of all that that someone would think was definitely okay would in fact qualify as a war crime under the Geneva Convention."

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"The thing you objected to is something I have never heard of anyone objecting to. It does not strike me as obviously in a different category than talking, or than looking at people, or than touching something that belongs to someone else, and I don't know what you think of any of those things, and it's honestly frightening to admit that they occur here because maybe you will get very mad."

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"Then I guess it's not metaphorical overkill."

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Nod.

 

They chain up his legs.

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He tolerates this patiently.

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And free his arms.

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"The Geneva Convention is in fact mostly about warfare, which isn't exactly applicable but if I mix it up with rules for treatment of criminals might do." He conjures some papers and starts leafing through them. "I'm also going to have to translate everything, I hope there isn't some intractable language gap..."

Permalink Mark Unread

"I hope not."

Permalink Mark Unread

 

"Wow is the Geneva Convention ever not set up to have useful definitions for morally abominable faeries, it's probably not going to be useful at all if I tell you that civilians are entitled not to be subjected to 'cruel treatment', is it."

Permalink Mark Unread

"I could tell you what my guess about that would be?"

Permalink Mark Unread

"Might usefully triangulate."

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"If I heard that some court took a prisoner for - inadvertently stealing from them, say, and then they beat the prisoner nearly to death and fed him while he healed so that by the time he'd recovered he was in enough debt they could beat him nearly to death again, then I would say that they were being cruel."

Permalink Mark Unread

"It might be useful to consider that these rules were developed by and for humans, for whom food is not optional and debt is not magical."

Permalink Mark Unread

"I don't have much of any idea about what humans consider cruel. We meant to feed this one and give her to someone who wants to learn mortal languages and make sure she knew the rules and not punish her as long as she followed them."

Permalink Mark Unread

"That doesn't obviously sound like a problem depending on the rules but doesn't explain the groping."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Well, we don't think that's wrong, so people will do it if they want to. I - she didn't even object, I'm not sure what rule we could've been using to conclude we could feed her if we didn't touch her."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Well, you can put food near her and tell her she may have some, and it's much harder to do that with putting your hands on somebody. Her experiences among faeries include people thinking it was fascinating when she cried so if I were her I'd certainly have learned not to visibly object to things as fast as possible!"

Permalink Mark Unread

"So is the human definition of cruel treatment something like - 'any interaction they don't invite' -"

Permalink Mark Unread

"There are things humans can ethically spring on one another. There are even lots of them! Your oversimplification will not give you too many false positives eeeexcept then we might have to define 'invite' in unfortunate amounts of detail since it matters what consequences they can expect from inviting or not inviting things."

Permalink Mark Unread

"That occurred to me but I don't see how to insulate humans from the consequences of any choices they make without, like, making it pretty hard for humans to have any effects on the world or any interpersonal relationships."

Permalink Mark Unread

"It has occurred to me that I could probably make enough food or whatever to buy her off you and get her sent home if that's a thing you can do. It seems real likely that people who need to eat should just not live here."

Permalink Mark Unread

"We can send her home. If she invites that. Without anyone having suggested that anything would be affected in any way."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Offering to do things for people is usually fine and in this case is probably the best you can do. How much food or whatever are we talking about here."

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He gestures at the feast. "Around this much? Preferably not in this form, we'd want something we could store for when we want it."

Permalink Mark Unread

"That's doable. I'd offer to tell her the good news myself but I am chained to a cage which someone has filled with bowling balls."

Permalink Mark Unread

"If she agrees when someone asks her then they can also ask her if she'd like to come back here."

Permalink Mark Unread

"I was going to send her off with some presents if I managed to get her out."

Permalink Mark Unread

"They can also ask her whether she would like any presents."

Permalink Mark Unread

"They should probably specify that they are from me and not someone whose presents are evil faery crap."

Permalink Mark Unread

"We're not evil. But I'll tell her where the presents are from."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Preeeetty sure her last court raped her a bunch."

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He takes a second to figure out that his face should look disapproving but then it looks disapproving. 

Permalink Mark Unread

"That's one of those things that humans list right next to murder when listing bad things."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Having sex with people?"

Permalink Mark Unread

"That both parties do not want. We also had a really long and heated cultural argument about whether it counts as wanting it enough if you're getting paid!"

Permalink Mark Unread

"I was not being too conservative about what to tell everyone."

Permalink Mark Unread

"I did come to that conclusion, yes. The cultural argument eventually came down on the side of voluntary transactions being fine, incidentally, but that was after no one really needed the money to eat."

Permalink Mark Unread

 

"I think faeries might be importantly different from humans in some ways."

Permalink Mark Unread

"I have not actually gone on a rampage about any faery-on-faery treatment."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Wasn't sure if that was just because you hadn't seen any. Okay. Having sex with humans when they don't want it is very wrong as humans think about wrongness. - is the touching thing related to that?"

Permalink Mark Unread

"Yup. It's okay to like, tap people on the shoulder to get their attention, but being all over somebody like that is basically Rape Lite. To be clear I'm sure there are ways faeries can treat each other that I also hate but I'd be way less quick to jump to conclusions about it."

Permalink Mark Unread

"There are kinds of sexual interactions that faeries consider unethical but it's not 'most of them'."

Permalink Mark Unread

"If the sexual interactions faeries are having where at least one party does not like that it is happening is 'most of them' that seems like it sucks for a lot of people a lot of the time but maybe for you it is the equivalent of someone taking your parking space or asking if you have a moment to discuss the environment."

Permalink Mark Unread

"I don't know what a parking space is but I think I would be very distressed if I had one and someone took it, considerably more distressed than I can imagine being if they had sex with me. The environment seems like a fine topic of conversation."

Permalink Mark Unread

"A parking space is a location in which one stores a vehicle; taking it is pretty impermanent since the offending vehicle will eventually leave even if you don't get into a confrontation about it. The people who ask others if they have a moment to discuss the environment are not making conversation, they're rallying support behind their favored policy proposals. I am using references you will not get as a replacement for sarcasm."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Sex settles a lot of debt. I think probably people have more sex to settle debt or in the context of a relationship with debt than they have sex with people they were previously even with, with the intent of staying at even, and it sounds like with humans not even all of the latter category would be all right but it's the only kind that might be."

Permalink Mark Unread

"I don't actually think your concept of being even maps usefully onto anything humans do, even though it can make use of some vocabulary humans use to talk about finances and revenge and stuff. Maybe lots of sex in the context of a relationship with debt is fine, because debt is not the thing I'm gating on, the thing I'm gating on is a mental state of interest or disinterest. Maybe even a lot of the first kind is fine, it just relies somewhat more heavily on you being psychologically inhuman."

Permalink Mark Unread

- nod. "Well, I think it's fine? If we get another human we'll be careful with them, now that we know."

Permalink Mark Unread

"I'd recommend seriously considering just getting them all sent home earliest feasible, since apparently they're still going to be in trouble for having nonmagical metabolisms if they stick around."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Most humans know what faery rings are. They usually only show up if things are pretty bad at home. There's a war and the winning army's slaughtering all the men taller than this, say -" he gestures around chest height - "or they're dying of some sickness or they're to be hanged for poaching or their husband killed one of the children and they're scared for the others..."

Permalink Mark Unread

"- do you have reason to believe it's really height and not that they're sparing little children? But yes, there are certainly also very bad situations humans can be in among humans. It would probably be hard for you to unambiguously improve on them especially the one where they show up with their remaining children all of whom also have nonmagical metabolisms but maybe you can figure it out."

Permalink Mark Unread

Nod. "I realize there's still a lot here I don't understand but - it seems odd, if someone comes to us because they'll otherwise die, to turn them away because without sex they can't manage the debt for food. Instead of asking them."

Permalink Mark Unread

"I mean, if you talked to the sort of human I'm accustomed to and you were like 'this gig involves the following sexual services on thus and such a schedule', that'd probably turn out okay - I expect people around here to be more fragile in ways they don't know as much about, but it could maybe still work."

Permalink Mark Unread

He frowns. "That makes sense. I think."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Hm?"

Permalink Mark Unread

"There's kind of a lot to figure out here and one of those things is how someone could be wrong about whether they want to have sex regularly rather than die in a war, but I can think of some ways they might."

Permalink Mark Unread

"There are various ways."

Permalink Mark Unread

"They can have not tried it before and not know what it's like or be one of those people who gets morose at night and finds it harder to make themself do things or they could have been unimaginative about what people'd want or they could actually like dying and just not have realized that they would."

Permalink Mark Unread

"By the way, some of the people who get morose at night are probably deficient in a vitamin which can be acquired in the diet by eating egg yolks, fish, and certain fungi. I do not think the liking dying one is a major factor."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Huh! We can look into that. Mostly fungi, it's hard to interact with slow animals."

Permalink Mark Unread

"I don't remember which fungi and am currently impaired at looking things up since electricity seemingly doesn't work while I'm fast or while I'm tiny, one or the other. Or both."

Permalink Mark Unread

"I don't know what electricity is so I can't help you there."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Like lightning but made to do useful work."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Lightning affects fast things." He frowns. "Usually I'd refer you to our scientist but he's slow doing an experiment right now."

Permalink Mark Unread

"I'm optimistic that I can stick around since you're so receptive to explanations and vice-versa, so maybe I will still be here when he's done."

Permalink Mark Unread

Someone comes up to them. "The human accepts an invitation to be slowed back down and an invitation to talk with him first."

"Oh good! Bring her in."

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Tailswish.

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They found clothes for her; odd shimmery obviously magical fairy clothes. She looks anxious. The faeries step out of her way. 

"You wanted to talk to me?"

Permalink Mark Unread

"I'm gonna make them a bunch of food and have them send you off, if that's okay with you."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Oh. Uh, yes. I think so. I guess if it's worse I can always come back."

Permalink Mark Unread

"I guess! I have been explaining to this faery here how to be not so evil and he seems not to be one of the stupid ones, so that seems like a more viable plan than it would otherwise. That dress is very fancy but possibly not the kind of fancy dress you had in mind?" He turns to Not Stupid Faery and says, "Do you have anyone handy who can read what I'm hoping is local writing?"

Permalink Mark Unread

"I'm literate in our language but not the mortal one. Get my father's son," he tells one of the nearby faeries, and they scurry off.

Permalink Mark Unread

Cam makes a copy of his circle. "This will hopefully tell me whether I can do better than the pills I mentioned," he tells the human.

Permalink Mark Unread

"What do you need."

Permalink Mark Unread

"I need you to read the mortal language."

Permalink Mark Unread

"There's an impediment to that."

Permalink Mark Unread

Sigh.

Permalink Mark Unread

"I can read your language but I only have guesses about how it's spoken," he says to the human. "I want you to teach me. Then I'll be better-equipped to translate this."

Permalink Mark Unread

The human looks like she has not the slightest idea how to navigate this.

Permalink Mark Unread

"The thing I actually need is to know what it means," Cam says.

Permalink Mark Unread

"I really really want to know how the mortal language is spoken. I've wanted this for thousands of years. And there is a mortal right here who speaks it and you could send her home in three days and at that point I'll gladly help you."

Permalink Mark Unread

Sigh. "Are you picky about it being this mortal language?"

Permalink Mark Unread

"Well this one would have a lot of advantages if we meet any mortals but I guess other ones would also be interesting?"

Permalink Mark Unread

"I know lots of mortal languages."

Permalink Mark Unread

Sigh. "Okay."

He looks at the binding.

"It says that the demon shall not, except in the context of a negotiated deal, make a weapon, a poison, a fire, anything that touches a person or intersects a person or an object, or anything smaller than an ant or bigger than a dog. It says the demon cannot move except to remain within ten feet of the summoner. It says the demon cannot make something harmful to a nearby person. It describes how deals work."

Permalink Mark Unread

"- okay. I think that probably does actually let me perform surgery but not to create surgical instruments. Awkward. Also I don't have my reference materials and have not practiced actually performing surgery by hand. Also that part about not moving is real inconvenient."

Permalink Mark Unread

"What surgery is this?"

Permalink Mark Unread

"She would like to go back without getting pregnant. Do you think you can keep the pills safe?" Cam asks her.

Permalink Mark Unread

"Probably for a while. Probably not for ...ten years? Fifteen?"

Permalink Mark Unread

"How old are you?"

Permalink Mark Unread

"I don't know how long I've been here but I was seventeen when I arrived."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Then it might be way longer than ten or fifteen years before you can't get pregnant at all. Maybe you can leave a cache of them somewhere and come get more occasionally?"

Permalink Mark Unread

She nods.

Permalink Mark Unread

"If you can feed her it's not at all obvious to me that she shouldn't just stay here? If this is a pressing concern, I mean."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Do you have a preference?" Cam asks her.

Permalink Mark Unread

She seems to find it kind of hard to speak with this many faeries around. 

 

"I want - 

- I want to be slow but with a way to support myself and I've only the one and I don't want to get pregnant and it wouldn't be so bad being fast if I didn't have to do anything but I think people will get very tired of that and I shouldn't overstay my welcome."

Permalink Mark Unread

"- what way would you like to support yourself if you could have any such way?"

Permalink Mark Unread

"If I were a man, you mean?"

Permalink Mark Unread

"I may be underestimating the extent to which you can't expect to go set up with a spinning wheel turning wool into yarn on your own?"

Permalink Mark Unread

"I don't know what that is. I could join a nunnery but I think they mostly don't take whores."

Permalink Mark Unread

"I'm not clear on their membership policies. Has the spinning wheel not even -" Sigh. "Is there even anything in it for you besides the ability to use her as a language tutor, to keeping her around?" he asks the faeries.

Permalink Mark Unread

"It's kind of a prestige thing, having a mortal?"

Permalink Mark Unread

"Do you prefer being their prestige thing who they are now I think clear on not having sex with, and relying on me for food, and teaching this guy... German? Is this German?... in exchange for any bonus stuff you happen to want that what I make does not cover for you?"

Permalink Mark Unread

"I guess? If I change my mind will you slow me down, later?"

Permalink Mark Unread

"I do not personally have this expertise but I can make lots of food." He looks faeryward.

Permalink Mark Unread

"I expect we can do that."

Permalink Mark Unread

"And that you will?"

Permalink Mark Unread

"I also expect we will do that if we can."

Permalink Mark Unread

Cam looks at the human.

Permalink Mark Unread

The human seems to clearly think that these decisions are supposed to be made by more important people. "I guess I'll stay."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Cool. Please let me know if you need anything or if faeries do faery bullshit to you."

Permalink Mark Unread

"I can set you up with adjoining rooms. If you don't prefer to stay out here, which I guess you might since you can't move."

Permalink Mark Unread

"I can't move! It's exc- it's annoying! I can probably make myself a wheelchair but somebody's gonna have to plop me in it and wheel me around. It may make sense to track down my summoner and convince them in some way to assign me a task that includes moving around."

Permalink Mark Unread

"I certainly intend to find the people who sent you here to me."

Permalink Mark Unread

"That sounded really ominous!"

Permalink Mark Unread

"I mean, yes? They expected you to try to attack us, which could have killed everyone here."

Permalink Mark Unread

"I'd like to register my disapproval for starting wars in general, and also more particularly, if you kill my summoner, I will disappear home, where I will probably resume my sarcastic ways even if I try for a while not to do that."

Permalink Mark Unread

"I don't start wars. - and that's good to know. Thank you."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Okay, I also register my disapproval of construing wars to have been started when you could choose not to do that and not have a war instead."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Among humans when someone tries to murder a lot of people what do they do with the person who tried that?"

Permalink Mark Unread

"Where I'm from they typically lock the human up. As an individual. I think that your whole - shtick - makes it really hard to treat people as individuals, which I expect to mean that responding that way even to murder attempts results in outright war."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Not responding to murder attempts results in more murder attempts, and eventually one of them will succeed."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Is there some reason why someone may have attempted to murder you?"

Permalink Mark Unread

"I have guesses but none seem likely. We don't have any declared enemies."

Permalink Mark Unread

"This wasn't a competent murder attempt. They didn't take any steps to stop us from spilling the beans about the intermediate court, they didn't assess my actual inclination to attack people with anything resembling due diligence..."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Yes, I agree with that assessment. A panicked spur-of-the-moment murder attempt which still could've killed us all."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Which was prompted by finding themselves in possession of a me they didn't know how to handle and not by a premeditated desire to get you dead."

Permalink Mark Unread

"They chose me. They must have expected I wouldn't retaliate. That's not a reputation I can afford to have, much less afford to reinforce."

Permalink Mark Unread

"And your magical debt system doesn't let you go 'ah, one murder attempt, that will be five thousand hamburgers please'?"

Permalink Mark Unread

"I don't want to be entangled with people that stupid for one second longer than I need to and I doubt they have the resources on hand to pay me off. There'd still be reputation concerns but if they can actually afford it - I'd consider it."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Can I pay for them if they can handle the appropriate reassurances on how likely they are to repeat the attempt?"

Permalink Mark Unread

"If you want them in your debt, I guess."

Permalink Mark Unread

"- god but this is stupid. Can I then assign arbitrary value to something stupid so they can get out of that after the ten seconds it will take for me to stop enjoying the role reversal."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Not really, no. I'm confused about why you object to us settling this among ourselves."

Permalink Mark Unread

"They are stupid! They are assholes! I do not think people should die for being stupid assholes and you've really failed to reassure me that actually you aren't going to kill them just make them do an embarrassing dance of shame or something!"

Permalink Mark Unread

"Mortal, you said you were with them for more than a year, subjectively?"

            She jumps at being addressed. "Yes, sir."


"That's pretty long. They must have had mortals before."

           "Yes, sir."

"Did they say how often they got them?"

          "I don't know. There'd been another one in the winter who didn't live long, I think. Sir."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Yeah I'm not convinced that's actually exceptional misbehavior for a faery court."

Permalink Mark Unread

"It's not. But if we stopped them then it'd stop."

Permalink Mark Unread

"This would be a pleasant side effect of your extremely unspecified revenge plan."

Permalink Mark Unread

"I would need to know more about what exactly happened and the structure of their court but I think probably I would execute about three people and keep another dozen in the dungeons for a while and slow a dozen more to weave some things for us until they'd paid their debts and trade out or reassign everyone else."

Permalink Mark Unread

"God. What distinguishes dungeon crowd from weaving crowd?"

Permalink Mark Unread

"Which arrangement seems like less of a liability and whether I might need to have them around to make a point."

Permalink Mark Unread

"To make a point? You give a lot of dungeon tours?"

Permalink Mark Unread

"Apparently not enough of them or they'd have sent you somewhere else."

Permalink Mark Unread

Sigh.

Permalink Mark Unread

"This is the course of action I'd have chosen if you weren't here, and it's far more generous than the typical response to a court attacking you unprovoked."

Permalink Mark Unread

"What's typical?"

Permalink Mark Unread

"Lots of courts have a policy not to spare anyone if they win a war unless the member in question communicated their intent to sit it out before it starts."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Can they do that? Declare intent to sit it out?"

Permalink Mark Unread

"Yes. Of course, then you're betting pretty hard on the other side, because yours won't be pleased with you if they win."

Permalink Mark Unread

"God." Cam thwacks his speaker. "Wish electronics worked. I could - show you things. Haven't had a war in a long time."

Permalink Mark Unread

"We haven't either."

Permalink Mark Unread

"I mean the entire civilization."

Permalink Mark Unread

"That's impressive."

Permalink Mark Unread

"The humans you have had available as examples are not exactly paragons but it gets better than that."

Permalink Mark Unread

"I want that. I really do. A world without war sounds like a wonderful thing to me and if I saw a path towards it I'd walk it. 

If I predictably ignore assassination attempts I will be dead before the mortals have had ten more winters to get better."

Permalink Mark Unread

"I have ever read anything about game theory. Just. At some point for all the wars to stop somebody has to go to bed all grumpy feeling like they could really have used the last word. Against some stupid assholes who did something they really shouldn't have."

Permalink Mark Unread

"I'm not grumpy that they tried to murder my family I'm terrified. 

 

I haven't been to war in seven thousand years, I can swallow my pride when that's the problem."

Permalink Mark Unread

Sigh.

Permalink Mark Unread

"I won't do anything this day, all right? Let's get you and Mortal set up somewhere comfortably and then we can discuss this more later."

Permalink Mark Unread

"All right."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Should we carry you or did you have a kind of chair you wanted to make -"

Permalink Mark Unread

Cam produces a wheelchair. On the floor, since apparently it's not "in midair" it's "touching people". "There are some I might, depending on how this binding snugs up, be able to pilot independently, but unfortunately they're all electronic."

Permalink Mark Unread

"We can assign someone to it. Or Mortal might want to do it, she feels safer around you anyway."

Permalink Mark Unread

"I suppose I don't actually know if this thing isn't working or if it merely isn't producing appropriately magically fast sound."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Well, a similarly slow wheelchair doesn't sound that useful either."

Permalink Mark Unread

"It sort of depends on how it plays out! I will have to try more things. I suppose I should switch this off in case it's just blasting demonic music into the woods." He turns it off.

Permalink Mark Unread

"Would you like us to lift you into it?"

Permalink Mark Unread

"Yes please."

Permalink Mark Unread

So they do that. And then while the design of the interior of this hollow log is not actually ADA-compliant they can steer him to a little door where there are two bedrooms and a room with a bathtub. "And you two can have a little bit of a break, since this must've been a lot."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Yes, thank you."

Permalink Mark Unread

He closes the door.

Permalink Mark Unread

"You want any stuff for your room? Something to eat?"

Permalink Mark Unread

"Oh. I, uh, yeah, I should eat. Since we didn't have the feast."

Permalink Mark Unread

"We did not!" He offers her a sandwich with many vitamins snuck into the bread - he is not yet clear on the dishes situation here - and some berries on the nearest surface that will do given the unknown dish situation.

Permalink Mark Unread

Smile. "I didn't - I wasn't expecting you to get into a fight with them. I'm glad it worked out."

Permalink Mark Unread

"- would you have preferred I just let it slide?"

Permalink Mark Unread

"No, no, I'm really glad you did it! I - 

I guess I just put all my thought into how to get through it better than last time and then it was really surprising when suddenly instead -

- but I am very grateful."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Cool, I wouldn't have wanted to be like, taking untoward risks on your behalf if you were actually hoping to play it really conservatively or something. You wanna get some sleep in a real bed? It's been a long day."

Permalink Mark Unread

" - yeah. Thank you. Sleep well."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Not unless you think you can pick me up, I haven't the hang of sleeping in chairs, but it's all right, I usually don't at all."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Oh, of course, I'm sorry, I wasn't thinking." She attempts this. She isn't actually physically strong enough to pull it off.

Permalink Mark Unread

"It's okay. I'll drink coffee and experiment with electronics and stuff."

Permalink Mark Unread

"All right. Of course wake me if you need anything."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Mm-hm!"

Once she has had her food and gone to bed Cam tries his computer.

Permalink Mark Unread

It works. If he's very patient. See, it is a thousand times slower than him.

Permalink Mark Unread

...well. Lots of useful operations take only a fraction of a second. He might wind up wanting to put several of them up on his wall so he can conduct searches in parallel but nailing things to the wall is at the moment beyond him given his binding, so for the time being he'll do with one.

Ugh, there's screen flicker at this speed. Probably he will mostly use it to search for things to then make in hard copy.

Still. He looks up his notes on refeeding and comes up with a meal plan for Auda and sticks a coffee thermos in his cupholder to sip from.

Permalink Mark Unread

At some point someone knocks on the door and slides a note halfway under it.

Permalink Mark Unread

...Cam makes one of those extensible grabby stick things and grabs the note.

Permalink Mark Unread

It's a note! He can't read it.

Permalink Mark Unread

"I can't read this yet," Cam calls through the door.

Permalink Mark Unread

Someone opens the door. "Oh! I'm sorry to bother you. The note was just to let you know how to get in touch with us, should you want to. Can you make things appear on our side of the door?"

Permalink Mark Unread

"Yes, though my aim won't be great."

Permalink Mark Unread

"That's fine. If there's something there we'll take it as a sign to come on in. Is everything okay right now?"

Permalink Mark Unread

"Think so. Though if it won't fuck too much with whatever mess of a debt situation I'm in at the moment I would like someone to teach me the alphabet, I can probably go from there without too much trouble."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Oh! Yeah, sure, I can do that, it's very simple -"

It is phonetic. There are also clever correspondences between the letter shape and where in your mouth the sound is made but very few people find that helpful in learning it.

Permalink Mark Unread

It might be useful during one very specific stage of acquiring fluency but mostly nah. "Cool, do you have book recommendations?"

Permalink Mark Unread

There's mostly the science books written by the head of their court.

Permalink Mark Unread

"I suppose you would have a little trouble inventing the novel. Thank you."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Of course." He leaves.

Permalink Mark Unread

Cam reads science books.

Permalink Mark Unread

This is a long and admittedly speculative argument that the Earth goes round the sun. This is an examination of the properties of gravity at different sizes. This is about the surface tension of water. This is a very speculative attempt to characterize how human societies might work. This is an incredibly precise, detailed and remarkably accurate account of how human languages around the world developed and are presently spoken.

Permalink Mark Unread

This will keep Cam occupied for a fairly long time.

Permalink Mark Unread

Then eventually the human will wake up. She looks around hurriedly to see if there's anything she needs to do.

Permalink Mark Unread

"Good morning! I have found my notes on how to deal with you recovering from malnourishment. - but I still don't know how dishes get washed around here. I will, uh, summon a faery to ask about that, I guess." They didn't specify what should be a sign to come in so he hooks a light over the top of the door, which will respond to his chip on only about two seconds' delay when he wishes to toggle it. On it goes.

Permalink Mark Unread

They come by a little while later.

"Can I help you?"

Permalink Mark Unread

"Hey! I can make things but cannot disappear things. This has implications for dishes, which I've so far been avoiding by mostly making things that do not require dishes, but that's annoying. What's the state of the art around here on getting dishes washed, would the court like to gradually accumulate any particular sort of dish, etcetera?"

Permalink Mark Unread

"Oh! Uh, some people wash them as their chore, it won't be much trouble to add more, if you do something pretty and foreign in interesting materials that'd be great."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Cool, where should we leave them to get picked up and if there begin to be too many where should we pick up preexisting ones to put food on?"

Permalink Mark Unread

"You can leave them at the door and we can bring clean ones there. Is the door hard for you to reach? We could come in and put them on a table but we'd usually try not to when your room is in use."

Permalink Mark Unread

"I am unable to travel even very short distances under my own power at this time. You could knock?"

Permalink Mark Unread

"All right!"

Permalink Mark Unread

"Thanks!"

And he makes Auda her fortified breakfast porridge in a sparkly blue bowl, which is made of plastic, because it is too eleventh century for plastic to be tacky.

Permalink Mark Unread

She is quietly delighted about her porridge and her bowl.

Permalink Mark Unread

"What is the debt nightmare situation at the moment?"

Permalink Mark Unread

"- do you mean, how much debt are you two in? A lot, but the ability to make things is very helpful for that. Objects we couldn't make ourselves are very valuable."

Permalink Mark Unread

"I mean, yes, a lot, but could you denominate it in bowls or sandwiches or something?"

Permalink Mark Unread

"It's not linear in bowls or sandwiches. If you made us a hundred of those bowls you'd be even, probably."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Marginal value of bowls and sandwiches goes down?"

Permalink Mark Unread

"Uniqueness matters to how valuable something is, and so does how much it's needed, and so does how much we can learn from it."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Does somebody have a wishlist? - Is everyone here on the same sleep schedule?"

Permalink Mark Unread

"No, that'd make the place feel twice as crowded. I can get you a list of things we'd want."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Sounds good."

Permalink Mark Unread

"You want it to include enough to buy out the girl as well?"

Permalink Mark Unread

"Might as well. Do I need to do some formal thing to specify what objects are toward what?"

Permalink Mark Unread

"The person who owns her debt currently will have to come by and say they'll accept the objects in exchange for it."

Permalink Mark Unread

"And who's that?"

Permalink Mark Unread

"I don't know if he gave you a name but you spoke with him earlier. Red hair."

Permalink Mark Unread

"He didn't give me a name, I've been thinking of him as Not A Stupid Asshole."

Permalink Mark Unread

"I regret that that's distinguishing. He can bring the list, once we have it."

Permalink Mark Unread

"I mean I'm sure several of you manage it but he's the first one to stand out in the category."

Permalink Mark Unread

"I am sure he'll be delighted to speak with you further."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Cool."

Permalink Mark Unread

He heads off.

Permalink Mark Unread

Cam practices reading the language.

Permalink Mark Unread

And a while later he comes in with a list. They'd like:

- magical lights and magical crystals of these eight kinds, if he can do them

- food healthy for humans that will last a long time, ideally at least a winter

- medicines worth trying if humans get sick

- a precise miniature replica of the court of the Queen of Faeries, if he can do that sort of thing

- something sharp enough to cut those bowling balls without losing its edge

- (if he can't do the magic things) a book he recommends written by humans about science, in six different languages

- (also if he can't do the magic things) a book he recommends written by humans about history, in six different languages

- (also if he can't do the magic things) musical instruments from his people

Permalink Mark Unread

Cam cannot do magical lights and crystals. "Do you know if food that's hanging out with accelerated people decays according to real time or accelerated time? Also the replica might not go through completely what with all the magic, but some of it might, is that still worthwhile?"

Permalink Mark Unread

"Meat takes a couple sunsets to go off, if you don't do anything to preserve it. Plants take maybe ten, fifteen sunsets. I don't know how long they last for mortals. A partial replica would still be interesting."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Sounds like real-time decay, which is good, because I know preservation techniques that will last for decades of real time but not for thousands of decades. Should I assume animal pests are a non-concern because anyone wandering by your granary can see a mouse coming while it still has subjective days to go?"

Permalink Mark Unread

"Yes. We mostly direct animals off in some other direction when they come by. - or cage them if we want to study them. Is that objectionable."

Permalink Mark Unread

"That's complicated and not a priority compared to people stuff but if 'study' happens to mean 'vivisect' I can probably just straightforwardly replace whatever information y'all are getting out of that."

Permalink Mark Unread

"You can't affect slow things except with extremely rare magical equipment. I'd be very interested in what animals are like inside but it won't replace anything because we don't hurt them as is."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Then yeah putting mice and stuff in cages isn't a big deal, I don't think there are any of the really smart animal species in random German forests."

Permalink Mark Unread

Nod.

Permalink Mark Unread

Here is a little diorama of the court they wanted, missing chunks.

"About cutting the bowling balls, that's actually really hard. I don't think they're individually too big to be impossible to pick up or at least roll around though?"

Permalink Mark Unread

"They're not but it'd be really nice to be able to do something with them other than - put them in corners as decorations, I guess."

Permalink Mark Unread

"I guess if you do really well at the not being evil thing maybe I will teach you to summon an angel."

Permalink Mark Unread

"What's an angel?"

Permalink Mark Unread

"I'm one of three kinds of thing that have powers. Angels can get rid of stuff, as a subset of changing stuff generally."

Permalink Mark Unread

"What does the third kind do?"

Permalink Mark Unread

"They move things."

Permalink Mark Unread

"That sounds much less useful."

Permalink Mark Unread

"It matters a little more when they're generating electricity and supporting interplanetary transit."

Permalink Mark Unread

"I guess those wouldn't be things I could appreciate."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Maybe you can give the bowling balls to other courts as exotic presents or something."

Permalink Mark Unread

"No one can lift them."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Would you like little carts for them."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Not as much as the other things on the list but if we have more to settle later, maybe."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Okay. Sorry, I would have done something else to avoid being dragged off but at the time I was under the impression that everything had to be midair."

Permalink Mark Unread

"I'm just grateful that no one got hurt."

Permalink Mark Unread

"That would have required both more creativity and more ruthlessness than it turned out I needed to deploy."

Permalink Mark Unread

"I am confused about why they would have written the constraints that they did, if they wanted you to attempt to hurt us and thereby destroy our court."

Permalink Mark Unread

"I think they copied the circle from some humans and had no idea what it was for, originally."

Permalink Mark Unread

"That seems ill-advised."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Oh, yes, a very bad idea, though I don't know what circumstantial information they may have possessed, maybe they saw a human make a deal with some demon."

Permalink Mark Unread

"I can let you know when we find out."

Permalink Mark Unread

"For whatever it's worth I didn't hurt anybody there, either, they didn't have some kind of firsthand knowledge of my willingness to draw blood or anything."

Permalink Mark Unread

"If they were genuinely just being idiots and didn't want anyone to get hurt then that'll matter. I - still don't super want them around making simllarly idiotic choices but I don't want to hurt people who weren't trying to kill my family."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Oh good."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Anything else we should know?"

Permalink Mark Unread

"Electronics do work, they just work in real time. Since electronics can do things very fast, this means I will find them mildly annoying and you will probably be super impressed unless screen flicker bothers you a whole lot." He brandishes his computer. "This has more books in it than you have probably seen in your life. I was going to go for some more emphatic statement of how many books it is but I couldn't come up with anything both literally true and appropriately grandiose. It's a lot of books."

Permalink Mark Unread

"That sounds really really cool. - I'm not sure we could afford it."

Permalink Mark Unread

"See, this is the kind of problem people who do not have to track debt constantly do not have."

Permalink Mark Unread

"That's true but also, at least here, they routinely slaughter each other for no reason. I admit your society seems to have managed the best of both worlds there."

Permalink Mark Unread

"They have reasons. Different reasons, but reasons."

Permalink Mark Unread

"I guess that's not surprising but the accounts that make it to us are notably reason-free. Nothing that would've caused any debt had happened."

Permalink Mark Unread

"You seem weirdly convinced that this metaphysical fact about your species tracks something that is, separately from its consequent effect on your risk management policies, interesting or important in any way."

Permalink Mark Unread

"It's hard to imagine what would happen if the universe stopped punishing entangled people but I think debt would still characterize most of what's important to us."

Permalink Mark Unread

"I suppose it makes sense that your underlying psychology would have evolved to reflect it. Assuming you evolved, which I guess I don't know."

Permalink Mark Unread

"The term's familiar but not applied in that way."

Permalink Mark Unread

"- you can't really breed animals, can you - do you cultivate plants on purpose at all -"

Permalink Mark Unread

"There are a very few plants that grow fast enough to be worth the effort but there are a few, yes."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Do you preferentially grow seeds or cuttings from the ones that are the best for whatever you're doing with them?"

Permalink Mark Unread

"Yeah. Fastest-growing or tastiest."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Okay! And then they have relatively fast-growing or tasty baby plants, and you can keep doing that, over and over, and while I'm not sure about faeries because you're weird, this is actually how ever other single living thing on the entire planet has come to be how it is in every particular except that instead of agricultural faeries it's whatever the heck they find themselves near and instead of fast-growing or tasty in particular it's 'literally anything that makes them more viable and more capable of producing offspring', and sometimes this is normal stuff like a bear that can catch a lot of salmon getting really fat and lasting through the winter more effectively and sometimes this is weird stuff like human intelligence running away at maximum acceleration to track social games and cultural knowledge and shit. Metaphorically running. Does that make sense?"

Permalink Mark Unread

He considers it for a second. "You'd have to start with something that could have varied offspring."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Yes. Guy who really wants to learn German is your brother, right? He doesn't look like you and you don't seem to really want to learn German. Living things are all like that - some a lot, because they reproduce sexually and mix up traits every generation in fun combinations, and some just a little, like bacteria, which I don't know come to think of it if you know they exist because maybe being teeny lets you see them with fairly primitive lenses? Anyway those sort of try to reproduce exactly but sometimes they make mistakes and sometimes the mistakes are good."

Permalink Mark Unread

He seems to spend another moment thinking it over. "Okay. 

There are faeries who claim to be the first faery but none very credibly I think, and lots of origin stories that seem likely to have been distorted in the retelling."

Permalink Mark Unread

"You might have evolved but you have no obvious relatives. I mean, you look a lot like humans but you have all this extra stuff tacked on that does not appear even in attenuated form as human variation as far as I know."

Permalink Mark Unread

"But even without it explaining everything about us, it would make sense for faeries who have natural inclinations in line with the debt system to be successful and have more children."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Yeah, exactly, since otherwise you experience potentially fatal health problems. Might also explain your hypothesized lack of trauma reaction to all the sex stuff I was complaining about? There's a psychological phenomenon humans can get that's probably an adaptive to response to 'oh no, I have been captured by an enemy tribe' - it might make some sense from a third party perspective for this to just be game over but evolution isn't metaphorically cool with there being a game over so instead human psychology goes 'okay I'm in this tribe now that's fine I can still have a bunch of kids'.
Maybe you have a mini version of that kicking in whenever you're in debt and somebody's like 'let's solve this by having sex', since if you were like 'no' this would make you seem disagreeable, or something."

Permalink Mark Unread

"I observe that human slaves are also broadly pretty cooperative and yet your analysis there is that we're still hurting them quite badly?"

Permalink Mark Unread

"Yup! This psychological quirk is best construed as a trauma reaction!"

Permalink Mark Unread

"That - doesn't feel to me like an accurate description of the thing that's going on when faeries are ordered to have sex. I don't have much in the way of non-faery examples to work from, but something doesn't fit."

Permalink Mark Unread

"I mean, yeah, I'm just speculating."

Permalink Mark Unread

Nodnod. "There've got to be other things, too, that by rights ought to be upsetting but that actually it's rare to be upset about? Are there humans who have trauma about needing to excrete waste?"

Permalink Mark Unread

"Uh, maybe, but it'd be a really obscure psychological problem."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Because it's common enough that it'd be really, really maladaptive to get all upset about it, even if in the abstract it's kind of unpleasant and even if, described to aliens, they might assume one would hate it?"

Permalink Mark Unread

"I... guess you could draw that analogy? It does feel salient to me here that nobody is going around inserting waste into people so they have to excrete it, there's no agent involved - humans can get trauma about things that don't involve other agents but it's way rarer."

Permalink Mark Unread

"That's interesting."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Maybe it helps that the magic debt thing is itself conspicuously not an agent? That's conspicuous to you, I mean, you have some direct sense of it, humans don't, they just see faeries doing stuff to them."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Maybe. With sex in particular there's that - it's one of the fastest ways to reduce debt that doesn't require exceptional levels of ability in something. The only thing that's faster is violence. So generally, telling someone you want sex is friendly in that it's... the likeliest result of considering their time valuable and not wanting to hurt them."

Permalink Mark Unread

"That makes sense as a signaling thing, yeah."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Though it's also rare for faeries to be traumatized by violence, if I'm understanding traumatizedness right."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Humans get traumatized by violence pretty routinely. Also unwanted sex and violence are correlated."

Permalink Mark Unread

"If you tell someone to have sex with you and they say no and then you hit them until they cannot object and have sex with them you have done something rude, by our standards."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Well, I guess 'rude' is something."

Permalink Mark Unread

"There are a lot of details that'd be relevant to how people evaluated it but - that's not a normal sort of behavior, when I say we're all breaking this rule of yours all the time I don't mean that."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Oh good."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Anyway unless we had a lot more mortals who wanted to cooperate with testing I doubt we'd nail down exactly the ways we're different but we do seem to be, and the debt system feels - pretty much reasonable to me. Not exactly the way I'd design it but not irrelevant the way it is to you."

Permalink Mark Unread

"It has... obvious exploits, which I think would stop me from taking it seriously as a grounding for right behavior, even if I considered its archetypical use cases reasonable."

Permalink Mark Unread

"It does have those. It feels to me like it's basically shaped around the right things but then you can use it to do horrible things if you're clever enough."

Permalink Mark Unread

"I think a credible metaphysical instantiation of morality wouldn't have that, so my suspicion is that faeries are molded around the system and not that the system has anything of general interest to say about the nature of ethics. Sort of like... sugar tastes good, but in humans that means that anything in the ancestral environment they found with sugar in it was probably a good source of calories and vitamins. It doesn't mean that sugar fundamentally is tasty. Cats can't taste it at all and that doesn't make cats wrong."

Permalink Mark Unread

"I guess I'm not sure there's a general nature of ethics any more than there's a general nature of tastiness."

Permalink Mark Unread

"I think there's - such a thing as moral progress, and even if that doesn't imply a single coherent destination, it implies that some directions are better than others."

Permalink Mark Unread

Nod. "Do you want to be kept up to date on our plans for the court that sent you?"

Permalink Mark Unread

"Yes please."

Permalink Mark Unread

"All right. Anything else I can do for you?"

Permalink Mark Unread

"I'm not sure what the intended scope of the medicine idea is. There are some simple things that if the administering party can follow a basic dosing instruction are pretty safe to try and see what happens, like vitamin pills and rehydration stuff, but anything more sophisticated and you need at least a stab at the diagnosis."

Permalink Mark Unread

"I haven't actually had a human before and don't know what sort of things often come up."

Permalink Mark Unread

"I mostly just need to know if medicine with instructions like 'administer for pain and fever and not just randomly whenever under the weather, don't give more than X over Y period of time or Z over N period of time, discontinue if any of these four things' are too complicated."

Permalink Mark Unread

"No, that'd be fine."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Cool, I can get you some first line stuff of about that complexity. Is this for trading or for if I am not personally available to doctor here at some point in the future, medicines expire eventually like food does."

Permalink Mark Unread

"I was assuming you might not indefinitely be around to doctor. How long do they take to expire?"

Permalink Mark Unread

"It depends. Years, for most of the stuff I'd be giving you, it's probably not time to try to figure out vaccines for this population's pathogens."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Okay. And is actively dangerous once it's too late, or just less likely to work?"

Permalink Mark Unread

"I can stick to the latter without limiting the selection much."

Permalink Mark Unread

"That sounds good."

Permalink Mark Unread

"How much food do you want?"

Permalink Mark Unread

"I can show you how much space we have to store it."

Permalink Mark Unread

"That works. For complicated reasons I'm dubious about the history book, can I swap in an extra science book?"

Permalink Mark Unread

"It seems less useful for the things you wanted us to learn but I'm sure it will be appreciated just as much, so sure."

Permalink Mark Unread

"The complicated reasons are mostly orthogonal to your level of moral abominability."

Permalink Mark Unread

"I see."

Permalink Mark Unread

"How many musical instruments you want?"

Permalink Mark Unread

"Let's do the food first and then see how close we are."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Okay! Should I be assuming it has to be ready to eat or that stuff you have to boil or roast is fine?"

Permalink Mark Unread

"We can cook things that require heat. We can't cook things that require anything more complicated than heat, if it needs to sit over a fire or be dropped in boiling water those don't work."

Permalink Mark Unread

"You... have heat but not boiling water?"

Permalink Mark Unread

"That's right. I know of the existence of boiling water from experiments my father did while he was slow."

Permalink Mark Unread

"I might need to look at your heat thing to guess what kinds of cooking it can do. Like, most food has water in it."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Sure!" 


They detour by there on their way to look at storage. They have a series of magic crystals that are very very hot to the touch. They might just not actually be hot enough to boil water.

Permalink Mark Unread

Cam puts a drop of water that is a bit bigger than an ant on one.

Permalink Mark Unread

That is some water sitting there.

Permalink Mark Unread

"Okay, maybe at this pressure water doesn't boil at this temperature. This can probably make toast but I don't think it will let me do any food that actually needs cooking. These don't come any hotter?"

Permalink Mark Unread

"They don't. They can cook meat, though, we use them for that."

Permalink Mark Unread

"...that must take a really long time."

Permalink Mark Unread

"You start preparing for the sunrise feast as soon as the sunset feast is over, in some months."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Okay. Well, most meat that will be good left lying around indefinitely is packaged precooked. So I still should make the assumption that I shouldn't include anything that needs heating."

Permalink Mark Unread

"That makes sense." And he shows him the storage rooms.

Permalink Mark Unread

Cam does some scratchwork - on paper, the screen flicker's too annoying - about nutrient ratios, and then fills up the rooms with cans and plastic sacks and foil pouches. The cans have pulltabs.

Permalink Mark Unread

The faeries are delighted.

Permalink Mark Unread

Wag wag! "I have come up with a couple science books which I think have been translated enough, where do you want them?"

Permalink Mark Unread

"I will go bring them to my brother right away."

Permalink Mark Unread

Books appear, one by one.

Permalink Mark Unread

He glances through them and then hands them off to -

Permalink Mark Unread

- him; he arrives in a hurry.

Permalink Mark Unread

Giggle.

Permalink Mark Unread

"Hello," he says cheerfully and runs off with his books.

Permalink Mark Unread

"How many instruments are we looking at and does it count any which way if I hang on to one that I play and play it?"

Permalink Mark Unread

"That puts listeners in your debt, if you're good, but as long as you're willing to let them pay you back that's fine. And - I think four, or three if they're all very distinct sorts of thing."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Assuming I'm not in the market for sexual favors from random strangers who - do they even have to like my music or is there some objective standard of being good at it? - what kind of repayment are we looking at there?"

Permalink Mark Unread

"It just matters if you're good at it, not if they like it. They could run errands for you, or answer questions for you. They could bring you things, except you can make things you want anyway. If you want sexual favors from some people but not all of them you could transfer the debts and then just accept payment from whoever you actually liked, and leave them to settle things internally."

Permalink Mark Unread

"I'm not actually asexual but it's a whole metaphorical can of worms for the time being. One popular instrument is in non-electric form kind of annoying to tune, is that a problem?"

Permalink Mark Unread

"Not at all."

Permalink Mark Unread

Baby grand piano! And a flute and a hang and on his own lap a violin.

Permalink Mark Unread

"Thank you! In exchange for the gifts which you have given us, I offer you the debts of my human, holding back only enough that she'll remain entangled with us, and with the understanding that you can request I transfer those to you as well at some future date."

Permalink Mark Unread

"She needs to stay entangled to - not slow down, is the idea?"

Permalink Mark Unread

"Yes."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Okay. I accept? Do I need to do something specific to accept?"

Permalink Mark Unread

"No. Three-way trades are complicated and people need to hold and refer to identifying crystals but two-way it just needs to be clear you agree."

Permalink Mark Unread

"There are crystals involved? Wow."

Permalink Mark Unread

"You kind of need a lot of crystals to have a tolerable court. Next to the need to patrol your borders it's one of the biggest barriers to people starting new ones."

Permalink Mark Unread

"For three way debt and slow-cooking meat and what else?"

Permalink Mark Unread

"Slowing people down, if they want to do magic or have children, and lighting, which is particularly important at night."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Why do you need to patrol your borders?"

Permalink Mark Unread

"It is otherwise easy for people to trespass and incur debt without you noticing."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Humans? Or do other faeries do that?"

Permalink Mark Unread

"Other faeries do it rarely but that's because people patrol. Humans aren't much of a concern for us, we don't have a faery ring."

Permalink Mark Unread

"What would the faery motive be? They're entangled too after they do that, right?"

Permalink Mark Unread

"Our court has good fortune. Being entangled with us is beneficial. Or if you wanted to change that, a good way to start would be getting someone to run up debt we didn't know about, and then forcing them into mistakes or misconduct."

Permalink Mark Unread

"And this isn't prohibitively difficult to get someone trapped into?"

Permalink Mark Unread

"You could use a human. Or do it with ten people and not force any of them to do anything actually likely to kill them, though the logistics for that would be very nearly insurmountable."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Ah-huh. Anybody use traps instead of patrols?"

Permalink Mark Unread

"That'd almost certainly be disproportionate. Maybe someone somewhere has designed ones that wouldn't be."

Permalink Mark Unread

"I guess to avoid it being disproportionate you'd have to go have someone check them a lot anyway."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Technically if someone is in a cage you put them in, and you do nothing further to bother them, you don't incur any more debt. Until they starve, but you wouldn't have to check very often to avoid that. But most ways of caging someone would run a significant risk of hurting them, and that would count, and people'd come looking for lost loved ones and you'd end up with a mess. I'd expect."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Makes sense."

Permalink Mark Unread

"One of the things my father's working on is remote viewing crystals, and that'll cut down on patrol times quite dramatically."

Permalink Mark Unread

"There's such a thing as electronic video cameras too."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Huh! Well, consider me very sincerely hopeful you'll find something we can do for you."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Yeah that thing there is really cramping my style."

Permalink Mark Unread

"I can imagine."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Can you?"

Permalink Mark Unread

"I have a brother who is a musician and it is really easy to imagine that were he human his life would be an extraordinarily joyful one."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Wow, yeah, that must be a bummer."

Permalink Mark Unread

"When he was about this tall -" he gestures around his knees - "we had to take his toy flute away because he'd gotten too good at it."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Oh no."

Permalink Mark Unread

"He'll like the instruments, though."

Permalink Mark Unread

"I hope so. I probably do not have the musical talent of someone who was notably good at the flute knee-high but naively duets would ameliorate the problem?"

Permalink Mark Unread

"Yes, as long as there's no one else around. You can listen to him and then make him some trinkets, if you want to."

Permalink Mark Unread

"I might do that!"

Permalink Mark Unread

"You can also play the human music if you want, debt does not appear to track between the two of you."

Permalink Mark Unread

"I didn't think it did. How soundproof are the rooms?"

Permalink Mark Unread

"My brother's is but otherwise it's not particularly a problem we were expecting."

Permalink Mark Unread

"I don't know if I'm any good by faery standards what with you being immortal and it being weird that there's an impersonal measure of that in the first place, how long does it take to tell?"

Permalink Mark Unread

"It's immediate."

Permalink Mark Unread

"- from the first note, seriously?"

Permalink Mark Unread

"I think so? I haven't actually tested it. From the first six notes, definitely."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Well. Can I check, how expensive are six notes if I'm good."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Not that much and I've just answered a bunch of questions. Go ahead."

Permalink Mark Unread

Cam plays the first six notes of Devil Went Down To Georgia.

Permalink Mark Unread

"That counts, yes."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Oh well. Or yay, I suppose, depending on perspective."

Permalink Mark Unread

"My congratulations and condolences, then!"

Permalink Mark Unread

Violin goes back on his lap. "- have faeries invented money?"

Permalink Mark Unread

"Not really. I wouldn't even know what it was but one of my brothers has an interest. Money is a thing of value that behaves like most other trade goods - that is to say, the debt system thinks there's diminishing marginal returns to it in the same way it thinks that about shiny rocks, or turnips - and you can make it be worth more than it ordinarily is by sitting there in the corner being predictably willing to trade things the debt system considers to be worth more for it. But propping it up like that only increases its value to somewhere in between its normal value and the value you're being-willing-to-trade at, so you rack up a lot of debt doing this. Those are the things that we know about money."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Might want to talk to your brother with the interest at some point, it probably doesn't just solve all your problems but it would be so cool if it did."

Permalink Mark Unread

"It would."

Permalink Mark Unread

Tailswish. "Is most of the court directly related to you? Your assorted brothers keep coming up."

Permalink Mark Unread

"The largest debts exist within families so it's typical for a court to be made up in significant part of family members. Ours is actually less that way than most, being slightly estranged from my parents' parents, and having collected lots of interesting people whose home court wasn't the right environment for them."

Permalink Mark Unread

"How's that tend to play out?"

Permalink Mark Unread

"You gather up things worth enough to purchase their debts off their home court. You could do this without their input but it'd be a very bad idea; uncooperative court members are dangerous to everybody."

Permalink Mark Unread

"You'd need at least the rest of the court's cooperation, right? Or do they have to take the things? I guess the music one you could just launch a hostile takeover?"

Permalink Mark Unread

"Going up to an enemy court and playing music is more or less an act of war. You need the cooperation of whoever you want to buy the debt from, under normal circumstances; you don't need the cooperation of whoever you're buying, though it'd be really unusual not to have it."

Permalink Mark Unread

"How do you establish that somebody wants to be bought?"

Permalink Mark Unread

"Asking them?"

Permalink Mark Unread

"I'm not clear on the nature of intercourt social dynamics, are there mixers or what?"

Permalink Mark Unread

"People can visit friends without much overhead. Groups will visit for special occasions, sometimes - performances, which you can plan so each group does one, or parties, or to see something new that someone discovered. We'd have had guests come see the mortal and learn from her about mortal things. Courts send each other assistance when something bad happens, like a storm or a flood or mortals changing what they're doing. It's useful to have goods on hand you can trade for aid in an emergency."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Mortals aren't a niche interest?"

Permalink Mark Unread

"I'd say maybe one in twenty people we know would be curious enough to visit?"

Permalink Mark Unread

"And this'd go toward her room and board, I imagine?"

Permalink Mark Unread

"Yeah. Two mortals would've been barely within our capacities to feed."

Permalink Mark Unread

"I guess there's diminishing returns to having a second one if you're mostly running it on using the mortals as zoo exhibits."

Permalink Mark Unread

He hesitates for half a second. "Yeah. We'd have made do, but people would've been spending far more of their time out on assignments than is generally considered good practice."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Fortunately I am an infinite font of economic value if you can figure out how to make it feasible to accept!"

Permalink Mark Unread

"We got very very lucky. And maybe we'll get luckier still and you'll find people whose music and company you enjoy."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Is 'company' a euphemism or is just socially hanging out with people also costly."

Permalink Mark Unread

"You ask a lot of questions so with you it seems to be a pretty good way of accumulating debt, actually. Probably eventually you'll run out of questions."

Permalink Mark Unread

"I dunno, hasn't happened yet and I'm a hundred and seventy two." Tailswish.

Permalink Mark Unread

"A year like the time between two winters?"

Permalink Mark Unread

"Yes. Though, like, in sidereal time."

Permalink Mark Unread

"You are much older than me but I've had much more question-asking time."

Permalink Mark Unread

"I'm not sure if it makes sense to conceptualize my age in something other than question-asking time unless you're specifically figuring out what history I've been around for, which would not be like your available set of history anyway."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Probably not. Or how much you know about variance in the severity of winters."

Permalink Mark Unread

"I don't usually live in a place that really has a climate, so."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Ah. Are you familiar with how seasons work, in places that have them?"

Permalink Mark Unread

"Yes, I've been to some."

Permalink Mark Unread

 

"One winter a human came to a ring near a court I know, hoping we'd have food. I don't know where he thought we'd have gotten food."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Humans who know you exist but not much about you might assume you have to eat."

Permalink Mark Unread

"If we did then we'd starve every winter. Or maybe slow down every winter, I guess."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Some of the food at your feast looked like it was weird sizes? That doesn't let you cheat enough?"

Permalink Mark Unread

"It's pretty useful! But I think humans have to work pretty hard to preserve enough food for the winter and sped-up humans eat a thousand times as often as slowed-down humans and don't eat a thousandth as much, so even if we could grow and preserve everything while big and eat it while small I think we'd be out of luck."

Permalink Mark Unread

"What happened to the human?"

Permalink Mark Unread

"They told him they didn't have food. Then I guess he probably starved. But there wasn't - we don't have feasts for sunrises and sunsets in the winter."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Well, if I'm still here then maybe you can."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Kind of surprised you don't want to slow down and help the humans."

Permalink Mark Unread

"I might. I am not doing it at this time because complicated reasons."

Permalink Mark Unread

Nod.

Permalink Mark Unread

"Where are you going to want the medicines?"

Permalink Mark Unread

There's a place across from the storage rooms in this lower level which is cool and dry.

Permalink Mark Unread

Cam picks through his med school notes till he has found a good selection of things, translates administration instructions for all of them, and fills it up with assorted pills and rehydration salts and such.

Permalink Mark Unread

"Thank you."

Permalink Mark Unread

"You're welcome. What's in there?" he asks, pointing at another door down the corridor.

Permalink Mark Unread

"Dungeons. I don't especially want to take you in, it'll scare them without much reason, but we can go in if you'd like."

Permalink Mark Unread

"- who-all's in there?"

Permalink Mark Unread

"Four people. Two of them are in trouble for an elaborate scheme to skip their patrols and hide it; one of them is a prisoner of an attack on an allied court who they felt shouldn't be held with his compatriots, and one of them tried to arrange someone's death over a romantic jealousy."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Why shouldn't he be held with his compatriots?"

Permalink Mark Unread

"Kept organizing prisoner revolts. Most places would've killed him but his mother runs the court."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Do I wanna know how much I should be reading into 'a romantic jealousy'?"

Permalink Mark Unread

"I have no idea if there's a human or whatever-you-are equivalent. Sometimes people get very attached to the idea of other people being in a close intimate usually-sexual relationship with them and get upset about competitors for this role, which many people prefer to be occupied by a single party?"

Permalink Mark Unread

"It kind of surprises me you have that, considering! Humans have lots of that but don't try to combine it with... sex as a convenient unit of liquidity."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Childbearing requires the pregnant woman to trust someone else a lot, to wait a long time for her and then come and get her and have a stable situation arranged afterwards. So lots of people have - that, or things that seem to be shaped from the impulse to have that. Sex is usually part of it but not usually the most important part of it; I mostly mentioned it because it matters to you."

Permalink Mark Unread

"I don't meant to give the impression that I'm fixated, it just seems like one of the most obvious and troubling points of difference."

Permalink Mark Unread

"About three in ten faeries I know have a single person who is the most important person in their life and protective of that status, and it's more among people who are older."

Permalink Mark Unread

Cam nods. "The summary of the situation with the party in the dungeon just didn't make it clear to me if this was somebody who was anxious about another person borrowing their slave or somebody who was mad that somebody else got with their crush."

Permalink Mark Unread

"The latter. I think. Definitely not the former and probably the latter maps closely enough to what happened."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Okay. I do not feel very urgent at this moment about personally inspecting their conditions but perhaps you could summarize them."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Unless we're planning to execute them it's very boring in there. They're in separate cages but they can talk to each other; people can visit them as long as the visit doesn't cause debt in either direction; they often weave things, or polish things, or draw things, to trade for entertainment but they don't have to. We move the lights around so they can track the passage of time."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Why would going in scare them?"

Permalink Mark Unread

"Lot of ways to not cause debt in either direction."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Ah. How commonly is that the visitors' interest?"

Permalink Mark Unread

"The majority of visitors are friends or family. The majority of strangers are probably unfriendly."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Ah, okay, and they have no idea who this guy with wings in a wheelchair is."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Yes. If you want to tag along with someone when they're visiting their brother I can set that up and then you'll be less alarming."

Permalink Mark Unread

"I still do not feel urgent about that but am now randomly curious if you guys's family relationships are anything like what I'm accustomed to."

Permalink Mark Unread

"People care about and get along with their siblings at higher than the rate they care about and get along with unrelated court members but this might just be because people with the same parents tend more similar. Parents usually are fond of their children to a degree they'll admit is irrational. Parents who have a child who is an incredible and incorrigible danger to the whole family often have a very hard time acknowledging this and killing them, even if they're ruthless in other contexts."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Grandparents? Cousins?"

Permalink Mark Unread

"Grandparents also tend quite fond of their grandchildren. I think people like their cousins more than they like unrelated persons but my sample there contains...mostly my own very likeable cousins so I don't know how confident to be that that generalizes."

Permalink Mark Unread

"I suppose any non-liking-based loyalty would get kind of eaten by the debt system?"

Permalink Mark Unread

"Yes. You obey your parents and grandparents whether you like them or not but I don't know that I'd attribute that to an emotion."

Permalink Mark Unread

Cam nods.

Permalink Mark Unread

And they can head back upstairs. "I have six brothers but that is unusually many for my age. My mother likes being slow because she can do magic research."

Permalink Mark Unread

"That requires being slow?"

Permalink Mark Unread

"Yes. Magic things can only be made while slow. There's some research you can do while fast but you can't check your assumptions."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Huh. Humans can't do it?"

Permalink Mark Unread

"Never seen them at it. It's conceivable they just don't know how."

Permalink Mark Unread

"How'd faeries discover it?"

Permalink Mark Unread

"I know it's been independently discovered a few times, mostly by pregnant women. There's something in the air which you can draw out of the air and crystallize into various forms, the simplest one just requiring concentration but all the more sophisticated ones requiring a lot of technique, and then you can use the forms to do things."

Permalink Mark Unread

"- about how many faeries are there, in the world?"

Permalink Mark Unread

"My father estimated once that there were twenty billion of us but I don't remember all his assumptions. This court covers about ten acres and has about eighty people; to the west of us there's very little fertile wilderness that isn't claimed by some court or another; we're denser on the Misty Isles where we started; we're sparser to the east and very rare to the north."

Permalink Mark Unread

"South?"

Permalink Mark Unread

"Lots of us down to the sea. I don't know about the other side of it."

Permalink Mark Unread

"If it's really on the order twenty billion I suppose I can buy that humans might never have stumbled on it and several faeries have."

Permalink Mark Unread

"There aren't that many mortals, yeah."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Not twenty billion, certainly."

Permalink Mark Unread

"It's because they need food. Can't support a very dense population if they all need to eat."

Permalink Mark Unread

"I mean, you can, but you need demons or at least more advanced technology."

Permalink Mark Unread

"I guess demons would solve that entirely. Fair enough."

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Wag wag.

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He glances at the tail. Smiles. Sighs. "I should get you back before we worry your companion."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Sounds good."

Permalink Mark Unread

So he takes him back to his room. "Let me know if you need anything."

Permalink Mark Unread

"I'll turn on the light on the door to alert people that I may want something."

Permalink Mark Unread

"All right."

 

He leaves.

Permalink Mark Unread

Cam makes sure the light is off. How is Auda doing?

Permalink Mark Unread

"Okay. Someone came by and asked if we'd want hot water for a bath at any point. I said you could do that. She said of course you could and left. 

 

They're so nice but -

- if you hadn't been here I'd be tied up somewhere and I don't think that's even strange to them, really."

Permalink Mark Unread

"They're certainly something. Do you want a bath like now?"

Permalink Mark Unread

"- not especiallly. If you want."

Permalink Mark Unread

"I'm not trying to tell you that you smell or anything, I just wondered since it came up."

Permalink Mark Unread

"The other court mostly had me bathe before parties. They didn't have hot water, though, hot water sounds awfully neat." Shrug. "Maybe later."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Hot water's great! Running water's also great. I wonder if fluid dynamics are weird at this size." He rummages in his science books for an answer to this question. "You ready for lunch?"

Permalink Mark Unread

"Sure!"

Permalink Mark Unread

Cam consults his meal plan for her and presents her with soup! It has vegetables and rice and a suitably aggressive complement of vitamins. It is in a different plastic bowl.

Permalink Mark Unread

She eats her soup. 

His science book suggests that yes, fluid dynamics are super weird both when you are fast and when you are tiny. Being tiny during rainstorms is mildly dangerous though only if you're not looking overhead to see if a raindrop is slowly descending on you. Faeries can walk on water at all sizes apparently, but if they stop moving they start to sink in.

Permalink Mark Unread

Huh! That would be fun to try if he could walk. Maybe he can be rolled on water but that doesn't sound as fun.

"- gonna summon a faery, have a question for one," he remarks by way of warning before he flicks on the door light.

Permalink Mark Unread

A faery shows up. Not the red-haired one. "Can I help you?"

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"I'm wondering how much I should worry about storage space for books! As you can see, this thing flickers," he holds up the computer, "and that's annoying, so I've been using it to look things up and then producing what I want to read in hard copy, but this could easily get really voluminous."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Do you mind if we trade them off if we run out of space?"

Permalink Mark Unread

"Some of them I'd rather not wander off. - metaph- no, I think that's actually also literally true, if they literally wandered off that'd be alarming - uh, and they're mostly not going to be in your language."

Permalink Mark Unread

Nod. "I can ask how much space we have available, in that case."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Cool, thanks!"

Permalink Mark Unread

She gets back to him a little later with the news he can fill like six rooms this size with books before there'll be problems.

Permalink Mark Unread

"All right, thanks!"

Permalink Mark Unread

"You're welcome. Anything else?"

Permalink Mark Unread

"That's all for now, thanks!"

Permalink Mark Unread

Off she goes.

Permalink Mark Unread

Cam starts trying to figure out with a minimum of paper conjuration whether running water can be made to work under these conditions.

Permalink Mark Unread

It can! The pipes need to be quite big or the pressure through them quite intense but it's not impossible.

Permalink Mark Unread

This will occupy him for a little while but he doesn't like trying to work out all the details on paper and the flicker is horrible and maybe if he tries to write to the dev team for chiplocked computers about it he will cause a time paradox. Ugh. He has lunch of his own on a lovely patterned china plate.

Permalink Mark Unread

Auda spends most of her time sitting in bed staring at the wall but doesn't seem discontent about this exactly.

Permalink Mark Unread

He does eventually ask, "Are you bored?"

Permalink Mark Unread

"Hmm?"

Permalink Mark Unread

"Would you prefer to have something to do? I don't know what if anything you do for fun but if I were sitting around not doing anything I'd be bored."

Permalink Mark Unread

"I used to sew things? One of the fairies tried to have me copy written things but I wasn't very good at it."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Do you like sewing? Do you want, like, embroidery stuff or anything?"

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"It probably won't be very good but it'd be nice to try."

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Cam does not know a ton about embroidery but he can guess at some nice even threadcount muslin and a lot of embroidery floss colors and a thimble and - "I do not seem able to do needles or scissors, possibly because they are sharp, lemme trade a faery for those, I bet they have them." Light.

Permalink Mark Unread

Same fairy! They do in fact have those.

Permalink Mark Unread

Cam offers the nice china plate in exchange and presents Auda with the needles and scissors.

Permalink Mark Unread

Then she will sit there embroidering instead of sitting there not doing anything!

Permalink Mark Unread

Oh good!

He decides it is safe to check his mail, but he doesn't have any, probably because he's been here for, like, minutes, even if this is a parallel reality. That really makes it hard to check up on anything.

He looks up a mechanical watch that counts milliseconds and can't find one. He settles for a normal mechanical clock and makes one of those.

Permalink Mark Unread

It works fine, just, like, slowly.

Permalink Mark Unread

Cam decides it will not cause any time paradoxes if he reads a novel. He makes one.

Permalink Mark Unread

Then his afternoon will pass peacefully and uninterrupted.

Permalink Mark Unread

He and Auda have spaghetti and meatballs for dinner, and when he finishes his novel he goes back to the faery science books.

Permalink Mark Unread

The faeries are batting above the average for tenth century humans but confused about many things! They're not sure if the stars move and whether planets and stars are distinct things. They seem unclear on the existence of air as a phenomenon distinct from vacuum. They suspect the world of being round but not confidently.

Permalink Mark Unread

Gosh. Maybe next time he sees Science Brother he will issue corrections.

Permalink Mark Unread

A different brother actually stops by first! "I heard you have thoughts about monetary systems!" he says by way of introduction.

Permalink Mark Unread

"I have information from a more advanced civilization about them, does that count? I got what seemed like a pretty abbreviated summary from your brother about how it has been discovered to interact with debt stuff."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Yes, that counts! Tell me about it."

Permalink Mark Unread

"The humans I'm accustomed to use money on a massive scale! They don't do it for minor personal favors within close relationships or to negotiate basic public-space type etiquette, but they use money to buy basically all other kinds of goods and services that aren't considered 'too cheap to meter' - such that figuring out how much to charge a given consumer costs more than the amount of good or service they'll realistically consume. There are several different kinds of currency and used to be more, which had fluctuating exchange rates depending on the prosperity and stability of the populations that used them. It was originally popular to use physical tokens of exchange, at first things that were valuable in themselves - standard sizes and shapes of metal, usually - later with easier-to-manipulate paper placeholders theoretically redeemable for such things, later they dispensed with the theoretical redeemability, later it became more convenient to represent amounts in pure abstraction without a physical correlate and then that became almost universal because demons are really good at forgery of physical correlates."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Huh! How do you represent amounts in an entirely non-physical way -"

Permalink Mark Unread

"We have machines," he waves his computer, "that are good at manipulating data, and it's possible to store the data in such a way that it's hard to mess with it if you are not an entity authorized to do so, so you store 'so and so has this many dollars' and then only the agencies entrusted with making transactions on so-and-so's behalf can adjust that number."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Huh! It seems like you could get all of the good things about debt that way but have it entirely tuned to what people actually want."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Pretty much! As opposed to this magic thing which behaves a bit like it once had a dream about what people actually want. I wanna think of a way to convince the debt thing to accept money as a substrate."

Permalink Mark Unread

Sigh. "I've tried. It does think money is worth something but the part where money is worth whatever people will trade for it is important and debt just doesn't track that."

Permalink Mark Unread

"That reminds me of a story - I'm not sure I'm good enough at translation to do it justice or how," sigh, "expensive it would be -"

Permalink Mark Unread

Sad faery.

Permalink Mark Unread

"I would love to just accept some faery currency for it but I have no idea how to predict how much it would even be!"

Permalink Mark Unread

"It would be pretty surprising for a story to be worth more money than I have but stories from another world have a lot of potential to be more."

Permalink Mark Unread

"I also think you'd really like the story, does that matter or does it matter how objectively well written it originally was or how objectively good I am at translating it or at reading aloud -"

Permalink Mark Unread

"All of those kind of matter - not exactly how much I like it but how much I want it -"

Permalink Mark Unread

"Well that's just fucking perverse."

Permalink Mark Unread

Sad faery.

Permalink Mark Unread

"It's -" He looks it up. "It's less than thirty pages long in the original, with a page having yea much text -" He turns the computer.

Permalink Mark Unread

"We'll figure something out."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Does that mean I should go ahead now or circle back to it when we do figure something out?"

Permalink Mark Unread

"You should tell me the story and then later we'll figure something out."

Permalink Mark Unread

Cam makes a hard copy of The Cambist and Lord Iron and picks his way through it, translating the language and where essential to the story the cultural references.

Permalink Mark Unread

Enraptured faery.

Permalink Mark Unread

Wag wag wag. "- he named his protagonist Lord Iron," Cam concludes at the end.

Permalink Mark Unread

He has been listening the entire time with utter fascination and at several points bounced with glee. "...but I thought Lord Iron had abandoned his ways and become a moneychanger? How could he have been in all those places?"

Permalink Mark Unread

"- Olaf wrote fiction. This story, also, is fiction, which I... seem to have adequately disclaimed by identifying it as a 'fable of economics'? Or something would have happened? Non-faeries write a lot of fiction."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Huh. - you can retell stories you heard somewhere even if you're not persuaded they really happened. I've never heard of people using that to tell interesting stories that definitely didn't, though. 

 

The effect is very wonderful."

Permalink Mark Unread

"So I couldn't have read you this if I'd written it myself?"

Permalink Mark Unread

"...I mean maybe you could say, 'the following did not happen but is illustrative of a point:'. Feels like that'd work but I wouldn't personally try it."

Permalink Mark Unread

"I'd probably just be like, 'imagine that thus and such'?"

Permalink Mark Unread

"That's fine. Humans do it recreationally?"

Permalink Mark Unread

"As an overwhelmingly popular form of entertainment."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Gosh." He sighs. "It was lovely."

Permalink Mark Unread

Wag wag wag.

Permalink Mark Unread

"I don't really wish I were human because then I would have spent my life on a farm and died but -"

Permalink Mark Unread

"Yeah, this is not peak human, what you've got going on next d- next meta-fucking-phorical door."

Permalink Mark Unread

"They have so much potential."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Especially with us helping. Yeah."

Permalink Mark Unread

Permalink Mark Unread

 

 


"I think I might have time traveled," Cam says.

Permalink Mark Unread

" - huh. How far?"

Permalink Mark Unread

"Little over a thousand years."

Permalink Mark Unread

"They were approximately as impressive a thousand years ago, as far as I can determine. Maybe moreso."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Oh, yeah, thousand years ago they were I believe still doing the Roman Empire, that was pretty cool, but they get industrialized some several hundred years from now and then stuff gets cooler fast. Compared to progress rates among humans now. And there are so, so, so fucking many things I could be doing out there to make it better faster and I have no idea if doing that would prevent my own fucking existence thereby possibly destroying the entire universe in a paradox!

But in my time nobody knows faeries exist. So I think doing stuff among faeries is - safer - if I can figure out why nobody in my time knows you exist even under the condition that I spend a subjective million years among you doing stuff."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Does 'industrialized' by chance involve there being not much wilderness and lots of human-made places."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Yes, but there's still some, and if I am among you for a million years doing stuff I do not like to think I would let you go extinct!"

Permalink Mark Unread

"If there weren't faery rings then there might be no way for humans to discover us, and we don't know what causes faery rings. We should still exist as long as there are plants that dew gathers on, but we might be much harder to detect."

Permalink Mark Unread

"You don't think in a million years subjective any faeries will go poke humans? I guess maybe not if I'm sufficiently apocalyptic about the risk of doom."

Permalink Mark Unread

"If no one slows down then they can't have children. You could make them make some promises before they slowed down, though, if you had all the slowing crystals - or trusted all the people who did - or if there's some place where there aren't humans, where faeries could be -"

Permalink Mark Unread

"Underwater?"

Permalink Mark Unread

"Do you have some way we wouldn't drown?"

Permalink Mark Unread

"That's doable for humans at full size, I can't guarantee all the gas exchange works at speed or at shrink. Might also be detectable to future human instruments."

Permalink Mark Unread

"You couldn't really get everyone to go along with it anyway."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Not if there's twenty billion of you, not really."

Permalink Mark Unread

"It's good to know it gets better for them."

Permalink Mark Unread

"This could be an alternate universe instead. That would be much better. I won't know for sure till enough real time has passed that I can verify something to have changed where I'm from."

Permalink Mark Unread

"You'll want to figure it out before nightfall, if you can."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Why, what happens then?"

Permalink Mark Unread

"The process for slowing people down, if you can't settle all their debts, takes a night. Has to start at night, specifically. So if you miss it you'll have to stay another day."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Okay. I should be able to figure out a check to distinguish the stiuations in that time if there is one - how long does that leave me exactly -"

Permalink Mark Unread

"I don't keep very close track. We could go outside and check."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Good idea."

Permalink Mark Unread

So he pushes Cam's chair outside. 

It's mid-afternoon.

Permalink Mark Unread

"All right, that gives me a while. I should be able to check news sources on the time scale of a few sidereal hours and see if they're from later than they were when I left. And if they are, then that'll tell me that either this is an alternate universe, or this is a form of time travel that lets me pull information from the future and the future is fixed even after the point of traveler's exit."

Permalink Mark Unread

"And therefore it's safe to go do whatever you want with the humans?"

Permalink Mark Unread

"I hope so. I'd want to mull it over for a while first, make sure I'm not missing any coherent possibilities according to which that's still a really bad idea."

Permalink Mark Unread

Nod. "And what would you want to do with the humans?"

Permalink Mark Unread

"Eradicate a bunch of diseases, for starters. They're not literate enough yet that I can just teach them all to summon to eliminate scarcity but if I had a couple trustworthy humans available I could summon some daeva through them and make a lot of headway in an unfortunately centralized fashion."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Their existing rulers aren't much good."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Yes, I know. Bad human rulers are really bad."

Permalink Mark Unread

"You think you can do better?"

Permalink Mark Unread

"I mean, the locals probably have me beat on things like the perceived legitimacy of their dynasties and, uh, Papal approval or whatever? But I'm conveniently unassasinable and probably the moral superior of anyone currently sitting on a throne."

Permalink Mark Unread

He makes a thoughtful noise.

Permalink Mark Unread

"What?"

Permalink Mark Unread

"Just more momentous than most choices we usually make."

Permalink Mark Unread

"I suppose it is. Anyway, I don't think the first fifteen things I did would involve taking formal political control. Like, thing one is malaria, do you have any idea how many people die of fucking malaria? I could get it on its way to gone in a day."

Permalink Mark Unread

"What is malaria?"

Permalink Mark Unread

"It's a disease that may have killed as many as half of all humans who have ever lived!"

Permalink Mark Unread

"You'll have to back up more, what's a disease?"

Permalink Mark Unread

"- you don't know what a disease is? Your brother had medicines for humans on his wishlist, even if you guys are always fine."

Permalink Mark Unread

"I don't really have an interesting in keeping humans, personally, I haven't done much reading about keeping them alive."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Okay, well, diseases are... kind of like numerous very very tiny injuries or poisonings that add up into a general unwellness, discomfort, and loss of functioning, which are caused by very very tiny creatures or by malnourishment or by other stuff. Malaria's the tiny creature kind, there is a tiny creature that mosquitoes transmit when they bite people."

Permalink Mark Unread

He nods. "Would they stop dying, if the technology of the future was available?"

Permalink Mark Unread

"No, humans in the future still die, but they live a lot longer and are way less likely to die young. Also they get an afterlife."

Permalink Mark Unread

"An afterlife, like, something happens once they die?"

Permalink Mark Unread

"Yup! Depends on the person."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Huh. Does something happen to faeries when we die?"

Permalink Mark Unread

"Good question. Name somebody dead."

Permalink Mark Unread

"- I don't know the names of any dead people. My grandmother is dead?"

Permalink Mark Unread

"- right, names. Which grandmother?"

Permalink Mark Unread

"My father's mother."

Permalink Mark Unread

Where is she now.

Permalink Mark Unread

She is not, now.

Permalink Mark Unread

"I can't get her but that might just mean that she's inherently magical in some way, I can't do your crystals either."

Permalink Mark Unread

Nod. "Can you do us?"

Permalink Mark Unread

Tiny Econ Faery?

Permalink Mark Unread

This works fine.

Permalink Mark Unread

"Looks like."

Permalink Mark Unread

Nod. "I'm glad there's something for the humans."

Permalink Mark Unread

"It's mostly not a great something but I think for most people it's better than nothing."

Permalink Mark Unread

"What's wrong with it?"

Permalink Mark Unread

"Dead humans generally go to Limbo. Limbo is an infinite flat plane, with a day cycle of normal length but no specific sun location. That's it. The humans are as indestructible as I am, but have no further powers, and each of them gets one thing which is not a person and does not... imply people. So they might get their favorite dog, also indestructible, or a building, likewise - you can get bits off these things, if you want to slowly harvest roof tiles and pews from an indestructible church they'll come back eventually, but it's not quick and not everyone has something usefully farmable."

Permalink Mark Unread

"That sounds...all right but kind of the way faeryland is all right. A way people can be but not, like, the most exciting one."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Yeah. Plus people appear in random locations so it's hard to find anyone you knew."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Huh. The same thing of - not unrelated to things people care about, but not right."

Permalink Mark Unread

"You know, it is sort of like that."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Mysterious."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Anyway, some humans turn into daeva when we die." Cam waves.

Permalink Mark Unread

"That sounds like more fun?"

Permalink Mark Unread

"It is! We get powers. Fairyland's a lot more interesting than Limbo; Heaven and Hell aren't especially but the magic lets us spruce them up to taste."

Permalink Mark Unread

"I'd ask what they're like but your story was in fact very expensive."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Sorry. Does it have a knowable monetary value or do you just keep handing me coins or whatever you've got till it seems like we're done?"

Permalink Mark Unread

"We haven't been thinking of the coins as having a fixed value but if I give you all but one of them we'll be even."

Permalink Mark Unread

"- all but one is an interesting number."

Permalink Mark Unread

"I stopped asking questions when we got to 'all of them' and then you asked me how much the debt was."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Oh."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Within a court you can sometimes run a balance without it causing problems but my brother doesn't want us to run a balance with you right now."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Well, I suppose you could tell me a story. Oh, I also want to know about what experiments with money you've thus far performed, I have a really abbreviated version of that."

Permalink Mark Unread

"I mostly checked whether you could influence the innate value-for-debt of an object by establishing peoples' willingness to use it as a medium of exchange. You can, but it doesn't adopt the new value, it lands somewhere in between."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Well, yeah, but what did you do, exactly?"

Permalink Mark Unread

"I had someone sit there being willing to accept the coins in exchange for favors worth more than the coins. I had someone else hand a third person the coins. I checked how much debt was involved in the transfer. I did that when the third person knew about the exchange and when they didn't, and with varying levels of difference between the value of the favors and the value of the coins. Everyone involved knew I'd make them even at the end of the experiment, which might've affected it.

I was going to try it again with a human if we ever got one and see if that changed anything."

Permalink Mark Unread

"I can ask the human if she'll play. I probably count as human for the purpose but I've got more going on."

Permalink Mark Unread

"She'd be really useful and I'll come up with some more stories for you for it."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Do I have to accept things on her behalf in general? She might want something."

Permalink Mark Unread

"I mean you're welcome to pass things along to her but I think if I borrow your, uh, person the debt'll accumulate to you even if you're doing a human thing where she gets to decide things. Maybe not, I haven't encountered that before."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Why would it accumulate to me? Neither she nor I is a faery, shouldn't the system not really be tracking stuff between us?"

Permalink Mark Unread

"You bought her from my brother. We'd be thinking of it as a favor from you - I guess we could not think of it that way and see if that works."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Seems like the obvious thing to try - does it often matter how people think about things -"

Permalink Mark Unread

"There are plenty of things you can reasonably think of as a favor to one of two different people and it'll count as the one everyone agrees on."

Permalink Mark Unread

"What if everyone doesn't agree?"

Permalink Mark Unread

"There are defaults. By default if I borrow your - someone of yours with your leave that'd be a favor from you if we're both faeries. By default if you answer my question that's a favor for me, but I could specify that I'm asking for my brother and then it can count for him."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Are you avoiding the word 'slave'?"

Permalink Mark Unread

"Yes."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Why?"

Permalink Mark Unread

"I heard you found it objectionable. Not the word, the concept, but - they go together."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Yes, I consider the idea of owning people in general objectionable."

Permalink Mark Unread

Nod.

Permalink Mark Unread

"I think I've made a reasonably credible effort to make it clear to her that she can get sent off to be slowed down and take a bunch of presents with her if she does, should she ever wish to, so I think in spite of the fact that I'm surrounded by people who wouldn't try to stop me if I decided to do traditional ownership related things I do not in fact own her."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Why doesn't she want to slow down?"

Permalink Mark Unread

"She doesn't have, or at least doesn't perceive herself to have, particularly good options among humans."

Permalink Mark Unread

"I don't particularly approve of taking humans who don't know what all they're agreeing to but I can't really see - being someone's best option - as a kind of wrongdoing so long as you didn't screw around with their other options."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Mm... I mean, you could imagine someone whose other options were all so bad that they'd take whatever you were planning, plus some gratuitous extra nastiness, and you'd still be better, but that doesn't excuse the gratuitous extra nastiness to my mind, and by a similar token I think there's a level of due diligence called for in my situation with her above and beyond what's required to be better than her best alternative to negotiated agreement."

Permalink Mark Unread

"And if that - due diligence - made it not worth your bother then so much the worse for her?"

Permalink Mark Unread

"I mean, in the sense that if I were stretched really thin and could not help but fail in some of my obligations then some of my obligations would get failed in, yes? What do you mean?"

Permalink Mark Unread

"It just seems like your rule is that lots of mutually beneficial arrangements shouldn't happen on account of not benefitting one party enough."

Permalink Mark Unread

"I don't think that's a consequence of what I've said? Where's that coming from?"

Permalink Mark Unread

"So if, say, you vanish, and the human comes to me and says 'hey I prefer staying with you to being slowed down', and has a reasonably accurate picture of what I want, and this sounds good to me, and we agree, and we proceed, then a bad thing happened, right?"

Permalink Mark Unread

"Sounds like it to me."

Permalink Mark Unread

"That's what I mean about mutually beneficial transactions that shouldn't happen in your account of things."

Permalink Mark Unread

"The bad thing that happened is mostly me disappearing! Obviously that would be bad, since if she preferred you she could announce that without my having to disappear."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Oh! The rest is fine, given that happened, and given I didn't orchestrate it or something?"

Permalink Mark Unread

"Probably but it might reflect poorly on your character?"

Permalink Mark Unread

"Hmm."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Like, there's obviously better and worse situations that could happen to be her best option? You seem great but I know very little about your personal habits but let's assume those are also within your cultural norms great. If she instead wound up in a court where the nicest person around who'd take her were in my sense of the word a worse person, then that would be worse; and so how bad the situation winds up for her is informative about how good a person you are."

Permalink Mark Unread

"I think I'm not sure what 'a good person' is doing if it's not describing which actions are permissible."

Permalink Mark Unread

"It's doing that and then also assigning extra credit for ones that give impermissibility a wider berth, and for bonus positive effects one generates!"

Permalink Mark Unread

"Huh."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Hm?"

Permalink Mark Unread

"It's just not how I'm accustomed to thinking about things."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Yeah, that makes sense. It's really cool that you got, like, as close as you did? You have vision! I just have, you know, a thousand years of cultural development without debt baggage behind me."

Permalink Mark Unread

"There's something about  -- so there's the basic concept, that everyone should know what agreements they're making and what their alternatives are -- and it gets you really, really far! And I'm suspicious about adding things on top of it."

Permalink Mark Unread

"The basic concept does get you really far, but like, you've noticed humans have invented money by now and it hasn't solved all their problems? And only part of this is the fact that summoners are scarce."

Permalink Mark Unread

"I think most humans are slaves. I'm not sure of it because we mostly get everything second or thirdhand but I think they mostly are."

Permalink Mark Unread

"I think they might technically be serfs which is at least a little less hands-on but my knowledge of this century is pretty lacking. Anyway, slavery isn't incompatible with having a functioning economy, at least depending on how it's practiced."

Permalink Mark Unread

"How's that?"

Permalink Mark Unread

"Even assuming you rule out generational slavery and taking prisoners of war and stuff? You just construe people as things they themselves can sell. Then they get into debt - of the ordinary financial kind - and bam."

Permalink Mark Unread

"That doesn't seem objectionable."

Permalink Mark Unread

"I thought you might say that."

Permalink Mark Unread

"I could be persuaded that humans are different in some way that makes it not a good policy for them but - mostly by being very condescending. For example you could persuade me that they are mostly very stupid and should be treated like children."

Permalink Mark Unread

"So, I don't think it's that humans are stupid, though it seems likely that most of them are stupider than you especially when they're malnourished. I think it's that humans are worse at a lot of things under certain kinds of stress, and having 'falling into debt slavery' as a thing that can feasibly happen to them is one such stressor. Also it'd make precisely the smarter people really nervous about using financial instruments that still work at most of their purposes when you allow people to declare bankruptcy."

Permalink Mark Unread

"I mean if someone's useful then the smart thing to do if they are your slave is let them do whatever they'd do normally and make them give you half, which is not a very terrible state of affairs to be risking."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Something terrible happening to people should they ever cease to be useful is also a stressor even on currently useful people. Remember how even in the future humans still die? There's a period of decline before that, if nothing else, and there's usually something else. And that's in roughly the ideal case of the proposed system as opposed to any particularly exploitative corners. You can do lighter versions of this, like training somebody in a job on the condition that they give you ten percent of what they make at the job for a while, without it being bad, but if it gets too steep humans wind up having problems."

Permalink Mark Unread

"I am worried that in a system where everyone just did sufficiently friendly things no one would...actually want to trade with any humans, once their novelty wore off. Lots of faery courts don't consider humans worth it now, and that's without any restrictions at all on what you can use them for."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Hm, I suppose that's possible, I'm not aware of any fundamental capabilities humans have that you do not and you could get all their cultural output by reading over their shoulders if you felt like it."

Permalink Mark Unread

"My father does that sometimes. He has pieced together most of the book about Jesus that is very important to them."

Permalink Mark Unread

"It's called the Bible."

Permalink Mark Unread

"I was more confused about it before you explained humans make up stories sometimes."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Oh, they think it's true, I think in this time period probably they think that it's literally true. It is however mostly not."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Huh. That makes sense. Someone should probably tell them? I'd want to know."

Permalink Mark Unread

"They have wars about that. It's ugly."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Huh."

Permalink Mark Unread

"It calms down as science improves but I wouldn't characterize the process as smooth."

Permalink Mark Unread

"It seems like a dumb thing to have wars over."

Permalink Mark Unread

"So, they sort of use the book as the basis for a lot of cultural scaffolding to underly a lot of social technology they don't have good replacements for yet, and find threats to the belief system accordingly disproportionately horrendous. Plus - I'm basing all this on extremely vague memories of history information which was mostly not about this century in particular so it's imprecise and will not be perfectly accurate, but there's also a thing where they are mistaken about the afterlife and think it is good for people who believe their thing and do their stuff and bad for people who do not, and given certain assumptions about how much you can bully others into believing your thing and doing your stuff this makes it arguably humanitarian to attempt to do so."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Huh, okay. - I should stop asking questions." He sounds very sad about this.

Permalink Mark Unread

"I'm sorry! I keep trying to ask you things as stuff comes up but I have no sense of what's worth how much and I'm not used to trying to balance things. Do I get to decide how much I value the service of wheeling me back to my room, or anything -"

Permalink Mark Unread

"No. For most services, there's a fixed value. There are some where it matters how much you want it and some where it matters what your alternatives are but realistically if I don't wheel you back someone else will come do it so that's not working for us here."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Well. It probably still helps at all, right? - anybody ever quantify these values? It'd be interesting if they changed over time or varied culturally at all!"

Permalink Mark Unread

"There are a couple different scales that have been put out in different places. Most things are the same across cultures compared to the other things in the scales that were published, but I haven't actually travelled very far and can only guess as to whether they're the same in absolute amounts. Some acts of service and some sex acts vary in value by which cultural associations they have. Theft costs more in societies that consider it a particularly grave matter, no idea which way the causality goes there as those tend to also be societies where courts have more people in an area and theft is much socially costlier."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Why's theft socially costlier in crowded places?"

Permalink Mark Unread

"Nontrivial to figure out who did it and more separate debts incurred - theft from community stores is debt to everyone - which has more overhead to manage. Also some courts in the Misty Isles are more or less limited in population by how much dew they'll reliably have and when they're low on dew, stealing means someone could starve."

Permalink Mark Unread

Cam makes a little globe and points at Ireland. "This the Misty Isles here?"

Permalink Mark Unread

"Yes, how'd you guess?"

Permalink Mark Unread

"My timeline's got faery stories. We wound up pasting the word for faeries in several languages onto the mover kind of daeva though."

Permalink Mark Unread

"How accurate are the stories?"

Permalink Mark Unread

"...mostly not but enough that I got really suspicious when the first court I met wanted me to eat some food."

Permalink Mark Unread

"If your world did not have faeries how would it have gotten faery stories?"

Permalink Mark Unread

"I'm not sure. It could be an alternate universe that just in fact also has faeries, the stories could be a coincidence, I could not be the only person traveling between the universes..."

Permalink Mark Unread

Nod.

Permalink Mark Unread

 

"Hey, does my theoretical ability to counterfeit affect the value of your money?"

Permalink Mark Unread

"I don't know! We should check after I've given it all to you and not before, because if it makes it worthless I will be in trouble."

Permalink Mark Unread

"I said theoretical, I can't stop having the theoretical ability! I am interested in checking whether the actual practice changes the results though."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Okay! We will find out if the theoretical ability affects the results when I give you the coins, and we should check whether the actual practice does some time after that."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Okay."

Permalink Mark Unread

He wheels him back to his room.

Permalink Mark Unread

"Hey Auda," Cam says, "do you want any things from faeries? It would be convenient to have a human participating in some economic experiments."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Uh," she says, looking back and forth between them.

Permalink Mark Unread

"Not like right this second, just does it sound like something you might ever feel like doing."

Permalink Mark Unread

"I'd be happy to. I would appreciate some time to think about what I might want in exchange."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Take all the time you need and 'no, I require no faery services' is a completely fine answer," Cam assures her.

Permalink Mark Unread

"It is! ...but they're really neat economics experiments and I think you'd have fun!"

Permalink Mark Unread

"They sound lovely and I'll think about it as soon as I'm unoccupied."

Permalink Mark Unread

"I'll go get the coins for you," he says to Cam.

Permalink Mark Unread

"Thanks!"

Permalink Mark Unread

He heads out.

Permalink Mark Unread

"I should probably have waited for him to leave before asking that, sorry," Cam says.

Permalink Mark Unread

"It's all right. 'm not going to fall apart if they want me to make myself useful here."

Permalink Mark Unread

"It's not like that. You're covered. You don't have to do anything for them. There are just apparently things you could do if you wanted anything I can't supply or if you got bored with sewing."

Permalink Mark Unread

"I'm also not going to fall apart if you want me to make myself useful here."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Look, I'm currently very frustrated that I can't so much as answer most people's questions around here without having to find things they can do to pay me back. I have the opposite of a need to get people to make themselves useful here."

Permalink Mark Unread

 

"Even when there aren't any faeries involved eventually most people want to be - able to count on the people they're stuck spending lots of time with to make themselves useful occasionally. Not any - particular thing necessarily but I think usually it's bad for everyone when there are no things."

Permalink Mark Unread

"I can actually think of something I might need a human for in the future. But it is not this thing today, this thing today is optional, and even if I do need a human for something I would rather shop around for interested humans than stick you with stuff you'd sooner go 'nope' to. I guess it would seem sort of antagonistic if I ever, like, asked you to roll me across the room and you were like 'ahahaha no I don't have to do what you say'? If that's the kind of thing you mean? But like even if you did that I would feed you because pettily declining to perform a service would not deserve either of starvation or a return to faery slavery."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Everyone starves if they don't work, that's - how food works."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Not when I have anything to say about it it isn't."

Permalink Mark Unread

"I also want to do favors for you. Because you've been good to me.

- that doesn't really apply to very many favors, the wanting to, because I think I'm kind of easily scared of everything right now but I think it does extend to helping your friend with money experiments."

Permalink Mark Unread

"That seems like a valid reason to help with money experiments! I'm hoping if we learn enough about how faery debt interacts with money we can find a way to cheat outrageously at faery debt and just have money instead."

Permalink Mark Unread

"That sounds neat."

Permalink Mark Unread

"I think so too!"

Permalink Mark Unread

He comes back with his coins.

Permalink Mark Unread

"What do you call the unit of currency? Does it subdivide? Did you ever get as far as considering increasing the money supply and who should do that how much when? Am I correct in thinking that if you still own more than one coin it will be easier to perform experiments?"

Permalink Mark Unread

"I've just been calling them coins. You can cut them up but I haven't, and I'm not sure I was ever relevantly intending to if it came up. Small debt overages in either direction aren't a big deal, they even out over time, below a certain threshold no one minds unless they're unusually particular. I can't increase the money supply very straightforwardly, these are human-made and we can't mine metal, but if it'd worked maybe I would've started using something we did have the power to make. 

- might help to keep more than one."

He keeps three.

Permalink Mark Unread

"Why can't you mine metal?"

Permalink Mark Unread

"We don't know where to find it or have the territory rights to wherever it is or have the means to get it out or have the means to shape it."

Permalink Mark Unread

"But you got the coins? What do you do, collect them off humans who enter circles?" He examines the coins.

Permalink Mark Unread

"Mostly other courts do that and then we trade for them. It was an interest of my father's before I was even around, but he didn't know what the humans used them for."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Huh, I wouldn't think that would be especially hard to figure out as things you can learn by watching very slow humans go about their business go but I'm probably overestimating how often they come into play in this century or something like that." Are these all of one denomination?

Permalink Mark Unread

They are not. They're not even all from the same system of coinage. Lots of different faces.

Permalink Mark Unread

"We know they traded them. We thought they might be magic, or useful for the metal and stamped only to indicate weight."

Permalink Mark Unread

"I don't happen to know the relative value of these but I'd be astonished if they were all the same and in particular the type of metal probably makes a big difference."

Permalink Mark Unread

"I can order them by how much the debt system thinks they're worth."


He does this. It mostly tracks how precious humans would consider the metals, though it also seems relevant how pretty the coin is and there's at least one other factor that's harder to guess from looking - maybe something to do with which of these are currently in circulation among humans in this area?

Permalink Mark Unread

"That's close to what I'd guess but not exact -" Cam looks up what he can find about the relative values of all the materials he can identify.

Permalink Mark Unread

Yep, close but slightly different.

Permalink Mark Unread

"In particular -" He moves coins that should rightly be a bit to the left in the line down a bit.

Permalink Mark Unread

He frowns. "Huh. I wonder if the magic is taking into account what the humans think or mostly agrees with the humans about some other property of the universe. Or if the humans are noticing the magic, I guess, though they don't think they are."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Doubt it," Cam agrees. "Are the proportions about right, I wonder -" He makes a little balance and starts weighing coins of like metal.

Permalink Mark Unread

Again, clearly correlated with the debt system's opinions but imperfectly.

Permalink Mark Unread

Cam reports on this to see if that has any effect.

Permalink Mark Unread

It does not. "The information I'd expect to affect how much it's worth is anything that changes how much one of us wants it, or information about the ease of getting a replacement."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Are we out of things that should be checked before I start counterfeiting?"

Permalink Mark Unread

"I'd be curious whether anything happens if you promised not to counterfeit one in particular until sunset, or something. But you don't want to do that if there's any chance you'll forget you said so."

Permalink Mark Unread

"There's any chance."

Permalink Mark Unread

"It's not that important. I think it'd work but I wouldn't learn that much either way."

Permalink Mark Unread

Cam picks up a little copper one. "How about I make a this and we see what happens?"

Permalink Mark Unread

"Sounds good!"

Permalink Mark Unread

Now there are two.

Permalink Mark Unread

The debt system believes this makes both of them considerably less valuable.

Permalink Mark Unread

"But it didn't affect the other denominations?"

Permalink Mark Unread

He checks. "Nope."

Permalink Mark Unread

Cam dupes the same one again. "Any further effect?"

Permalink Mark Unread

He moves them around - "yep, declined again, but not as much as last time."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Can I get you to loosely graph that -" Cam offers him a piece of paper.

Permalink Mark Unread

"Sorry, to what -"

Permalink Mark Unread

"- heck. Are we in trouble if I explain what graphs are."

Permalink Mark Unread

He looks forlornly at his pile of coins. "You could have my brother sing for you? He's very good at it."

Permalink Mark Unread

"And then you can - work that all out between the two of you? Or it just doesn't matter as much since you're family or something?"

Permalink Mark Unread

"Running sizable debts within a court is less of a big deal and if it got big enough to become one we could settle it internally, yeah."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Okay. Introduction to graphs." Cam appears a simple coordinate plane on the paper. "This line represents what's called an independent variable, something that changes and affects other stuff as it does - such as in this case number of this kind of coin in existence -" Tickmarks for one, two, three. "And then the other line represents whatever thing is changing in response, that you want to track, such as the value of the coin... does it happen to be a convenient fraction of any of the coins that's currently enjoying a fixed value?"

Permalink Mark Unread

"I guess it's around half of this one?"

Permalink Mark Unread

"Okay!" So he marks the Y axis accordingly. "When there was just one how much was it worth relative to that kind?"

Permalink Mark Unread

"If you took its initial value and its current value together it'd be worth twice as much as that kind."

Permalink Mark Unread

"- oh, uh, this dot here means it's - I might need to explain decimals. Unless you already have ways of representing partial things? I didn't get literacy with this language when I was summoned so I don't know."

Permalink Mark Unread

"We have the words for halves and thirds?"

Permalink Mark Unread

"Okay, I can write it as fractions instead -" He whites out the .5s. "So I'd write 'one half' as a one over a horizontal line over a two, because it's one of two parts of a whole, and one third as a one over a three, and so on. And you can also write ones over fours, or sevens over twenty-threes, or whatever you want, but this graph is not quite that sophisticated." Half and quarter marks appear.

Permalink Mark Unread

"Okay, then.,.. it would've been worth one and a half, before you made one. And maybe a half and a third, when there were two of them."

Permalink Mark Unread

"- a half plus a third?" Cam asks, marking (1, 1.5).

Permalink Mark Unread

"Yeah."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Five sixths," says Cam, adding more tickmarks and placing a dot. "Now it's half, you said?"

Permalink Mark Unread

"About half, yeah. I think it's actually a little bit more."

Permalink Mark Unread

A dot slightly higher than the half tickmark appears. "Now if I connect these three dots with a line -" A curve appears. "- I can guess how much it might be next time I make one." Line appears faintly extended toward the x-axis 4 position. "Let's see if I'm right." Coin!

Permalink Mark Unread

" - about a third as much the reference coin, now."

Permalink Mark Unread

Cam marks that! "Not too far off."

Permalink Mark Unread

"I think - I'm not sure yet and we should graph more of them but what it feels like is - when there's one it gets a bonus for being unique, and then not counting that bonus you'd have a curve, only it's about to level out near the value that the things will have when there's thousands of them."

Permalink Mark Unread

"- but surely these aren't in fact unique, they're just unique locally? Actually it's a little odd you don't have any duplicates to start with, I guess people don't carry much cash..."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Unique in this court, or maybe unique in faeryland. I think things we can't get at don't matter much. If you dropped those in the ocean I'm sure they'd stop affecting anything."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Huh. - I wonder if bills with different serial numbers distinct only in that way would count as unique."

Permalink Mark Unread

"I don't know. .... we could test it."

Permalink Mark Unread

American dollar bill and a fresh graph.

Permalink Mark Unread

The universe thinks that this object is not very valuable. "I think the paper'd be worth more without the markings."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Maybe it's because it's fiat and the issuing government is not nearby."

Permalink Mark Unread

"That might do it."

Permalink Mark Unread

Does the system like solid copper pennies?

Permalink Mark Unread

Likes them better than the dollars.

Permalink Mark Unread

"That's funny because the bill is supposed to be worth a hundred of these."

Permalink Mark Unread

"If we set up a government willing to exchange the bill for a hundred of the coins it'll be worth more. Not a hundred times more, though, I don't expect."

Permalink Mark Unread

What does the system think of quarters and dimes and nickels?

Permalink Mark Unread

Orders them by the value of the metal (nickel, quarter, penny, dime).

Permalink Mark Unread

"Huh. I assume when these denominations were issued it was connected to the metal's scarcity at the time, but this isn't the order of their value..."

Permalink Mark Unread

"When were they issued?"

Permalink Mark Unread

"I'd need to look it up. Hundreds of years from now. But none of them are aluminum, that's the one I know gets way easier to get ahold of in the future."

Permalink Mark Unread

"I don't know what this is going off. Faeries don't make much use of metal."

Permalink Mark Unread

What does the system think of this aluminum coin Cam just made up?

Permalink Mark Unread

Very impressive!

Permalink Mark Unread

"If it likes aluminum, it might be deriving some information from current human mining capacities. Like, after aluminum gets easier to handle it's not hard to find and people use it for disposable drink containers."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Huh. 

 

I think if you were to have a currency faeries used, you'd want a metal that can't be mined anywhere, if there are any of those, and varied beautiful designs with no two the same, and then once you had enough of them almost all of its value would be from stable sources of value and people could predict how much they were worth."

Permalink Mark Unread

"There are metals you have to synthesize but they're radioactive, which might be harmless to you, I don't know, but could harm nearby human and animal and plant populations. Also they decay into other metals over... time periods that might conceivably be functional at this speed, if it were ever useful to have your money diminish by half every thirty realtime hours, or something?"

Permalink Mark Unread

"That sounds really neat but not at all useful for this purpose. - what about the metal that made the balls in your cage, is that mined?"

Permalink Mark Unread

"I think so, though it's rare. Why, is it valuable?"

Permalink Mark Unread

"I think it would be if we could cut or move it."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Even though I made kind of a lot of it?"

Permalink Mark Unread

"I mean presumably it'd be even more valuable if you had only made a little of it."

Permalink Mark Unread

"There are some minerals you can't mine at all which aren't radioactive?"

Permalink Mark Unread

"Ooooh."

Permalink Mark Unread

Cam looks up some minerals and makes a synthetic garnet.

Permalink Mark Unread

The universe is of the opinion that this is worth a lot of debt.

Permalink Mark Unread

Cam makes himself a cute wooden box to store all his valuable items in.

Permalink Mark Unread

"We should probably stop," he says regretfully.

Permalink Mark Unread

"- okay. Sorry. I can listen to your brother give a concert after I've given the human some food."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Thank you."

Permalink Mark Unread

"You're welcome." Auda gets a bowl of pasta and veggies and chicken and sauce. "Is now good, do you wanna take me to him?"

Permalink Mark Unread

"Now should be fine, yeah."

Permalink Mark Unread

Cam leans over to grab his violin just in case.

Permalink Mark Unread

And he takes Cam to another one of the little wood houses. This one has a very thick door. He knocks.

Permalink Mark Unread

"Hello." He looks at Cam curiously. 

Permalink Mark Unread

"Can you sing for him?"

Permalink Mark Unread

"Of course."

Permalink Mark Unread

"You can run it a little farther than even, we don't have anything else for him."

Permalink Mark Unread

- nod. "You did the instruments?"

Permalink Mark Unread

"I did! They were for you?"

Permalink Mark Unread

"Yep!"

Permalink Mark Unread

"Your life story is the best argument I have ever heard for music piracy, by the way."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Music piracy?"

Permalink Mark Unread

"With more technology available it's possible to record music - so it plays, not just writing it down - and it's possible to copy the music recordings, and there was for a while a fairly live cultural debate about whether you should do that without compensating the musicians, but it turns out that if you insist on perfectly compensating everybody for music performance you wind up having to take away small children's toy flutes and that's a fucking tragedy!"

Permalink Mark Unread

"- huh. I'm not - generally miserable or anything. It'd be nice if people could listen, but," he shrugs. 

Permalink Mark Unread

"If you were a human - uh, if you were a human in what I construe as the modern era - you could play to crowds of thousands and then a few billion people could download the recording! I'm assuming you've improved since you were yea high, I apparently am good enough at violin to count and I don't command audiences like that, but like, at a guess."

Permalink Mark Unread

 

"That would be pretty amazing."

Permalink Mark Unread

"But anyway, here I am, fountain of unlimited value and you the apparently most convenient value sink." Wag.

Permalink Mark Unread

"Happy to help. They all seem very frustrated."

Permalink Mark Unread

"I am too! Serenade me and let's see how unfrustrated we can get."

Permalink Mark Unread

So he sings something.

Permalink Mark Unread

It's pretty! Cam jots down occasional notes on motifs he likes.

Permalink Mark Unread

He sings until he's a little past the debt. It takes a while even though he's very good at singing. 

Permalink Mark Unread

"I assume it'd be super counterproductive if I turned right around and showed you any music I know."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Well, it'd mean I'd have to show you some more."

Permalink Mark Unread

"I suppose that's true! And I did bring my violin. - I haven't had to turn pages for so long, what have I got memorized..." This Beethoven sonata!

Permalink Mark Unread

He's fascinated.

Permalink Mark Unread

"Do you have musical notation?" Cam asks when the sonata concludes.

Permalink Mark Unread

"I take notes for myself so I can remember complicated things. If you play that one once more I'd have it, though, I think - it's beautiful -"

Permalink Mark Unread

"Wow, that's really fast memorization - uh, do you want to compare the cost of one more playthrough with the cost of the sheet music, and then decide if you wanna invest in learning to read the sheet music since I can produce lots in the same format?"

Permalink Mark Unread

"I'm not worried about the cost, I'll pay you back assuming you'll sit for it. And possibly if you won't, I'm not sure what terms you're on with my brother there - I want to learn sheet music."

Permalink Mark Unread

"I'm happy to listen to lots of music but since you can apparently pay back other people's debts I'm worried it would add up and there's only so much time!" He sheet-musics the sonata. "There's the one I just played."

Permalink Mark Unread

"How does this work -"

Permalink Mark Unread

So Cam explains the clef and time signature and note letter names and note values and sharps and flats and all the Italian.

Permalink Mark Unread

He's so happy!!

Permalink Mark Unread

Awww.

Permalink Mark Unread

And then he can show Cam what he can do on the instruments he's invented, which are less good than a violin although he's very inventive with them.

Permalink Mark Unread

That's really cool! "Have you been working all alone or can you get close enough to even if you meet another musician...?"

Permalink Mark Unread

"I've worked with a couple other people from time to time. When I can get even or when they owe us something anyway. Or if we want them in debt and they're cooperating with that but that's rarer."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Why does that happen at all?"

Permalink Mark Unread

"I mean, there're ways to get people into more debt if they're in debt and you're willing to be aggressive about it. So if you've established that's what you're going to do, some people will prefer doing it through collaborative music to doing it through being forcefed or sitting in a cage while I play at them or whatever."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Okay, but when is that desirable as an outcome?"

Permalink Mark Unread

"If you're trading them back to their court and want it to be expensive and the circumstances are such that their court won't be outraged by this, or if you're executing them."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Ah."

Permalink Mark Unread

He taps his baby grand piano, trying Beethoven on it.

Permalink Mark Unread

"I don't actually play piano but I do know the sheet music for piano pieces involves two clefs, one for each hand."

Permalink Mark Unread

"That makes a lot of sense but I think I'll need some practice to coordinate them like that - ideally you'd have them doing different things -"

Permalink Mark Unread

"Yes, my understanding is that it's tricky at first."

Permalink Mark Unread

"It's a wonderful concept for an instrument, though."

Permalink Mark Unread

"It was considered an improvement on prior keyboards because it allowed more dynamic variation! - is volunteering fun facts like that pricey?"

Permalink Mark Unread

"Not if I wasn't asking, for a broad definition of asking, but that I wouldn't even have thought to ask, see."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Oh good."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Anything where you're communicating the desire for more information counts as asking. Sharing other information is fine though if you do it in some contexts, people will think you're trying to hit on a question they'll be counted as having asked."

Permalink Mark Unread

"I'm not doing that, I'm just clueless and generous of spirit."

Permalink Mark Unread

"I gathered. And picky about payment, but we'll make do."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Is that what they're calling it."

Permalink Mark Unread

"My red-haired brother said that you make all your own material objects for yourself and the girl and you didn't want us and you asked a lot of questions but they were still rather behind."

Permalink Mark Unread

"I also made a bunch of material objects for the court to buy the human out on account of objecting to slavery!"

Permalink Mark Unread

"Yes, sorry, I did also hear that the piano was part of the payment for her and it's a wonderful piano and I'm glad you did. You obviously don't owe us more, it's just - inconvenient."

Permalink Mark Unread

"I wasn't objecting on the grounds that you sounded like you were pestering me for more, I'm actually really annoyed about the thing where how much stuff I can give out is capped artificially."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Yes, I feel similarly."

Permalink Mark Unread

"But I think even if I were super into the indebted fairy concept it would be hard to keep up with 'arbitrary material objects'."

Permalink Mark Unread

"If you liked the concept you could run a very wealthy court of people curated to be safe to have very deeply in your debt and then be as generous as you liked with them."

Permalink Mark Unread

"I suppose."

Permalink Mark Unread

"I think that's what I'd do if I could pull it off."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Inconveniently your method of mass debt distribution doesn't result in wealth."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Yeah." Shrug. "And you don't want to run a court. Only fools say the universe cares what makes us happy."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Is there anyone quite that foolish running around?"

Permalink Mark Unread

"Probably somewhere."

Permalink Mark Unread

Snort.

Permalink Mark Unread

"It's not wise to say 'no one would', there are so many people!"

Permalink Mark Unread

"An estimated twenty billion, I hear! That's about as many as there are humans and daeva put together in my time or universe whichever it is."

Permalink Mark Unread

"There are stories from back when there were very few faeries and the culture sounds so different! People just leaving to avoid dealing with debts was far more common."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Did that cause a lot of messes?"

Permalink Mark Unread

"Yes, fascinating ones, sometimes centuries later."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Are the stories written down or do I have to have it recited aloud?"

Permalink Mark Unread

"My father writes down a lot of things but I don't know which stories he's gotten to, and it can't be all of them. I can tell one, if you'd like."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Sure, go for it."

Permalink Mark Unread

"So it is told that long ago when the world was younger and the rulers of men were different, there were two courts, and they were named for the places where they made their homes, Great Oak and Berry Forest, for in those days no two courts would share a forest, or a valley, or a bend in a river, and every court claimed more land than they could surveil, imagining that this would make them great and knowing rightly that it made them more able to gather food when it was scarce. And they dealt with trespassers lightly, as they could not prevent them and cared not to negotiate every passage through each others' land, and debts grew up between them but not with either court ever too far above the other, and so they thought they were of no concern. 

And then one faery of the court of Great Oak, called the Traitorous, tired of his obligations and slipped away in the night, and left the Misty Isles entirely to wander other isles, and his court was confused but did not seek him very far, and barely noted that he'd been much in the debt of the other court for his trespasses.

And at some other date, two faeries of the court of Berry Forest left, and it's not known where they went and it can only be inferred what they did there.

Winters passed, and the court of Berry Forest started to experience ill fortune. Lightning struck and killed someone, and they thought that perhaps he'd spoken unwisely - which shouldn't have done it, with no one to hear it, but they didn't know that. Then plants got sick, and shriveled over the course of days, and died. Then a boar crashed through the forest, killing many other plants, and was killed itself, and attracted scavenger animals, and the bush ravaged by these events. And they said that it might have been coincidence, but the court of Great Oak decided to settle all its debts, and track them more cautiously in future, and brought many gifts to assist their friends, and then got loose of them.

Things got worse. A storm came, and lingered, and flooded the ground higher than it had ever flooded, and forced the people of Berry Forest to retreat up a tree, which was then struck again by lightning; the survivors found themselves sick in the way faeries are seldom sick, too hot or too cold, with strange rashes on their skin; many of them found that they could not speak, and those who could speak could not sleep, and found themselves slowly mad from it.

And for Great Oak, too, things went ill, though more subtly; they were only sure of it when a great mathematician who engaged in gambling games with his friends from other courts came home with a great proof that the court's fortune had turned for ill, and was still turning. They found that the wood of their tree was infested with termites; they sought out other locations and found them wilting or inhabited by animals; a deer came by and ate all the flowers. And they questioned their own members, and sought out members who'd been lost, and then someone remembered that the Traitorous had been entangled with Berry Forest, and was, somehow, not yet dead.

So then they searched for him in earnest, and gave away all that they had to other courts in exchange for help or advice or just a promise to hold the Traitorous if they saw him, and in desperation promised their sons and daughters for favors, and they tracked him across his island and found him, feverish and lost and clinging to life in a rock cave to the far north, unsure what had happened to him, and they killed him and their ill fortune broke and they spent many long centuries recovering."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Yikes."

Permalink Mark Unread

"I cut out a lot of details but that gives you the sense of it, I think."

Permalink Mark Unread

"It does. Sucks to be the sons and daughters though - 'sorry, kid, my generation didn't manage its shit well enough, off you go' -"

Permalink Mark Unread

"Yeah. They might not've had any choice at that stage but they were idiots, letting it get that far."

Permalink Mark Unread

"And they didn't know that speaking unwisely with no one to hear didn't count?"

Permalink Mark Unread

"Some people must've known that but I guess they did not."

Permalink Mark Unread

"I'd have expected there to be intuitions about that, or careful experiments! - Will it hurt anything if I lie and stuff while no faeries listen in? Or if I write it down? Or do it in a language you don't know?"

Permalink Mark Unread

"All of those now known to be fine - in the case of writing, fine until someone reads it. There's not really a safe way to experiment, though, even a minor lie brings some misfortune."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Until someone reads it? Wow, booby trap sticky notes."

Permalink Mark Unread

"That'd be a very hostile thing to do, but yes, it's possible."

Permalink Mark Unread

"And it wouldn't turn out too well for the writer, I guess? But if, like, humans wanted to ward off faeries, they could have old people write false things a bunch, save them till the person died, then tack them up everywhere."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Well, most faeries can't read, but they could ward off my father."

Permalink Mark Unread

"I guess you could just stop teaching people to read, yes."

Permalink Mark Unread

"It's a moderately rare skill. You don't need it for most things you might want to do in life."

Permalink Mark Unread

"I guess you wouldn't if you have to pay for everything you read!"

Permalink Mark Unread

"And for learning in the first place!"

Permalink Mark Unread

"Reading is probably an even better example than music of it being important to have some stuff too cheap to metaphorically meter."

Permalink Mark Unread

"It sounds nice."

Permalink Mark Unread

"It is! It's really nice!" Sigh.

Permalink Mark Unread

Sigh. "Maybe some day I will in some bizarre contrivance save someone's life and then I can keep them and play music to them forever."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Well. I guess that's better than some things you could do with them."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Hmm?"

Permalink Mark Unread

"If I found myself in possession of a faery life debt I would... have a problem, actually, since I'm way more limited in ways I can reasonably receive legible value than in ways I can dish it out, but if somebody else found themselves in possession of a faery life debt I would recommend zeroing it out and letting them go!"

Permalink Mark Unread

"I guess if they were really really miserable about leaving wherever they'd been before?"

Permalink Mark Unread

"I don't think people should have to work themselves up into a froth of misery to have their preference to be wherever they wanna be taken seriously!"

Permalink Mark Unread

"Well, I feel pretty strongly about having someone I can play music to!"

Permalink Mark Unread

"I am not unsympathetic to this plight! Slavery is just a br- metaphorical bridge too far, that means it's - it's hard to talk dramatically when I have to interrupt myself whenever I reach for a figure of speech - it's not okay to keep people as slaves just because you'd find having one very enjoyable!"

Permalink Mark Unread

 

"It really seems like it is, actually? Barring some sort of odd extenuating circumstances?"

Permalink Mark Unread

"I'm not saying the universe will smite you for it! Obviously it will not! I'm making a different kind of claim here."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Okay."

Permalink Mark Unread

"It takes a while for humans to work this out too and I get why it would be harder for faeries to figure out."

Permalink Mark Unread

"I think if they were cheaper to feed most humans would be happier as faery slaves. At least more than half of them. They work and work and work until they starve or get stabbed or die young of some horrible illness."

Permalink Mark Unread

"This is among the reasons it takes humans so long to figure it out, probably."

Permalink Mark Unread

"I think I would frame it more as - there are lots of states people can live in and slavery's not in the top half but it's really far from the bottom. And if you happen to really want it to be in the top half that's easy to do."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Slavery is pretty near the bottom when you have more information about how things can be and more resources to do it with. I guess except for people who do it as a kink thing but that's a minority."

Permalink Mark Unread

"I guess if that ever happens to us there will be a lot of cultural changes."

Permalink Mark Unread

"I'm working on it but don't have a high bandwidth value sink compared to my feasible output."

Permalink Mark Unread

"You said people in your world can make recordings of songs? Does that not work fast?"

Permalink Mark Unread

"There might be a way to make it work - I guess if I sped up a song digitally by enough maybe - electronics do not seem to operate in a sped-up fashion, but are sometimes themselves just fast enough that they can still be used from a sped-up vantage point, music just seems harder than performing database searches."

Permalink Mark Unread

"And if it's not artistically valuable enough it won't work any longer....hmmm. Well, I'm happy to sing. And maybe someday there'll be something else that - if you object to slavery are you not having sex with the girl? Presumably you'll get tired of that eventually?"

Permalink Mark Unread

"I am not having sex with the girl! She can leave any time she wants and just has really limited options among other humans! I am not going to get tired of all this not sexually exploiting a vulnerable teenager I'm doing! - or get tired of it after she's not a teenager! I can and have gone my entire life without sexually exploiting any vulnerable people! Especially ones who have already been implied to have been raped way the fuck too much!"

Permalink Mark Unread

"I just mean, maybe at some point you'll pick someone up even if no one was appealing at first glance."

Permalink Mark Unread

"I'm not going to try to claim that faeries are all unattractive to my sophisticated demonic sensibilities or anything, but I do not feel confident in navigating the mess that is all y'all's sexual norms. Besides, I'm skeptical that even if I put that on the table anything's quite as efficient a form of value transfer as I'd need to revolutionize the resource situation of twenty billion people."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Probably not." Sigh.

Permalink Mark Unread

"Which is why I'm hopeful I can figure out some financial system hack, but preliminary experiments weren't all that encouraging."

Permalink Mark Unread

"My brother's been trying to get that to work for ages. It'd be wonderful if you did figure it out."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Yeah." Sigh. "Well, I might know something that closes the gap, I had to teach him about fractions."

Permalink Mark Unread

"If you want to tell me what those are I should sing another song first."

Permalink Mark Unread

"I don't think it's important except insofar as it's implicit in music stuff I've already explained."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Okay. I don't have much of a talent for math that isn't about music anyway."

Permalink Mark Unread

"So we can skip explaining fractions. But it's a basic math concept that has relevance to finance and if your brother didn't have it he might be missing something else that makes a difference."

Permalink Mark Unread

Nod. "I really hope he figures something out."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Me too."

Permalink Mark Unread

And he toys with the piano some more and announces a bit later that he thinks Cam is now a little in their debt and can go give people things if he pleases.

Permalink Mark Unread

"Cool, thanks. Wonder how long that'll last," Cam snorts.

Permalink Mark Unread

"Well, you're welcome back."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Can you roll me back to my room?"

Permalink Mark Unread

"Sure thing." He does this.

Permalink Mark Unread

"Thanks."

Permalink Mark Unread

"You're very welcome."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Auda, you want dinner?"

Permalink Mark Unread

"Yes. Thank you. How're the faeries?"

Permalink Mark Unread

Dinner! "Musical! Well, this one is."

Permalink Mark Unread

Shiver.

Permalink Mark Unread

"It was useful, they owed me a bunch. If anybody starts playing music at you that'd be different."

Permalink Mark Unread

"They haven't, they've been very polite. Just - remembering stuff, I guess."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Yeah."

Permalink Mark Unread

"It's a different sort of person who becomes a musician if most of what it's good for is managing prisoners."

Permalink Mark Unread

"He was reportedly talented at it as a very small child. But yeah, I guess it is in most cases."

Permalink Mark Unread

"I didn't know faeries had children."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Never seen any? I guess I haven't either. They must do it pretty infrequently, since they're immortal. But the ones I've been talking to the most are all apparently brothers."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Huh. They don't seem like they'd be very good at parenting. - the women are like the men. It's very odd."

Permalink Mark Unread

"I have no idea if they're good at parenting. The women are like the men?"

Permalink Mark Unread

"They wear the same clothes and they do the same jobs and - and they'll - with prisoners - and some places they're in charge."

Permalink Mark Unread

"That doesn't seem that odd to me but I guess it would coming from where you're from."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Where is the place you're from -"

Permalink Mark Unread

"I live in a place called Hell." Probably doesn't sound that much like Middle Ages German for the same concept. It's different in modern German.

Permalink Mark Unread

"Huh. 

Men're the same everywhere - well, maybe not in Hell - but among humans women are different."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Hmm... I think it's more complicated than that."

Permalink Mark Unread

"For your kind of people? Or for faeries and humans?"

Permalink Mark Unread

"I don't know that much about faeries. But my kind of people isn't inherently different from humans in this way, I think, it's just that humans grow up in a human society."

Permalink Mark Unread

"I think you are very different than a human. So much it's hard to imagine any upbringing that could do it."

Permalink Mark Unread

"But I was a human. I was born to human parents and grew up with humans and only turned into an apsel when I was 22."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Human men aren't - this kind, or this patient, or this generous, or this disinterested, or - you were kind to the faeries, you didn't hurt them, and they'd enslaved you!"

Permalink Mark Unread

"And yet I'm pretty sure my species change did not affect my personality at all! It was a really, really different upbringing."

Permalink Mark Unread

"What did your parents do?"

Permalink Mark Unread

"Nothing that exceptional for the circumstances! They sent me to the same kind of school nearly every kid - boys and girls both - went to. They made about as much money as most people in the same time and place. In some ways they were underperforming - they got a divorce when I was a baby!"

Permalink Mark Unread

 

"That really doesn't make any sense."

Permalink Mark Unread

"A lot of what you're taking for granted here, I think, is... basically just poverty and less... accumulated social wisdom."

Permalink Mark Unread

"When God came to Earth he did all kinds of nice things for people even the ones who didn't matter and he fed everyone and the Devil couldn't tempt him and that's how they knew he was God come to Earth, because people aren't like that."

Permalink Mark Unread

"This is actually not a comparison I've had made about me before. I'm in fact not Jesus if, uh, you were wondering."

Permalink Mark Unread

"I figured you would probably have mentioned. Probably."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Well, I doubt the faeries would have found it very relevant?"

Permalink Mark Unread

"I guess there would not be much point in telling them. You could tell me so I could - 

- wash your feet, I suppose. I don't really know what else we're supposed to do when He comes back. I didn't actually get a lot of religious education or probably I would've sinned less."

Permalink Mark Unread

"My feet are fine. And I'm still not Jesus.

There are people who are still - selfish or cruel or just don't care or whatever - where I'm from too. But - fewer, because - managing to survive and take care of basics is made so much easier, when the world around you is richer."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Maybe Jesus was from where you're from, too."

Permalink Mark Unread

"I don't think so."

Permalink Mark Unread

She looks relieved for some reason. "Okay."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Mind, I don't know how I got here."

Permalink Mark Unread

"I thought the faeries summoned you?"

Permalink Mark Unread

"They did. That's not the weird part. I can usually be summoned. Apparently people around here who know how to do it can usually summon. But usually I'd get summoned somewhere else - I don't mean 'not to faery'. I mean 'to the year of our lord 2179'."

Permalink Mark Unread

 

" - wow. 

 

 

Do you think being sped up messed it up somehow?"

Permalink Mark Unread

"I don't think so. I wasn't sped up before I got summoned here."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Huh.

Do all humans who die become apsels, in 2179?"

Permalink Mark Unread

"No. Just some of the ones who are summoners. Other summoners become one of the other two magic things."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Huh."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Non-summoner humans still become indestructible but can't be summoned and don't get powers."

Permalink Mark Unread

"All of them?"

Permalink Mark Unread

"Yes."

Permalink Mark Unread

"When does...that start happening."

Permalink Mark Unread

 

"Uh, about fifty thousand years before Christ."

Permalink Mark Unread

 

"Is there anything for babies who aren't born?"

Permalink Mark Unread

"Not that I'm aware of."

Permalink Mark Unread

Nod.

Permalink Mark Unread

"- Uh. If you wanted to like, eventually start over, with - I don't want to say 'the same baby', that encodes some assumptions we don't necessarily share, but one that is the same like - like identical twins are the same? Then I can do that. - uh, I might need the faery who summoned me, before I can do it, but in principle."

Permalink Mark Unread

 

"I don't really -

- I guess it's really the same mistake I was making in a lot of other ways, I thought I knew enough about how the universe worked to be pretty sure what might happen and then it turned out there were a lot of things that I could be wrong about that I didn't even know were the kind of things a person could be wrong about, and actually I was doing something really different than what I thought I was doing. Not that I thought I was doing the right thing in the first place. And I still don't - I think maybe I just actually shouldn't do things - because I'm so very stupid, you see -"

Permalink Mark Unread

"On the whole I'm actually really impressed with you? And the thing's not obligatory or anything at all, I just thought I'd mention."

Permalink Mark Unread

"I'm glad you mentioned. I just - think maybe if I keep being this wrong about things then that's concerning about my prospects of figuring out anything important."

Permalink Mark Unread

"I don't think 'not knowing very easy-to-miss faeries had all the properties they turn out to have' is a mistake that reflects on you much!"

Permalink Mark Unread

 

"They were really nice at first."

Permalink Mark Unread

 

"I guess that's how they get you."

Permalink Mark Unread

"I had been told that faeries were terrible and dangerous, it's not like no one ever warned me."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Well, believing everything you were ever told isn't quite the right answer either. I dunno what to tell you here."

Permalink Mark Unread


"It's not anything you need to trouble yourself with anyway. You're very good, I'm not so stupid I'm confused about that, and probably when I've thought about it enough I'll figure out the rest of it too. There's a bit that feels important about - the thing you said about feeding people who don't work."

Permalink Mark Unread

Wag wag.

Permalink Mark Unread

Smile. Sigh.

 

She goes back to her room.

Permalink Mark Unread

Cam checks the time his computer has advanced to.

He checks some clocks from home.

 

They have not advanced.

He can't pace. He makes dinner for himself and eats it pensively.

 


He turns on the hall light.

Permalink Mark Unread

"What can we do for you?"

Permalink Mark Unread

"I am now more confident it's time travel and I hate this fact so fucking much. Uh. Pretty much just thought you should be apprised of that."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Because it means we can't let anything about your existence here...leak back into the human world?"

Permalink Mark Unread

"Yep. And I know what they're going to get up to in the next thousand years! And it's going to feel like a million years!"

Permalink Mark Unread

"Is it going to get up to something bad?"

Permalink Mark Unread

"Lots of bad things. They get better. They get so much better. They have so much shit to get through first. And if I touch anything - in any way that turns out to matter - then maybe I'm never born, maybe the universe annihilates itself, who the fuck knows, but it is likely that what happens is not 'I get to re-run history except this time King Leopold doesn't cut off a bunch of Congolese people's hands and there isn't a Holocaust and Christopher Columbus does not get free rein to be such a monster and -'

- there's. There's about twenty billion faeries, yeah?"

Permalink Mark Unread

"We think so, yeah."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Well. Not gonna be that many humans for the, uh. Foreseeable future.

Also probably I can do whatever I want come 2180.

And Limbo's not that bad. They go to Limbo when they die.

Fuck."

Permalink Mark Unread

- hug?

Permalink Mark Unread

...Yeah, okay, hug.

Permalink Mark Unread

"- are you also not gonna be able to walk for the next million years, that sounds really frustrating."

Permalink Mark Unread

"I will be able to walk - and for that matter fly - if we get ahold of my summoner and have them assign me a task."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Oh, okay. I think my brother's on that."

Permalink Mark Unread

"That's my understanding. It'd get really old to be not only in a wheelchair but unable to personally wheel it for a million years."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Are you - actually confident you'll live that long? Most people don't."

Permalink Mark Unread

"I'm indestructible."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Wow. That's convenient."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Yes, I like it. I don't actually know if it applies to faery misfortune, though."

Permalink Mark Unread

"As long as you're not entangled with anyone you're in control of your own destiny there."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Yes. A million years is gonna be such a long time to go without sarcasm though."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Maybe you can be sarcastic at your human, at least when you're sure you're not entangled with anyone. Or maybe that'd just reinforce the habit."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Probably. Ugh. Is there a safe-ish small scale test of whether I am in fact immune to faery misfortune so I don't have to just hope it never comes up in a million years."

Permalink Mark Unread

"If you're not entangled with any other faeries then we could get to even and do some pretty safe tests. I'm worried you might be entangled with your summoner, agreements not yet fulfilled do that and a summons might be similar. Or if anyone learned a name you use a lot, or made promises to you though that's less likely."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Well, we'll hold off till we've got my summoner and somebody can check, then, though wouldn't it have been strange for them to get rid of me if we were entangled?"

Permalink Mark Unread

"Would've been pretty stupid but the whole thing seemed pretty stupid. I'm really curious what explanation my brother will extract."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Me too. We have a guess of when they'll be accounted for?"

Permalink Mark Unread

"We sent people out to negotiate with their neighbors. Once they get back we'll be ready to head over."

Permalink Mark Unread

Nod. Sigh.

Permalink Mark Unread

"It won't be violent, if that helps at all."

Permalink Mark Unread

"It helps at all."

Permalink Mark Unread

Sigh.

Permalink Mark Unread

 

 

"We could use humans as a value sink. As long as they don't want to go home. I can buy them out, they can listen to music or whatever in parallel and then I can pay for it."

Permalink Mark Unread

" - yeah, that should work. People will compete to get them to run up as much of a tab as possible but that mostly won't look like any awful things, as long as the humans could always just decide to go home. Or to another court."

Permalink Mark Unread

"And it's probably - as safe as me existing and doing anything - to have occasional unverifiable leakage from ones who do go home.

I do not know how I am going to look anyone we pick up between 1939 and 1944 in the eye given our geographical location but oh well that's really far in the future."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Destroying the whole universe or whatever you worry would happen wouldn't help them."

Permalink Mark Unread

"I don't... actually have a way to rule out this being a kind of time travel where I can do stuff."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Sure, but they get an afterlife, even if the chance you'd destroy everything is pretty small -"

Permalink Mark Unread

"Yeah. But. It's so bad."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Until you got here we thought it'd always be that bad, forever."

Permalink Mark Unread

"No, I mean - on a lot of axes it's worse. They have to learn to do a lot of things to get to where they're going and - and sometimes they just decide to - use them to be evil - and right now people are pretty contained because they can't move around or communicate over long distances without an enormous hassle but the civilian casualties of World War II are forty million."

Permalink Mark Unread

" - wow."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Yeah! It's really bad! The path from here to a post-scarcity nigh-utopia is not linear at all. I can't even be like, oh, let's look up some missing person who was never accounted for, and speed them up and spirit them away... because anyone recorded as a missing person could have been looked up by some demon... I'm not sure of the logic on that, it might work, maybe I'll have it figured out by World War II."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Could you leave a note for the demon that's like "don't publish, time paradox"?"

Permalink Mark Unread

"I don't think I can leave any notes. I have conjured my own complete works before, several times, when changing formats, and didn't find any weird shit."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Huh. 

Well, some of them will probably come to us anyway. If they remember what faery circles mean."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Maybe.

I don't think I make it a million years without writing at all, but doing it small and fast has gotta cover me. If it didn't I'd already be in trouble."

Permalink Mark Unread

Nod. 

 

"Are you unusual for your people?"

Permalink Mark Unread

"In what respect?"

Permalink Mark Unread

"So I'm mostly wondering what share of them, if summoned here, would've done something that made it impossible for them to have been summoned here."

Permalink Mark Unread

"- oh. Uh, possibly a lot of them, a million years is a very long time. Though the general concept of time travel and its hazards is more available."

Permalink Mark Unread

Nod.

Permalink Mark Unread

"But it could also just be an interaction with summoning circles and faery circles."

Permalink Mark Unread

"That also makes sense. I guess we should not test this ourselves?"

Permalink Mark Unread

"It might ever make sense to summon more daeva but I think it should be done slowed down just to reduce the variables in play."

Permalink Mark Unread

Nodnod. "It seems very risky anyway given that they likely don't have to cooperate with our system at all."

Permalink Mark Unread

"They don't, but I know how to design bindings better than the one I'm in, I used to teach it."

Permalink Mark Unread

"That'd probably help. And they'd want to stay?"

Permalink Mark Unread

"That I have no idea about, but they might, especially if we find a baby nobody'll miss, daeva can't have kids and sometimes want them."

Permalink Mark Unread

"You have to trade for babies but I know some courts do it."

Permalink Mark Unread

"...why do you have to trade for them if you find one abandoned somewhere? Decent birth control isn't going to be invented for hundreds of years, sometimes people leave babies lying around."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Babies belong to their mothers. Even human babies. They'd still be entangled if you took the baby without giving the mother something of comparable value. And separately, you can't speed up a baby without transferring their motherdebt because they can't accumulate entanglement from any other sources, they're not people yet."

Permalink Mark Unread

"It would probably be a bad idea to raise a human baby in a faery court anyway, they'd show up in Limbo and tell Limboites things that I do not understand Limboites of the future to know. You could still do some trades with a daeva on this basis, they'd just stay slowed down."

Permalink Mark Unread

"And you'd trust them to stay out of human affairs?"

Permalink Mark Unread

"I'm assuming they'd come from this time. Not literally everything downstream of me can be a problem - like, I'm breathing - and I can't immediately think of anything you need an angel or a fairy or an extra demon for enough, but I'm hoping I can somehow come by more information about what's going on, you know?"

Permalink Mark Unread

"Yeah, that makes sense."

Permalink Mark Unread

Sigh.

Permalink Mark Unread

"I guess we should arrange to introduce you to more people, since you'll be sticking around. And maybe your human too?"

Permalink Mark Unread

"If she's up for it. She isn't super fond of faeries."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Will she want to witness the handling of the other court, do you think?"

Permalink Mark Unread

"...I would guess no but I'd really have to ask to be sure."

Permalink Mark Unread

Nod. 

Permalink Mark Unread

"She hasn't mentioned anyone in particular I'd expect her to ask after but, like, you avoid using names whenever possible so it might be legitimately inconvenient to keep track of who was significant, and also she doesn't know me all that well and does not have a strong reason to list lots of details."

Permalink Mark Unread

"She seems very fond of you. But I guess not, yeah."

Permalink Mark Unread

"She's easily impressed and may be attributing my magical powers to my moral character, and liking me isn't the same as having known me for a long time."

Permalink Mark Unread

"The powers come with the whole range of personalities?"

Permalink Mark Unread

"A pretty much human range, with I think a little skew in which personalities get which powers but there's only three kinds and most traits don't map onto that division. Like, I think she's way too impressed that I'm feeding her. It's not hard."

Permalink Mark Unread

"It would be for everyone she's ever met, though. Also it is possible that your society has innovated at food and everything is tastier."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Yes, but neither of those are facts about how cool I am as a person! Neither is the fact that she's recovering from malnutrition."

Permalink Mark Unread

"I see what you mean but - making value for other people feels like a lot of what character is, or should be, to me."

Permalink Mark Unread

"And I appreciate this about you but, mmm. I feel sort of the way I imagine I'd feel if I showed up someplace where there was not any air, such as the Moon, and most people spent twelve hours a day manufacturing air, and people who couldn't do that survived on charity till it ran out and then asphyxiated, and then I showed up and made a day's worth of air for everybody in thirty seconds - which I can do not because I worked very hard in the air factory and got really good at it, or because I thought really hard about air and figured out a cool trick that makes it more efficiently! I can do that because I got lucky after I died! - and then everybody's like, acting like I somehow sank many dozens of person-hours into this when it was thirty seconds? But air should be free and for me it's close enough that I can give it out like that. Even faeries have air be free."

Permalink Mark Unread

" - I realize I'm getting distracted from the main point but do you mean that it's possible to have an absence of the thing we breathe? Because that's very contentious, as I recall the last time I acquired a science lesson."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Oh, yeah, that's possible and is true most places by an overwhelming margin, but air has a mass and approximately falls to earth the same way everything else does. It gets thinner if you go up, to the point that you can notice just on the altitude variance natural terrain gets you, and if you keep going up it gets thinner than that and then no more air."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Huh! I am going to use this information to win lots of bets."

Permalink Mark Unread

Snort. "Does that backpropagate any debt to me?"

Permalink Mark Unread

"Nah, when you tell someone something then it's theirs from there unless you explicitly negotiated some other kind of agreement."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Oh good. Why do you have bets about air?"

Permalink Mark Unread

"I don't yet! But I've heard other people make bets about air and I can now go around and participate and always win."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Some people might call that cheating!"

Permalink Mark Unread

"Really? But the whole point of betting is that both people think they have more information!"

Permalink Mark Unread

"Well, sometimes it's not, some people like betting on things they have no special information on for some reason, but even when everybody involved thinks they have more information there's a sorta fuzzy threshold of 'okay but that wasn't fair, you actually knew'."

Permalink Mark Unread

"I mean, anyone who knows me well enough to expect me to be betting in a friendly sort of fashion also knows that this is what I'd do if I knew a fact other people were very unsure of."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Perhaps no one you are betting with will object. Enjoy."

Permalink Mark Unread

"I will!"

Permalink Mark Unread

"Should I resolve any other longstanding scientific confusions?"

Permalink Mark Unread

"What is fire? What's the sun? Why do snowflakes take the shape of crystals? Is there a smallest thing, and how small is it? Does lightning cause thunder? How did life originate?"

Permalink Mark Unread

Cam laughs. "Fire is when stuff oxidizes really fast - oxidizing is having the stuff in air that makes it important to breathe for at least humans chemically attached to a thing, rusting is also oxidization but slower! The sun is reasonably approximated as an enormous sphere of, as it happens, fire, but in more formal terms it's a state of matter called plasma which is hard to come by on the surface of the Earth - the other three states being solid liquid and gas - most of which is hydrogen and helium. Snowflakes form crystals because they are crystals, but unlike most things you probably think of as crystals you can encounter the same substance in liquid form so the transition's more obvious. As you get to things being very small it starts being ambiguous whether all of them are, in point of fact, 'things'. Yes! Molecules of a kind that happened to be able to replicate themselves arose by chance about four billion sidereal years ago and the ones that accumulated random changes making them more able to do that did it more and those changes trended toward the model of existence we know as life."

Permalink Mark Unread

Bounce bounce bounce.

Permalink Mark Unread

Wag wag. "I guess the thunder thing might not be as obvious if you have to wait a lot longer between the lightning and the thunder. Though come to think of it I'm not sure when it was conclusively determined by humans either."

Permalink Mark Unread

"I'd think it'd be easier with a long wait because you can more precisely measure how far apart the two are. But how far apart they are varies."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Oh, that's because sound travels slower than light so it varies with how far away the lightning strike is!"

Permalink Mark Unread

"Huh.  - travels slower than light, but light doesn't - does it make sense to say light travels at a speed?"

Permalink Mark Unread

"Yes! Kind of. It gets weird under some circumstances. But yes, almost three hundred million meters per second."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Huh."

Permalink Mark Unread

"I forget how fast sound is but I can look it up if you care."

Permalink Mark Unread

He leans forward eagerly and then makes a face.

"I couldn't afford any of those questions, I just - really wanted to know -"

Permalink Mark Unread

"Oh. Well, is your brother still awake, I can go take in some more concert."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Probably." Sigh.

Permalink Mark Unread

"...sorry? Should I like, stop and get a check on the situation there before I answer things -"

Permalink Mark Unread

"Hmm? No, that's entirely on me. One is not supposed to ask six questions you care about very much in rapid succession because you're awfully curious, even children know that. It's not - unfriendly, even in the broader conceptions of what that means, to answer them."

Permalink Mark Unread

"If you say so. Sounds rough."

Permalink Mark Unread

Shrug. "It really doesn't bother me to need to pay for things, just to be unable to."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Inconveniently I have already taken nearly all your money." Sigh.

Permalink Mark Unread

"In hindsight I should've been planning my acquisitions more carefully with the possibility of a magical person with the ability to create arbitrary things and a thousand years' more science knowledge showing up."

Permalink Mark Unread

"You couldn't have reasonably anticipated me."

Permalink Mark Unread

"We could have gone in really hard on acquiring humans and in that manner learned about summoning and had something to trade you."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Summoning knowledge is really uncommon this year and I bet you people who know how to do it don't tend to resort to walking into faery circles and also if you'd gone really hard on acquiring humans perhaps we would not get along so well."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Yes, that seems possible. If I were to do that I'd go east and claim a lot of land some place where the humans are having a war and I think they'd be safer and happier and better off, though plausibly not in a way that reflected well on my character."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Ones who could summon could just leave the war. Or win it."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Huh. Do they do that? Are most wars decided by secret summoners?"

Permalink Mark Unread

"No, the information is really rare and I think lost a few times and only recovered by written record afterwards for most of human history."

Permalink Mark Unread

Nod.

Permalink Mark Unread

 

"I should think of things I want to ask you or something but I'm drawing a complete blank, how much of an emergency is this?"

Permalink Mark Unread

"In a court people run debts much bigger than this all the time without any problems. We were only trying to keep this one small in case you or someone you're entangled with decides you are not friendly after all. So - probably not very much of one? If you decide to be at war with us maybe ask me questions first."

Permalink Mark Unread

"I'll bear that in mind. I am generally anti-war."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Me too. They're often destructive."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Only often?"

Permalink Mark Unread

"Sometimes there's a hostile merger in which no identifiable value is destroyed beyond peoples' scheduled patrols getting rescheduled, which is a loss of value but seems different from a more paradigmatic war."

Permalink Mark Unread

"- what makes it hostile, then?"

Permalink Mark Unread

"Well, a friendly merger is if both courts agree they should merge. If they don't, but one holds enough debt from the other to insist, that's a hostile one even if no swords are drawn. - the thing that's going to happen this evening will destroy a fair bit more value than that and still likely won't involve any swords."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Kind of seems like a dumb move to force a merge on people who don't want it."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Yeah. Sometimes some people want it, just not the ones in charge, and sometimes it's just a dumb move."

Permalink Mark Unread

"What tends to be desirable about merging? I'm mostly coming up with pressures towards having courts be small."

Permalink Mark Unread

"If you have close relationships with people in another court it's nice to merge since then you can run debt internally without it causing enormous problems. A lot of chores, like patrolling and negotiating passage agreements with neighbors, don't scale with how many people you have. Some specialties are nice to have in a court but hard to justify in a small one, or are interestingly distinct when done with larger groups, like people who perform theatre with a large cast or people who play music together."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Suppose," allows Cam. "How big do courts get?"

Permalink Mark Unread

"It's rumored that the really famous old ones in the Misty Isles reach a thousand but I don't know that I've heard that from anyone who's been to one."

Permalink Mark Unread

"And around here?"

Permalink Mark Unread

"No one's above three hundred. And that's rare, and not spectacularly stable."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Oh, what happens to them when they destabilize?"

Permalink Mark Unread

"They get bad fortune. Anyone who can cut themself loose does. They sell other people off for favors to try to manage the bad fortune. Eventually they either get a handle on it or collapse."

Permalink Mark Unread

 

"About what fraction of people get sold at some point in their lives?"

Permalink Mark Unread

"At some point? Most things that can happen will happen at some point."

Permalink Mark Unread

"If I meet a randomly selected faery how likely is it that they have been sold at some point in their life?"

Permalink Mark Unread

"Probably not very high. One in twenty? Maybe one in ten?"

Permalink Mark Unread

"That's very high!"

Permalink Mark Unread

"I guess it depends what you're comparing to. The average person is many winters old!"

Permalink Mark Unread

"I mean I'm comparing it to 'negligible' but that's still like five or ten times higher than I was naively - being optimistic about."

Permalink Mark Unread

"I don't know what you're imagining but it's mostly not - horrible, or anything. We trade for people a lot, here, and they mostly live about the same life as I do except they have to run more patrols and they're less likely to get expensive presents like human currency. There's not different rules or different houses or anything."

Permalink Mark Unread

"I mean, even 'forced relocation' alone is not music to my ears," isn't it lovely how many figures of speech are negations, "but yeah I guess it could pan out to be just 'being a faery only more so'."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Depends some on where you end up, but having people entangled with you who hate you is a terrible idea and people mostly don't do it."

Permalink Mark Unread

"That's something."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Do people in your time and world...never have to move if they don't care to?"

Permalink Mark Unread

"Their landlord might retire? Their house could burn down? There are reasons they might have to move away but they cut way down on reasons they might have to move to, if that makes sense."

Permalink Mark Unread

Nod. 

Permalink Mark Unread

"Also their families are not allowed to sell them. Or their, uh, city councils, or whatever."

Permalink Mark Unread

"I gathered that. It'd be good if parentdebts were much smaller, assuming that it happened because making people was much less costly, but I think if you had debts work the way they do and couldn't trade people, that'd be worse for people in a lot of debt. They'd be worth less to whoever they owed."

Permalink Mark Unread

"So one problem I am noticing you guys having is that if you don't have a pretty solidly established trust relationship, or a way of keeping an eye on somebody, you can't let any major debt ride. When that's not the case, you can relax a lot about exactly how and when you get paid back even if you do insist on being paid back, which humans sometimes just write off because it's too annoying but don't always. For humans in the era when I grew up - I know less about how this has evolved since - but around then you can in fact buy and sell debt! If somebody owes you, like, five thousand dollars, and they're not coughing up, you sell the debt to someone whose job is being professionally annoying about wanting to be paid, for somewhat less than five thousand dollars in case that doesn't work either. This still leaves the person who owes the money control over their own life."

Permalink Mark Unread


" - that sounds amazing."

Permalink Mark Unread

"I thought you'd like that!" Wag.

Permalink Mark Unread

"I wonder if there's some way - but I think whoever collected payments would just end up entangled with lots of irresponsible people and die -"

Permalink Mark Unread

"Yes! It's very frustrating! - What would happen if you sold the debt to a human who was dying?"

Permalink Mark Unread

"It'd go away when they died."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Maybe if we wind up with a ton of humans around enough that one's going to die soon at any given time we can work with that."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Hmm. With you providing that humans with the resources to buy off the debt, and then the debt vanishing shortly after that? I think that'd work."

Permalink Mark Unread

"It'd have to be a lot of humans though."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Even if the human was too sensible or too incapacitated by dying to do anything unfortunate it'd be risky to have more than a couple people from different courts entangled with them, too."

Permalink Mark Unread

"I was imagining consolidating all the debt first?"

Permalink Mark Unread

"That's safer."

Permalink Mark Unread

"And nothing like, backfires on whoever the human's entangled with?"

Permalink Mark Unread

"It shouldn't. Nothing bad happens to you if someone you're entangled with dies, or having humans would be much less popular."

Permalink Mark Unread

"It could have been like a game of hot potato, it wouldn't be that weird compared to everything else. Good to know."

Permalink Mark Unread

"There's some logistics involved in consolidating debts but I wouldn't expect them to make it impossible."

Permalink Mark Unread

"What are those like?"

Permalink Mark Unread

"You have to get the people whose debt you're transferring all in the same room - not a problem within a court but inconvenient between them - and do a ritual with crystals. It's not very complicated, the hassle is mostly getting everyone in one place."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Is the constraint literally 'same room'?"

Permalink Mark Unread

"No, they touch the same crystal during the ritual."

Permalink Mark Unread

"I don't suppose you could make it really big or something."

Permalink Mark Unread

"It'd take much longer to make. Crystals are made by - spinning them out of thin air, kind of, and you keep going until you have the size you want so people usually make them just big enough to successfully handle."

Permalink Mark Unread

"And you'd have to find someone who didn't mind taking on a lot of risk to shuttle the debt between courts messenger-style..."

Permalink Mark Unread

"If you had enough humans it'd really be best to have a cohort of them for each court, or each few courts. But you'd need so many humans."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Well, they'll live longer if they're being fed well and given adequate medical care, but I don't know how much that closes the gap."

Permalink Mark Unread

"I think all the humans in the world would be enough but obviously most of them aren't going to want to come live in faeryland no matter how comfy it is. And that'd mess up the timeline."

Permalink Mark Unread

"It would quite, yes."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Well, I'll keep thinking about it, maybe there's a good way to do it."

Permalink Mark Unread

"We have a long time to think." Sigh.

Permalink Mark Unread

"A million years! It's very exciting. I've never had a million years of plans before."

Permalink Mark Unread

"And after that things can get really exciting!"

Permalink Mark Unread

"I look forward to it."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Me too." Sigh. "...gotta keep my summoner alive, I have no clue what happens if I get dismissed."

Permalink Mark Unread

"That's important, have you told my brother?"

Permalink Mark Unread

"...I don't remember."

Permalink Mark Unread

"I should perhaps go do that, then."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Thanks."

Permalink Mark Unread

He heads off.

Permalink Mark Unread

Cam starts recklessly fiddling with all the display settings on his computer to see if he can make it flicker less or differently or something.

Permalink Mark Unread

He comes back a while later. "You mentioned the thing about how to keep you here to him. He's planning to take everyone alive, and thinks he's determined who, particularly, summoned you."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Oh good. I probably said it would send me home but obviously now I have some reason to be concerned that if dismissed I'd just cease to exist."

Permalink Mark Unread

"He's very good at what he does. We'll get them in safely."

Permalink Mark Unread

"I am glad to hear it."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Can I arrange you that extra concert now?"

Permalink Mark Unread

"Go for it."

Permalink Mark Unread

Concert!

Permalink Mark Unread

A highly enjoyable one, too!

"- hey, uh, when Beethoven is born - he wrote that sonata I played - are you going to suddenly be in his debt -"

Permalink Mark Unread

"When you share something it ceases to belong to you unless you explicitly negotiated some kind of different agreement, which is very rare. So I should be fine."

Permalink Mark Unread

"- define 'share' and 'explicitly negotiate', I don't actually know what agreements Beetho- I should not have said his name, whoops - I do not know under what agreements Mr. Ode To Joy published his works and I definitely didn't, like, subscribe to whatever magazine the story I read your brother was published in -"

Permalink Mark Unread

"I mean, if you and he had sat down and agreed that you'd share the song as his agent and the debt for it would flow to him, then that's what would happen. Assuming humans can even make agreements like that among themselves, which I'm not quite sure of. As it is the debt went to you, so it definitely didn't go anywhere else."

Permalink Mark Unread

"I wasn't aware there was a conservation of debt mechanic, okay. What about things that people did not choose to share and have been musically pirated like I described before?"

Permalink Mark Unread

"If you played it it's yours. If you showed me the sheet music I'm not really sure. If someone took my father's books and showed them to people they'd all end up in my father's debts, because that counts as hearing it directly from him."

Permalink Mark Unread

"I made copies of your father's books to read on somebody's recommendation, am I in debt to him now?"

Permalink Mark Unread

"You might be when you read them, depending on how the universe thinks your copying counts. I think probably you will be when you read them."

Permalink Mark Unread

"I did read them. Is there a way to check? Will he have noticed himself, despite being slowed down?"

Permalink Mark Unread

"Anyone looking at you both at once could tell. He won't notice until he meets you."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Does this seem important enough to go find him so someone can look at us? I don't know exactly where to be careful and where not to bother, here."

Permalink Mark Unread

"I'll mention it to my brother and it is a substantial amount of debt but it's looking like we're going to be in a situation where it's less dangerous for you to be entangled with us, pretty soon."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Should I stop reading them? I didn't finish all the ones I made."

Permalink Mark Unread

"I don't know how much you were getting out of them. I guess if you could wait a couple weeks that'd be good."

Permalink Mark Unread

"I was trying to, like, figure out how you'd make plumbing work at this scale and speed, that kind of thing."

Permalink Mark Unread

"That sounds neat but like it could wait a couple weeks?"

Permalink Mark Unread

"Yeah, I can leave them be."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Thank you."

Permalink Mark Unread

"You're welcome. Oh, you'll be pleased probably to know that we're considering buying up a lot of humans and using them as a value sink so I can make and explain more stuff than I could soak up the debt for alone, maybe you'll be able to give them lots of concerts."

Permalink Mark Unread

"That sounds like a great idea!"

Permalink Mark Unread

Wag wag. "Thank you!"

Permalink Mark Unread

"I hope it works."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Me too."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Do you want a ride back to your rooms?"

Permalink Mark Unread

"Unless you want me to sit here forever, yes, please."

Permalink Mark Unread

So he takes him back to his rooms.

Permalink Mark Unread

"Thanks again!"

Permalink Mark Unread

"Sure! Good luck with your plans!"

Permalink Mark Unread

"Here's hoping."

Permalink Mark Unread

Auda is sleeping when he gets back but startles awake when people return. She watches through the crack in her door until the faery leaves. Then she opens it.

Permalink Mark Unread

"Hey - it's okay, he was just dropping me off."

Permalink Mark Unread

Smile. "It's not - I'm not under the impression that it's useful for me to be so nervous around them -"

Permalink Mark Unread

"It doesn't have to be useful to be the thing that's happening in your head. It's only been a few days," shrugs Cam.

Permalink Mark Unread

"Well, I'm working on it. Maybe next time I'll say hello."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Speaking of faeries and being nervous about them - this court's mad at the one that sent us on to them and is gonna go do... something I'm not completely clear on but I'm told they're not going to kill people... about it. Do you have any requests about that?"

Permalink Mark Unread

"Why're they mad?"

Permalink Mark Unread

"It seems plausible to presume that given the information our original had at the time, sending me here was best construed as a murder attempt, even if it did not work that way because the redhead isn't a stupid asshole like the first batch."

Permalink Mark Unread

"You would've killed them? If he'd been stupider?"

Permalink Mark Unread

"Probably not! But first court may have thought I would, or would at least create enough of a problem to do some damage, instead of creating some inconveniently heavy iridium bowling balls."

Permalink Mark Unread

"What do they want me for?"

Permalink Mark Unread

"- who?"

Permalink Mark Unread

"Sorry, why do they want - why did they want me to know this?"

Permalink Mark Unread

"The money one asked if you'd want to, like, watch or anything? And I said I'd have to ask, and if there's any specific faery you'd like kicked on your behalf or anything I can pass that on too."

Permalink Mark Unread


"They figure they can do you favors by doing me favors, if I want anything?

I - are they going to bring them all here as prisoners?"

Permalink Mark Unread

"...I guess they might figure that but I think the money faery actually has like at least sixty percent of a handle on the basics of morality so he might just, like, think it would be good if you had what you wanted out of the situation whatever that might be. I don't know if they're planning to physically transport them all here but maybe they will, or perhaps just some."

Permalink Mark Unread

"I guess there're some where if they start being here and walking you back from trips and stuff it'd make me - wish they weren't? 


What happens to faeries when they die?"

Permalink Mark Unread

"I don't know."

Permalink Mark Unread

"What do you think the right thing to do is?"

Permalink Mark Unread

"I don't know nearly enough details to even know what the factors in the situation are! If you can identify faeries you don't want to see milling around I'm sure it's at least reasonable to ask that they wind up on an opposed sleep schedule and don't drop by to wheel me around or fetch the dishes."

Permalink Mark Unread

Nod. 

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"It did occur to me that this might be difficult because of how they are about names."

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"I could probably recognize people but I don't know what - I haven't wanted things about them in a long time.

 

But also I thought they would go to hell. Eventually."

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"I don't know what happens. I tried conjuring a dead one and nothing happened. That might mean that they just stop existing, but it might mean that they turn into something too magic for me to make - their crystals are like that - or something without a physical form."

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"What factors would you need to know about, to figure out what should happen?"

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"Even if I knew everything I'd just have, like, a slightly narrower range of things that would be fine decisions for you to make, not an authoritative answer."

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"Oh."

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"If you don't want to have to think about it I can handle it in some fashion or other and you can ignore it."

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"I don't really know what I want. I don't know if it's fair to - what they did wasn't worse than what I did but everyone's mad at them and you like me so -"

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"...what did you do?"

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"I got pregnant out of wedlock and ran off to faeries to get them to tell me how to - and then had sex with them to pay for it."

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"So actually all of those things are viewed differently where I'm from. Especially considering that it is not obvious to me that you signed up for all the sex at any point in that arc there even to the degree of being prepared to swap it for what you got. And like... even if you had in fact, say, stabbed a dude in the eye because he made a weird face at you and then run off to the faeries to escape the consequences of this, nothing about that has anything to do about whether you should have to hang out with faeries who scare you? It would have to do with whether the dude you stabbed should have to hang out with you but even if you are not telling me about some dude you stabbed in the eye I do not think he is here."

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"Didn't - really get along with the baby's father but I didn't stab him.

I'm mostly just worried you're imagining that they wronged me when that's not really what happened and then there'll be something more than us avoiding each other."

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"I acknowledge it's - complicated? But I don't actually think that they didn't wrong you. I'm not being as judgmental of them as I would be of well brought up human beings who knew better. There's definitely evidence that they didn't know better. I wouldn't want them executed. But you shouldn't have to be around them."

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- nod. "I guess that's what I want unless one of them has some other idea about how to make it right."

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Nod. "I wonder if any of 'em'll come up with something, that'd be interesting."

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"I think they'll be confused, if we're even then everything's right. But I don't know."

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"I've caught them acknowledging any nuance beyond that! But yeah, that's about what I'd expect too."

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She nods.

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"Would you like earplugs? So my coming and going while you're sleeping doesn't wake you?"

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"No, it's all right. I like to know what's going on. If you don't mind."

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"Oh, it's fine," he says. "I just do have some memories of needing sleep and not liking it to be interrupted."

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"I eavesdrop on your conversations and I know I shouldn't but -"

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"I don't mind, I'm not really discussing sensitive personal matters with faeries. If I do wind up doing that we might want a different rooming arrangement, I guess."

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"Or a better door. Or you could just -" she frowns. "I'm sorry, anyhow, and I'll try to cut it out."

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"I could just -?"

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"I, uh, I think I am finding it hard to be motivated by 'this is the decent and good thing to do' when I have been mostly motivated by 'if you mess this up they won't feed you today and might hurt you very badly' and I know that you are committed to feeding me anyway because you are a being of pure moral goodness and everything but I don't know if being mad when I am obviously misbehaving is within your capacities or would even help."

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"...I am not a being of pure moral goodness, I am just, like, a decent person. I am capable of being mad at you. If, uh... stealing my stuff doesn't work as an example considering... if you decided to start randomly lying to faeries and this caused me some kind of misfortune through a chain reaction I'd be mad about that? The rooms aren't soundproof. I have not been relying on them being soundproof. If I need to do anything that wants soundproofness I'll change that."

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" - okay."

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"I'm not really clear on what you're looking for here? Will I be more credible in finding you generally sympathetic if I identify something you have done and go 'ah, now that was no good' so you can be sure I'm not going 'you're fine' reflexively?"

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"So I mostly - would like to actually do the right thing by normal standards and not artificially low standards that are there only because as far as your civilization is concerned I am both done-wrong-by and also presently vulnerable. But I don't know very much about what that is, and also in practice when I try to do it it loses to doing whatever seems least dangerous, and it'd be good if there were chances to practice at that but I don't want you to have to put effort into making some for me, that'd kind of defeat the purpose."

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"Huh. That makes sense, but I agree that setting up practice problems for you might not be the way to go about it. - can you read?"

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"No."

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"I don't have the electronics problem solved to the point where I can give you movies, but if you wanna learn to read I can give you books. Machine translation into eleventh century German will not be great but it might do. And I think a lot of people learn stuff pretty well by encountering stories about it. Maybe their inability to do fiction has to do with faery problems."

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"Huh. You think I could learn to read?"

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"Virtually everyone can learn to read unless they have a rare and specific reading-related problem."

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"It's really rare for people to learn to read."

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"That's because it's not very useful in this era. If you have lots of reading material around, and teach kids, they can almost always pick it up by age seven. Later in some really complicated languages without alphabets, but German's got an alphabet."

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"Huh. Okay. That'd be really neat."

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"I don't know if anything's been written that you already wish you could read? In German or in faery - it'll take longer to get machine translation working for faery but I can do it."

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"I don't think I have ever seen a book aside from the Bible. I guess maybe I should read that. Even if it's wrong."

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"Let's see..." He suffers through some screen flicker. "The gospel of Matthew was translated into Old High German like three hundred years ago. I don't know if that's close enough to your dialect. In about four hundred years a fully vernacular German Bible will be printed! That might also not be close enough - it's close enough that I can mostly read it with German I picked up in 2094 and I couldn't understand much of what you said when you tried talking to me in your native language..."

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"Huh. You can't make versions of books but in a language you don't speak?"

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"Oh, I don't have to speak it, but it does have to exist. Or be, uh, going to exist in the next thousand realtime years. The magic can't translate from one language to another. This can," he waves his computer, "though it'll take hours - real hours - and the quality will depend on how much I can help it, and how much has been previously written in the language. German starting after the printing press is invented has plenty written in the language, and I can help it out with faery; German as of right now has less of both traits."

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"That makes sense. I guess I could learn to read in faery. Since I'm starting from nothing in both of them."

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"All right! Conveniently it seems to be written very phonetically - that means the letters correspond very exactly to the sounds, instead of having a ton of weird exceptions. ...This should possibly wait till you've had the rest of your sleep though? I can get the computer going on translating some simple stories in the meanwhile."

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"Oh. Sure. Thank you."

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"You're welcome!"

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She goes to sleep.

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Cam gets his computer working on chewing through the corpus of faery books and helps it along.

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Then when she wakes up she will probably have some reading material in faery!

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Yup! And he will teach her the alphabet over breakfast.

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This does nothing to persuade her that he is not actually an embodiment of perfect goodness or something.

She is actually a reasonably fast learner. 

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Then she can try reading Little Red Riding Hood! Cam has carefully prefaced it with "Machine-Assisted Translation of L. Perrule's Little Red Riding Hood, A Work Of Fiction".

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She will slowly get to work on that.

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He helps her out as necessary, tail awag.

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And eventually faeries leave a note with an update on the assault on the other court. They have taken everyone prisoner. It was uneventful. They're bringing a couple back here, including the summoner. The apsel and the mortal have no entanglements at the other camp; he told some people his name but they very responsibly immediately did a lot of drugs and forgot it.

They're welcome to inquire about anything else they might want to know.

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"The human would prefer not to encounter the faeries from that court; I thought perhaps they could be on opposed sleep schedules and not assigned to anything in this part of the court."

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"Sure, we can arrange that."

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"I'm going to want my summoner to say some stuff so I'll be able to walk and make a wider variety of things. And I'm curious if there are other details to be had."

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"Uh, they're insisting they didn't particularly care if we ended up dead or crippled or anything and mostly just hoped the thing would somehow get far enough away to not be their problem, but they did pick us in particular because of thinking of all the people around it'd be most convenient if we did end up dead or crippled, so no one's very impressed. They were confused at the idea they'd abused the human, they really don't think they did."

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"I don't think they fell beneath the typical faery standard of care. I just think the typical faery standard of care is really bad."

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Nod. "That'd explain it. 

The ones we're bringing back here are the people in charge, your summoner - who wasn't in charge, he was a disposable idiot which is why he got permission to do a unlikely experiment - and a couple who seemed useful."

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"I did think he seemed pretty idiotic... useful how? What's happening to the ones that aren't getting brought?"

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"Useful mostly for their skill with magic, or knowledge of some skillset we don't have here - underground excavation, lens grinding, tree health. Everyone else is going to stay at their camp supervised with restricted privileges until we pick someone we want to have in charge, then we'll leave."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Someone of theirs or of yours?"

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"Someone of theirs."

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"Cool. Do the useful people stay here indefinitely, or do they get to go home if they want at some point?"

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"They'll be allowed to leave if they want at some point but it might be a while."

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"A while like..."

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"Some winters, potentially."

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"Do they have visitation privileges?"

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"Do you mean, can people visit them, or are they allowed to go home?"

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"Either one."

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"People can visit them. They'd negotiate trips with their handlers here, I don't know any details."

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"Okay. I guess that's not an emergency and I have a few thousand years to address it if I decide to. Thanks for catching me up."

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"Of course."

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"Is this a good time for me to talk to my summoner about what I need from him?"

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"If you'd like, yeah."

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"Cool, can you take me to him?"

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"Of course." It's down in the dungeons.

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"Hi," Cam says to his summoner. "Thanks for arranging to forget my name."

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He looks like he has absolutely no idea what to make of that. He nods.

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"I mean, you did fail to put 'don't tell me your name' on the list of rules when I asked for it - I don't know how much of the circumstances you remember what with all the drugs?"

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"Not very much of it. Who tells people their name anyway?"

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"People who have not heard of this rule. Actually, among many people the principal purpose of names is to be called by them. Anyway, because of something you may not remember very much of, I'm gonna need you to say some things, is that okay by you?"

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This question seems to be the most confusing thing Cam has said or done so far. "I'm cooperating."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Cool! Your line is 'your task is to go and do whatever you like indefinitely for the consideration of one sunflower seed'."

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"Does something awful happen to me if I say that?"

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"It's possible it will put me in your debt but then I'll just give you more stuff besides the sunflower seed."

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"Will it do anything other than that?"

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"Not to you, unless something really weird and unexpected happens."

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"Your task is to go and do whatever you like indefinitely for the consideration of one sunflower seed," he says unhappily.
 

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"Yes summoner," chirps Cam, and he gives him a sunflower seed.

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He takes it, looking bewildered still.

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"Are we square? I can't tell by looking."

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"Well, you just gave me a sunflower seed, so no."

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"D'you remember how you got the idea to perform your experiment?"

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"Watched a woman summon a - thing like you - to rebuild a barn that had burned down."

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"Tell me when I've asked enough that we're square - how would I find this place and recognize this woman?"

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"It was just north of the ring where we summoned you, maybe an hour of walking? There's a little river and a barn near the river and a house near the barn."

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"And what's the woman look like?"

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"Human? Old enough that she didn't look at all like a fairy with odd features anymore - when they're old they get wrinkly and their teeth fall out and their faces change, I mean. Her hair was brown. We're even."

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"Great, thanks." And he gets up out of his chair and strolls around behind it and pushes it out of the dungeon.

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This fairy is so confused.

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Unfortunately if Cam addressed this they'd probably stop being even!

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The faery will just keep being confused.

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Cam gets the chair back to his room and stashes it in a corner.

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And he comes over a while later to check some more economics experiments.

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"Hi! I can walk now! How are you?"

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"You can walk! Wow, that was easier than I worried it might be."

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"I can also make things without a size limit and things that appear touching people! It's very snazzy."

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"Should make the million years go by a little faster."

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"Or at least with less unnecessary friction and slightly better medical applications for my skills. So what kind of experiments do you have in mind?"

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He wants to run all the experiments he ran with faeries with humans, or with the human in the willing-to-make-arbitrary trades role, and he wants to run some variants that take advantage of the fact that Cam and a human both won't know how valuable a coin is.

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"Auda?" calls Cam. "Is this a good time for the money thing?"

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"Sure."

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Experiments!!! (With graphs!)

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Adding an extra human into the mix enables the collection of more data but doesn't fundamentally alter how the debt system functions. The value of a coin or a written script or anything of the sort tends to be about halfway between its intrinsic value and the amount Cam's willing to trade it for.

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" - there's a way to do something with this but I haven't thought of it yet," he says, looking at the graphs.

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"You know the fundamental problem with this damn thing is it doesn't acknowledge gains from trade. Or losses from trade, like, who actually gets that much out of kicking people who lie to them, intrinsically... Gains from trade is my favorite economic concept, it's like, any time someone goes to the trouble of making a voluntary well-informed exchange they're both richer afterwards, in terms of their own values? And this fucking debt system thinks things just go around with labels stuck to them saying 'worth yea many Debt Bucks' with only a little wiggle room for other things also valued in Debt Bucks you could hypothetically swap them for..."

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"We have the concept. The difference between what something's worth to you and how much debt it costs you...that's why people use sex to settle so much, because for almost all people there's a big difference between how much it costs and how much you'd mind it -"

Permalink Mark Unread

"Where is it getting these metaphorical sticker prices??"

Permalink Mark Unread

"I don't know!!!!"

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"Ugh!" Cam could pace, but doesn't. He does sit down on his bed. "It's just ignoring all the - what else does it ignore?"

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"Doesn't care about what your alternatives are. Doesn't care about your state of information. Tends to undervalue how much people enjoy things, if you're comparing its prioritization to theirs. Sex with humans isn't typically more expensive even though apparently it's bad for them or something? I'm not sure what it's not caring about, there, but it's something."

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"I mean, it's probably ever not been bad for some humans for faeries to have sex with them. Is there some trick we can pull with state of information - if in fact someone walks up to me and says the passphrase and presents me with a token I'll give them a pineapple, but we don't actually tell anyone the passphrase, does the token settle somewhere below the value of a pineapple and stick there -"

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"- it should, yeah. Oh, or if you'll redeem the token at a given price but you are often away visiting all the courts and there's a very long line whenever you're here I don't think that matters either."

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"- ha, holy shit, a use for bread lines."

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"Hmmm?"

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"So there were these countries where they decided that money's stupid and instead they should just have central planners figure out how much of everything people need and government producers make it all and hand it out. This works really badly. Instead of sorting who gets, for example, bread, by who's willing to cough up a couple bucks, they wind up allocating the bread by who is willing to stand in line for like six hours, and then no one, not the baker and not the shopkeeper and not the consumer, gets the value of those six hours, but at least enough people give up and go home that bread-to-people matching is, in a manner of speaking, solved. But if all we're trying to do is fool the stupid debt system, making it pointlessly inconvenient to perform an exchange can be functional! We just make it inconvenient enough that nobody does it - I can be open for five minutes alternate Tuesdays and require a lot of compliance paperwork and stuff, something like that - and the system ignores all that deadweight loss and just pays attention to how many Debt Bucks somebody actually sitting through all that crap would get - right?"

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"I think so but let's test it."

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"What shall I stand ready to exchange for what?"

Permalink Mark Unread

"That's a good question. We want - we want a stably-valued object everyone can use for trade. Its value according to the debt system will be in between what you claim to be willing to trade it for, and what the debt system considers its intrinsic value. So if I'm willing to trade for it at its debt-system value, and so are most other people, because inconvenience is making up for the rest of the difference -

- or if you have a flock of humans willing to trade for it at its debt-system value, making trading at that value far more straightforward than trading at its declared-value-to-you -

- then it seems like in some sense we'd have a coin with an agreed-upon value that the debt system agrees on too. But that's not - it's not doing that much more than just having fancy coins with high intrinsic value, not if that's all we do with it."

Permalink Mark Unread

"- sorry, what's the humanity of the humans doing in this instance, can't we get faeries to also be willing to do that -"

Permalink Mark Unread

"They have to get the goods and services they're predictably willing to trade for the coins from you, and if this involves entangling them with you then it doesn't work as well."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Doesn't anyone have enough stuff lying around without me helping?"

Permalink Mark Unread

"I assume lots of people will be willing to use the coins once lots of other people are using them, so hopefully eventually we enable better trading among those people, but they've got no reason to start."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Yeah, fair enough, I can operate as a sort of bank to kick it off. What's missing, hmmmm..."

Permalink Mark Unread

"I want to - I don't know. Award extra value for doing things that are valuable beyond what the debt system considers them. If there's a way to pull that off."

Permalink Mark Unread

"I mean, you can award everyone a sticker for making positive-sum transactions instead of kicking people - heck, you can't lie, you could even get a good idea of exactly how positive-sum - but then the debt system probably just thinks the stickers are stickers -"

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"Unless we're willing to trade people something valuable for them."

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"...okay, if I'm willing to trade for certificates of positive sum, where's that get us? It doesn't get us face value of the certificates accruing to them, but does it get us there in combination with the bread line thing?"

Permalink Mark Unread

"It'd be worth about half what you're willing to trade for it.

 

If you are announcedly willing to take them at double face value but extremely inconvenient to get a hold of, then they should be worth their face value."

Permalink Mark Unread

Wagwagwagwagwag!

Permalink Mark Unread

"We can just make anything worth whatever we want."

Permalink Mark Unread

"I mean, not to the point where it's worth finding me even if I'm on the Moon."

Permalink Mark Unread

"We should probably test how inconvenient you can be before it stops mattering what you would offer in principle if found."

Permalink Mark Unread

"And probably not by sending me to the Moon, I imagine someone's done forensics ever on the first person to land on the moon instead of specifying who they expect that to be."

Permalink Mark Unread

"We can just pass the coins around with you having announced - and having privately decided but not announced - some different decision rules."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Decision rules for my accessibility or for the value of the tokens?"

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"Your accessibility. I think I know how the values work now."

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"Does the passphrase idea work?"

Permalink Mark Unread

"Let's find out."

Permalink Mark Unread

"All right, I have one."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Awwww. Passphrase doesn't count as willing to trade."

Permalink Mark Unread

"It might be too complicated. I am thinking of a number between one and ten?"

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He holds the coin and concentrates. "...seven. Uh, the debt doesn't move until I contemplate saying possible numbers to you, and then it moved if I contemplated giving it to you and saying seven."

Permalink Mark Unread

 

"Well that's spooky."

Permalink Mark Unread

"I guess setting conditions isn't the best way to go about it, probably. What if I have to wait in a very long line."

Permalink Mark Unread

"We don't have the constituents of such a line but I've just decided I'll be open for business at sidereal dawn and the subsequent subjective fifteen minutes."

Permalink Mark Unread

"- that's fine."

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"...I'll put it in my calendar, then."

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He drops the coin to the ground and - bounces up and down. "We did it! It works! There's a way out! We can price things that we think ought to have a price on them and don't - any of them - and we can get everyone to use currency -"

Permalink Mark Unread

"And they get to internalize the benefits of having beneficial interactions instead of pointlessly horrible expedient ones!"

Permalink Mark Unread

"Everyone'll be so - able to do good things and have them make things better -"

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Cam enters into his calendar that he should be open for fifteen subjective minutes beginning at sidereal dawn. "Wonder how popular it can reasonably get overnight."

Permalink Mark Unread

"We'd need to go to courts and explain how it works, and probably have enough compelling goods around that people are interested in trying it just so they can trade with you, and some courts'll have humans they can trade you in exchange, or will be willing to make an agreement to send you any future humans they get, but most of them won't so we'll probably have to arrange some inferior way for them to pay us back for the initial explanation and goodies. That'd be our bottleneck."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Is the explanation itself going to be expensive? I guess if we can't explain it in a way that doesn't invite lots of clarifying questions - or, no, they probably start with asking 'why are you here', don't they?"

Permalink Mark Unread

"Either way the explanation itself is expensive. It's slightly more expensive if it's all separate questions but not by that much. It's not disastrously expensive, if you're all right with people accepting favors on your behalf, but getting paid back for it will usually take the better part of a day, I'd expect."

Permalink Mark Unread

"I thought volunteering information nobody asked for was free? What's the thing going on there? Subjective or sidereal?"

Permalink Mark Unread

"Subjective. Uh, if we show up and they ask nothing at all and we explain everything we're okay but they'll almost certainly demand to know our business and the difference between 'demand to know our business, we explain everything' and 'demand to know our business, we explain a little bit and they ask clarifying questions' is pretty small."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Damn. Do enough people know how to read that you could fling a pamphlet at them and flee?"

Permalink Mark Unread

"It'd be stupid to read it, if someone did that."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Riiight. I'll get a sense for this eventually. Uh, what kinds of things will tend to be on offer for the introduction?"

Permalink Mark Unread

"Some places might have books, or stories, or musicians, or information about who else might have a human we can buy off them. I do not really understand what was communicated to me of your objections to sex but if I'm travelling with you can accept sexual favors for payment if that's not objectionable. Courts'd want to negotiate this before they let us give the explanation, they're in a vulnerable position if they're in our debt and we haven't got a plan to fix that."

Permalink Mark Unread

"I do not have an objection to sex in general and can try to explain it and then we can try to figure out whether this objection is tripped by the scenario you describe."

Permalink Mark Unread

"We go to a court! We say that we have valuable information and goods to trade and sincerely expect that they'll be glad of arranging to trade with us. We ask what they have. They do not have books or stories we don't already have, they do not have humans, they ask if we'll pick out someone from a set of people, I talk with the people, I find someone, he or she pays us for the information and goods, we give them the information and goods."

Permalink Mark Unread

"How is the set of people determined?"

Permalink Mark Unread

"Mostly by expertise at getting the numbers to come out right, typically."

Permalink Mark Unread

"How does one typically come by that expertise?"

Permalink Mark Unread

"A lot of practice?"

Permalink Mark Unread

"Which one has for what reason?"

Permalink Mark Unread

" - usually because they like it? People tend to specialize in stuff they enjoy, and it's in particular hard to be good at sex if you aren't all that into it."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Usually?"

Permalink Mark Unread

"I mean you could imagine someone who got sort of stuck in that career path because they never found anything they liked better despite not liking it all that much?"

Permalink Mark Unread

"This is not a central case of the thing I object to, then, although it's still not, like, delightful."

Permalink Mark Unread

"I'm still not very clear on - the bits of the thing you object to that aren't encompassed by 'people having lousy choices' or 'people being misinformed about their choices'."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Humans may have psychological architecture about sex in particular that faeries just don't - I'm not sure whether it's that or culture or a mix."

Permalink Mark Unread

"I've never actually talked to any humans beyond the tests today so I couldn't guess."

Permalink Mark Unread

"I'm not sure where you'd reasonably get uncontaminated information even if you talked to humans all the time."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Some people raise human babies in faery courts."

Permalink Mark Unread

"That sounds like a terrible idea!"

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"It's accordingly rare! But not unheard of."

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"It probably hasn't happened often enough to generate very good statistics even if everyone were scrupulously taking data, anyway. Anyway - there are humans who will even in conditions of general abundance and freedom take up a profession of distributing sexual services, though this group is smaller than the group who'll fall into it if they'll otherwise starve. This set of humans isn't identical with the population of humans who just like sex in general - those more likely either find plenty of it as a nontransactional hobby, or can't because they lack in one or more attractive traits and have to buy it since no one would buy it from them. Motives humans might have for unpressuredly choosing to go into the line of work might include directly kinking on it, picking up a variant on the career where they spend many occupational hours attending parties and doing other high status things with their clients before getting around to the sex, or being generous of spirit toward the sort of person who is not attractive enough to find non-transactional partners... I'm probably missing some since I haven't specifically studied this. Humans without any of these unusual motives - well, the parties thing isn't an unusual motive really but it's usually not decisive - humans without these motives often prefer to have sex with only people they're in ongoing romantic relationships with, frequently expressly preferring that they and their partner not be having sex with anyone else. Plenty of humans do like non-relationship-oriented sex but even those ones tend to be turned off by the idea that any of the value they're providing in the encounter is not located in the sex or their company itself."

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"Huh. Uh, people will assert that sex is better when you love someone but in the same spirit as conversation is better, or watching theatre is better, or doing chores is better. I don't think I know anyone who tries to only have sex with one person though some people are really picky about what they like and prefer a very small number of partners for that reason."

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"I can't personally confirm the sex being better when you love someone thing but many humans also assert this."

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"Under a lot of definitions of love I've seen it is practically tautological and even under the other ones it doesn't seem unlikely? But I hadn't been in love before so I don't really know."

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"Does nobody try being monogamous because they couldn't pull it off?" wonders Cam. "Or do faeries just never feel like it? I guess it's commoner in humans than daeva and that seems to be maybe about daeva living longer - don't have data off the top of my head for Limboites -"

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"Some people don't share their slaves but I don't - think of that impulse as one that'd be good if it were more widespread?"

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"Yeah no that seems likely different."

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"Then I really don't think we've got anything comparable."

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"Huh."

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"People do - make big sacrifices for the people they love, to do things that are important to them. I wouldn't expect there's no one who would, just - not common enough I've heard about it."

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"I don't mean, uh, 'sometimes two of the sort of person who won't share their slaves get together and agree out of their deep affection for one another not to self-share', it's like - frequently not construed as a sacrifice."

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"Huh."

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"Including in people who don't claim to experience 'not being interested any more in people who aren't their partner'. Which some people do report."

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"I've heard 'others are disappointing in comparison'?"

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"Also something I've heard, seems like a separate phenomenon."

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"Huh. Well that goes some way to explaining why being around fairies would be bad for humans even if they're not treated poorly by our standards."

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"- the whole thing I have been explaining or just that part, because that part doesn't seem particularly explanatory to me."

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"The whole thing."

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"Yup. I mean, also, the standards of nutrition are not great in this time period but I bet faeries routinely manage to undershoot them."

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"That I knew about. Most courts don't have routine access to a lot of food, not as much as humans need."

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"Which makes 'em a questionable choice of pet."

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"We can trade for all of them, now."

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"Think everybody'll c- metaphorically, uh - you know what that one doesn't make sense if you aren't used to it - trade for them?"

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"Most everybody? Probably a couple people are both in love and powerful enough in their court to veto a deal but I wouldn't expect to run into that more than twice, across the continent."

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"Well, maybe the ones who are in love with their humans are actually nice to them according to the human, wouldn't that be neat."

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"It would. I don't know, I could be guessing wrong about how commonly there'll be objections."

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"We'll find out, I suppose."

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"Yeah. When do you want to leave?"

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"Good question. Where are we going first?"

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"Don't know. I'll talk with my brother and draw up an itinerary. Assuming you want to leave right away."

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"I mean, I need to leave Auda however many meals and some more reading material and stuff, but other than that I don't think we're waiting on anything? I guess we could design the certificates of positive sum in more detail."

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"I guess that might make uptake faster."

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So they can design certificates and a currency to denominate them in! It occurs to Cam that the coins could have some kind of computer generated pattern on them so no person counts as the artist to whom debt may accrue; tests of this guess hold up.

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Bounce bounce bounce bounce bounce.

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"And I should make enough of it exist that it flattens out in value, yeah?"

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"Yep. Looks like the effects of additional ones are pretty negligible once there are twenty."

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Cam's little box accumulates twenty lovely synthetic garnet coins.

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"I'll go get an itinerary."

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"Okay!" chirps Cam.

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He heads off.

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"Any requests for your supply stockpile while I'm gone?" Cam asks Auda.

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"How long will you be gone?"

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"Don't know yet but I'd be surprised if they wanted more than a week subjective? And I can argue 'em down if they want more than you're comfy with."

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"I'll be all right. You'll tell them not to touch me?"

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"Yes."

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"Thank you."

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"You're welcome. You have enough embroidery stuff? I can get another couple book translations patched and make however much food you'll need."

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"I have enough. I don't want to be inconvenient, when you have all those exciting ideas, and could rescue some other people.

Do you - " She shakes her head.

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"Do I what?"

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"I realized it was a stupid and impertinent and personal question."

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"...if you say so."

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She concentrates very hard on the ground for a while. "He is interested in you. I am only mentioning it because not having been around fairies you might not have thought of something like that but they are like that."

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"- didn't pick up on that, but I'll keep the possibility in mind, I guess. Uh, that's not just faeries. I guess maybe it's more common."

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"I don't know how common."

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"Numbers in humans - of, to be clear so we don't euphemize ourselves into a confusion, interest in the same sex - wobble all over the place depending on how you collect your data but it's fewer than one in five probably, and a lot of it's masked if people grow up in an environment that doesn't support it."

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"I wondered when you didn't want me."

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"That's not why. Wouldn't I, like, have a medical problem or at least an angry faery knocking on my door with a medical problem if I lied to - I guess maybe nothing I said was that unambiguous before? But no, it's nothing to do with that. Some people like whichever and still don't want to take advantage of uninterested whichevers we encounter."

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"That also seemed possible. Lots of things seemed possible. - sorry. I ended up thinking about it a lot but not because you did anything wrong."

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"I'm hardly going to blame you for what crosses your mind."

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"Still not entirely convinced you'll blame me for anything I can come up with to do with myself, no matter how outrageous. I bet if I took to wandering around with no clothes you'd tell me future humans don't think anything of that and if I cut off all my hair you'd tell me future humans believe women should look like men if they want to and if I sawed off my foot you'd make a replacement."

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"...uh. I mean, yes, I'd replace your foot, assuming I got to you before you bled to death. Please do not saw off your foot. Haircuts are indeed much less gendered in the future. Future humans do mostly still wear clothes and there's variation in how many, and I would personally prefer that you continue to wear clothes but do not plan to appear them on you against your will if you should decide otherwise?"

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Giggle. "Okay. Good luck on your trip."

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"Thank you."

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He returns not that much later with an itinerary. They can hit up these nearby courts in this order and with reasonable efficiency, and then forward some letters to more distant ones setting up meetings there.

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"How long will this take?"

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"Depends what they have to offer us, but shouldn't be more than a few hours at each? There are twenty-three, here."

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"You're the one who needs to sleep and cannot fly. I need to know how much food to make for Auda."

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"Ten sleeps, maybe eleven."

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"Longer than I guessed. That okay with you?" he asks Auda.

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Nod.

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Cam consults his meal plan for her, confirms with Econ Faery that he remembers right about food taking real and not subjective time to go off, does a little arithmetic, and makes her a dozen days' worth of food that will still be plenty good in... fifteen minutes, all in nice covered dishes so they can stack up against a wall. He provides her with books carefully marked as fiction and translated into faery.

Then he picks a new mail label so his past self won't be confused and so faeries won't learn his name (it's "dear 09913415" which he confirms has never been used as of his conjuration range), makes a couple preprinted copies of it for her, explains how his mail works and that she doesn't have to write coherently on it since she's new at it but if he gets so much as a scribble he will interrupt what he is doing and come back.

And then he asks Econ Faery, "Everybody knows not to touch her or hassle her?"

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"Everyone knows. If she gets suddenly ill or something I have told them it's better to bring her water than to not but they should stay in court if they do so you can satisfy yourself they had a good reason and didn't do anything else."

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"...as opposed to, what, bringing her water and fleeing for the hills?"

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"As opposed to both that and not bringing her water. You make people nervous, you know."

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"I haven't hurt anybody!"

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"People are mostly not in the habit of being right about things."

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"Bleah. Anyway, yes, I think if she suddenly gets sick - unlikely, I think, though I don't know exactly how infectious diseases may work while small and fast - bringing her water is better than not doing that and not fleeing for the hills is preferable to doing that. Auda, try to eat your food evenly spaced throughout the subjective days and in order, if you binge four meals all at once you will get sick and if you decide you've just gotta have the chicken parm before the bagel you probably won't but you might."

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Nod.

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"And write me if you need anything." He stretches out his wings. "Okay. Anything else before we go?"

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"I think we're all set."

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"Bye!" Cam says to Auda, and he follows Econ Faery out.

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Bounce bounce bounce bounce. The nearest court is this one, some neighbors they get along with perfectly well. He explains some things about the neighbors on the way over.

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"Can you explain more about the faery path thing, I want to try to figure out how it'll interact with flying."

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"I have no idea how it'll interact with flying and it might do so in some distinctly odd way, honestly. The world expects fairies to be a particular size in particular places, for lack of a better explanation, and whenever the expected-fairy-sizes are continuous along some land, we see a fairy path. Wandering across a path at the wrong size for it sometimes messes it up. I would tentatively expect that when you fly you will stay the size you were when you left, but I'd be slightly worried about something odd happening to any paths you crossed."

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"So I'd have to - stay really low? That's hard, takes a lot of flapping."

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"Best thing to do might be to travel to some unclaimed territory where you can fly around and if you damage any paths no one'll be annoyed or trapped or anything."

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"Do new paths ever appear?"

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"Yeah. They just take a while. There are often paths climbing trees, things like that, and they emerge as the tree grows."

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"Do natural disasters affect them?"

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"Yep. Anything that substantially disturbs the natural environment will affect the paths."

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"In predictable ways?"

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"Not always. Humans reshaping the land almost always destroy all the paths on it. A fire that levels all the plant growth will tend to destroy all the paths too. Anything else is more unpredictable."

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"Do you do controlled burns to avoid big fires?"

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"Can't start a fire fast. Or at least we don't know how."

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"Sometimes people are slow, though, right? To have kids or do magic?"

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"Yeah. They could start a fire if they wanted to though the debt you'd incur would be really, really dangerous."

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"If you have little fires on a routine basis, there's less accumulated fuel for a big one to get going."

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"That makes sense but the debt system is stupid and if you destroy some things to prevent some future larger uncertain destruction it just counts as you having destroyed some things."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Maybe you could slow down a human to do your forestry? I'm not sure if the cost-benefit works out though."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Might depend how competently we can identify things to burn and how on board the local fairies are. It's an interesting idea, though."

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"I don't currently know anything substantial about fire management, the German climate as pertains thereto, or local faeries as likewise, but I do seem to be able to conjure reference materials from the future, so."

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"Maybe some people will want to trade for them once they have currency to trade with."

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Wag wag wag. "You know what we didn't do, we didn't name the coins."

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"We didn't! We should. Something memorable."

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"They're... made of synthetic garnet? Their pattern was produced using Beecritter's Computer Aided Design Studio 6? They will revolutionize the faery economy?"

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"You made them."

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"I can't exactly name them after myself!"

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"It's very tragic. Are there any interesting or notable words for currencies in the future -"

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"I mean, there are names for the various kinds - the denominations, and classes of currency like 'fiat' or 'crypto'? Is 'fiat' a good name?"

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"I think it's an amazing name but I might not be our intended audience. - on the other hand, maybe they'll get curious and learn something."

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"We could poll the courts!"

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"That'll help them repay us, too, a question we ask everyone in the courts and sincerely want all of their answers to."

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Wag. "Good, good."

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"If we can come up with a bunch of other questions we might want to survey everyone about, we could let all the courts that don't have humans pay that way. It'll speed everything up."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Hmmm... do you think it should come in more denominations? It'd make it harder to keep the values matching right and most of the added liquidity is supposed to come from certificates, but those will be in all kinds of weird dimensions... is there a way to make the certificates divisible, besides just filling out a bunch for fractions of the surplus..."

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"I think you'd have to fill out ones for fractions but that's not that much inconvenience really. Maybe it'll inspire more people to learn to write. It might be useful to have a very large denomination so anyone who does something big doesn't have to carry around a whole bag of them."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Ooh, there could be stamps - if you stamp a piece of paper does that reliably carry the you-can-be-sure-it's-not-lying property - you don't generally have to worry about people stealing, right? So carrying them around would mostly be for intercourt trade?"

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"Stamping something is the same as writing it. Theft is very rare, you'd mostly carry it when you wanted to redeem it for something."

Permalink Mark Unread

"What kind of big and little denominations do you think would wind up being most convenient? The little one should probably be like - I remember reading something about small debts dissolving over time, so something small enough that anything smaller will do that unproblematically, and then the big denomination should be big enough that trying to haul that many little ones to another court would be an impediment to trade, like... certainly at least a thousand times the value of the little one, maybe more."

Permalink Mark Unread

"A thousand would be pretty inconvenient to carry, I think, and most debts are less than a thousand times the value of a debt just large enough it won't go away. You could do five hundred but if a thousand is desirable mathematically that seems fine too."

Permalink Mark Unread

"A thousand isn't special, I just think if the certificates are yea big - about the size of a bill from the era of paper money among humans - then one person can carry that many if they're packed up neatly. Five hundred's fine. People might start trading for bigger things when they can do it with money, though, I'm not sure current typical debt sizes are a good guide."

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"I hope they do!! If a thousand isn't that hard to carry then we can do a thousand, I haven't seen how they'll pack."

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Cam checks his computer for a second, squinting at the blinky screen. "Yeah, you can pack a thousand dollar-size bills in a container yea big," he says, gesturing a briefcase-size object.

Permalink Mark Unread

"Huh. Then that's great."

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"Packing efficiency probably goes down if people are stamping random scrap paper instead of using standard rectangles but I don't think that much, you might need two briefcases."

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"Still so much easier than trade used to be!!"

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Wag wag wag!

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He beams at him. They reach the edge of his court's territory. "People will be along to ask our business shortly, I expect."

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"We just wait here?"

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"We can keep walking if we want, but we should be careful not to break things."

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Cam looks for a good place to sit, since probably it will be complicated in some way if he makes a chair.

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There are rocks and roots of about the appropriate size.

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Plop. Cam makes himself a churro and starts munching it.

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Faeries are along in a little bit. Econ Faery explains their mission, and they are offered an escort to the court.

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Assuming Econ Faery does not indicate that anything odd is up about this Cam will follow along!

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He seems to think this is as-expected. "Think of any other survey questions for them?"

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"Do my operating hours sound inconvenient enough?" suggests Cam.

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"Sure. I think we'd need five or six questions, in a typically sized court, for that to pay for our demonstration all by itself."

Permalink Mark Unread

"I can try to think of more but right now I'm stuck on 'would it be nice if the coins came in different colors' and that can't possibly be a very valuable question. Can it?"

Permalink Mark Unread

"Not really. If you actually deeply cared about the answer then it might but not as - filler. You could ask faery sociology questions, they don't have to be about the currency."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Ooh, faery sociology questions. I wanna know stuff about how faeries raise kids. And if there are dialects of the language."

Permalink Mark Unread

"My father has really thorough notes on that second thing. You could ask how they'd spell a couple of different words where there's regional variance in how people say them. And whether they've had kids or want them, and...what else would you want to know about childrearing?"

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"How... you... parent them? I assume you don't just sort of leave them in a box and give them a cup of dew once a day."

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"Only when they're very small."

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"Are you telling me you literally leave babies in boxes and give them a cup of dew once a day. ...Should I save this question for somebody we're trying to trade."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Probably. Uh, you could ask on the survey how much time people spent with their children at what ages, and what were some typical activities, and at what age they considered their children competent."

Permalink Mark Unread

"I would sure like to know all those things as of now. Poor baby faeries!"

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"I mean, they're not people yet at that age."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Things that happen to pre-sapient babies or even embryos can affect them as adults in, like, every species of animal I can think of including humans!"

Permalink Mark Unread

"Huh. I mean obviously if you neglect them horrendously they'll never turn into a person at all?"

Permalink Mark Unread

"Like if they die or do you mean you are aware of intermediate forms of damage?"

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"They can die or if you never expose them to language they will never become people as far as the debt system is concerned."

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"When does the debt system usually think they're people, about?"

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"Once they're talking. Really talking, not just 'mama' and 'dada' and a name for a favorite toy."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Oh, they bother saying 'mama' and 'dada', I was concerned there for a bit! Has anyone tried, uh, not neglecting babies."

Permalink Mark Unread

"I mean if you tried carrying them around you'd probably kill them? I suppose some people sing to them or talk to them or are confined to a room with them for unrelated reasons or something."

Permalink Mark Unread

"...why would you kill them?"

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"New babies are very small and very fragile. If they get too warm or too cold they die, and if they're jostled they can die, and you'd be putting them at a lot of risk if you just carried them around. After about six months of development, subjectively, they're stable enough this isn't a risk anymore and you can carry them around at that stage, which many people do."

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"...are they unlike human babies in some obvious way?"

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"I think human pregnancies go significantly longer but I don't know all that much about humans. I know that sometimes humans carry babies that resemble a faery baby of the age where you'd carry them."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Human babies can be carried immediately. And should be. If you don't touch a human baby, like, kind of a lot, they tend to die or at least have serious problems."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Huh. Maybe human pregnancies are long enough that they're born already carrying-sized."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Premature human babies can also be carried - how long are faery pregnancies?"

Permalink Mark Unread

"Three slow months. At that point it is safe to remove the baby, but not required; you have to remove them at some point, though, and it only gets more difficult past that point, so most people remove the baby right at the third month."

Permalink Mark Unread

"...to remove the baby via, what, surgery? Do they not emerge on their own if you wait?"

Permalink Mark Unread

"On one occasion, experimentally, some people tried waiting to see if the baby ever came out on its own and it did after nine months and the mother died. Understandably people haven't tried that again."

Permalink Mark Unread

"...childbirth does sometimes kill humans, who have nine-month pregnancies, but not usually, even without good medical care. Also I'd expect C-sections - that's what we call surgical baby removal - to be dangerous without good medical care too..."

Permalink Mark Unread

"I don't know much about what went wrong. It could've been a statistically unlikely mischance. But also, nine months slow is much much longer to wait for a partner than three months slow so without any discernible benefits..."

Permalink Mark Unread

"So, a human baby born three months along pretty much does not survive, I think they maybe don't even have lungs yet, so something different is going on, but in humans there's an inflection point around twenty-three to twenty-four weeks where they get much more viable. The closer they get to the full nine months the better, by and large, but that's where it starts getting much easier to make sure a premature human baby doesn't outright die. Also you can pick them up and carry them around then as long as all their medical accessories are the portable kind."

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"Usually once you've extracted the baby you walk it to somewhere cozy and get it all swaddled up in magic cloth and in a good safe location then you speed up and go about your life and feed it regularly. It'll speed up on its own gradually. If you instead want to stay slow you still wouldn't want to carry it around, though, they're very fragile at that stage."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Maybe the magic cloth is doing a whole hell of a lot of work here."

Permalink Mark Unread

"I think if you have other cloths you just have to change them regularly, which is hard around a slow baby."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Oooooor they're glorified diapers."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Maybe one of these courts will have a baby in progress you can take a look at."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Maybe. If they're not people do they accumulate debt?"

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"No. Debt can only apply to people."

Permalink Mark Unread

"So at least they wouldn't accumulate problems from receiving the service of more parental investment."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Parentdebts are overwhelming in size anyway, it wouldn't change much if they were a little bigger. It'd be a move in the wrong direction but not a significant one."

Permalink Mark Unread

"...why are parentdebts overwhelming, if they don't start out counting?"

Permalink Mark Unread

"Once they become a person they start out with parentdebts. They're for the act of creation, with the motherdebt accordingly much bigger than the fatherdebt; they don't vary by how much parental investment there was."

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"That seems... weird... but okay."

Permalink Mark Unread

"I have mixed feelings about parentdebts because they seem in some sense unreasonable but also I think existence is mostly very valuable to people so it makes sense for that to be incentivized and rewarded."

Permalink Mark Unread

"I mean, the weird thing to me is that they're coming in retroactively for something that happened while the entity was not considered a debt-qualified agent."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Most people think of them as being present when you start existing, rather than happening retroactively."

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"I guess."

Permalink Mark Unread

"I think you could make parentdebts smaller and still have people have children, but probably not small enough to not define the course of your early life."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Do I need to be planning to buy everyone's children out and designing a curriculum on how once your baby has skin you need to hold them... I should reserve judgment till I have looked at a faery baby."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Once babies are fast it won't be hard to convince people to hold them more."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Maybe that'll help. You've evidently muddled along as a civilization while making like marsupials in the premature baby department but yiiiiikes."

Permalink Mark Unread

"What problems would you expect it to cause?"

Permalink Mark Unread

"Rusty on my perinatology but I'd translate the name of the condition as 'failure to thrive' - and vaguely remember something about if babies don't get evidence that when they cry they'll get attention and help it makes them sociopaths."

Permalink Mark Unread

"I imagine some people will want to try anything that reportedly improves children."

Permalink Mark Unread

"I'm a little worried that some amount of sociopathy is culturally functional but babies take a long time relative to the march of faery social progress so maybe it will never be an issue."

Permalink Mark Unread

"How might that work -"

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"This is me speculating wildly and with approximately no confidence, but, oh, suppose it's important that faery babies are a bit neglected because if they aren't they will form the expectation that in general others will help them when they need help without that being complicated to navigate particularly, only as soon as the debt system considers them people this expectation is suddenly invalidated, and they ultimately find the disappointing transition at age, like, what, two?, to be more traumatizing than the initial neglect."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Huh. I think people usually don't withhold any help from their new children, it's expected that you just don't bring them around people you don't want them building debt with because young people can be unexpectedly needy."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Could be that sensing debt alone is doing some of what I imagine. Or I could be on the wrong track."

Permalink Mark Unread

"That could be. Is there reason to think there's - continuity of identity and expectations across not being a person to being a person, most people figure there isn't."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Humans don't remember infancy as adults, usually, but often don't remember a considerable amount of their early verbal life either. There was an unethical experiment done once on a pre-verbal-age baby where they showed him a... white furry thing of some kind, I forget what the first white furry thing was, and made a loud noise each time he saw it, until the white furry thing alone made him afraid, and later on I think they lost track of him so I don't know how long he continued to fear white furry things but they did verify before losing track of him that it generalized to other white furry things, so learning took place?"

Permalink Mark Unread

"Huh!"

Permalink Mark Unread

"And I think babies can recognize faces and voices pretty early too."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Babies do prefer the people they know to strangers."

Permalink Mark Unread

"There you go. How much time does it take the babies to speed up?"

Permalink Mark Unread

"About two months, sidereal."

Permalink Mark Unread

"So... longer than that subjectively for the babies during which time they don't hear anybody talking, or see anybody..."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Yeah. But if they were still inside someone's body they wouldn't have those things either."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Not true! Necessarily, with as ever the caveat that all I've studied is humans. It's possible to hear in there once the ears are present. It is admittedly dark. And even congenitally deaf babies are in physical contact with another person."

Permalink Mark Unread

“Huh. - the person I know of who got nine months was my father. If you told me the experience adds fifteen IQ points I’d believe you but anything interpersonal not so much.”

Permalink Mark Unread

"I mean, this sort of thing is exactly why you need large sample sizes. - I'm sorry about your grandma, sorry, took me a second to catch up with all the - implications -"

Permalink Mark Unread

“Don’t apologize- anyone can think of the thing about my grandmother but most people wouldn’t think of the thing about the sample sizes, and it’s objectively more important.”

Permalink Mark Unread

"I didn't invent the concept of the sample size, everybody is giving me way too much credit for everything."

Permalink Mark Unread

“It is entirely possible everyone from your world would have figured out how to transform mine, but I don’t think that matters to me. I’m not - assigning credit for it. I just want it.”

Permalink Mark Unread

"Well, that I can do. I am here and due to the fear of annihilating the universe if I go mess with the human timeline I have no other demands on my schedule than making faeryland as good as I can get it for the next million years."

Permalink Mark Unread

He looks rather adoring.

Permalink Mark Unread

That... is very cute... but faeries are weird.

Follow follow follow.

Permalink Mark Unread

They get to the court. It’s inside a hedge. The aesthetics are different than the courts he’s seen so far but the fundamentals are the same. People gather around for the presentation.

Permalink Mark Unread

Cam has little notecards and can present things!

Permalink Mark Unread

People are intrigued though they do not actually get to fascinated until they get to see cool stuff they can’t get some less complicated way.

Permalink Mark Unread

The key here is the certificates, which will allow them to capture debt-system-legible tokens of performing beneficial trades. All they have to do is, using the denominations they've invented and stabilized, enumerate how much surplus there is, agree on how to divide it, assert it on certificates like so, and boom - valid certificates may be inconveniently redeemed for more than their value if they show up during the fifteen subjective minute window at dawn on the fourth of any sidereal month according to this human calendar whose leap years he is going to mention but not explain!

Permalink Mark Unread

Some people think this is neat but a lot of them are...confused. There is muttering. So then there's paper that can cancel some debt but is not, in fact, actually worth anything except to the debt system what with those conditions being wildly inconvenient? It'd be useful to have a little on hand for situations where you just want to cancel and don't care about getting anything in return but usually you...want something in return...though it's sort of worth something since it's also convenient for other people to possess? But it's not liable to be very useful. 

Permalink Mark Unread

"You might be better than me at getting across the culture gap here," Cam suggests to Econ Faery.

Permalink Mark Unread

"I think you should make some stuff. Food and plastic and electronics and so on."

Permalink Mark Unread

"What's not going to be annoying to have around afterwards?"

Permalink Mark Unread

"They'll take it. But I guess to be safe it could be mostly food."

Permalink Mark Unread

Decorative plastic tray of hors d'oeuvres and a little electric tealight in the middle.

Permalink Mark Unread

There's some muttering. 

People come up and take a look at the things. 

"And you'll only trade your - certificates - for them?"

Permalink Mark Unread

"That's not strictly required for the scheme to work but I am accustomed to delineating prices in fixed denomination and I have locally irregular hangups about some of your popular debt resolution mechanisms."

Permalink Mark Unread

Confused fairy. 

Permalink Mark Unread

"Our court has a lot of things like this, and will have more, because he can make them any time he wants to. The only problem is payment. You might be able to trade other things but you can certainly trade the certificates."

 

People try arranging trades among themselves and writing things down. People take hors d'ouvres. 

People really like hors d'ouvres.

Permalink Mark Unread

Awww. Would they like more hors d'ouevres?

Permalink Mark Unread

There is some scrambling to make more trades so they can afford them.

Permalink Mark Unread

"We had a survey. To help everyone pay for everything."

Permalink Mark Unread

Then they will also fill out surveys in exchange for hors d'ouevres.

Permalink Mark Unread

Awww this is cute. It's fun coming up with different interesting hors d'oeuvres for them.

Permalink Mark Unread

"But we can only reach him at those odd hours -"

 

Permalink Mark Unread

"You can only redeem them at twice their debt-value at the odd hours. The rest of the time, they're only tradeable for the value that's printed on them. But people can use them to buy things from him, and people are going to want to buy things from him, so people are going to want them."

Permalink Mark Unread

There is a very big crowd for as long as Cam will tolerate it.

Permalink Mark Unread

Cam wags his tail and sells snacks. What do faeries like? Avocado eggrolls? Skittles? Rice cakes? Tiny poppyseed muffins?

Permalink Mark Unread

Faeries like all of these things!!! A lot!

Permalink Mark Unread

Faeries liking food is cute. Eventually he's running out of ideas though.

Permalink Mark Unread

"We should head on to the next one anyway."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Thanks for your time, everybody!" says Cam as they head out.

Permalink Mark Unread

"I think they'll use it. Some. If the people they trade with use it."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Well, let's hit all their neighbors, then. Maybe I can occasionally throw snack parties where I make stuff in bulk to vend?"

Permalink Mark Unread

"That'll help, yeah. It's a useful idea, it's just a odd one and the complicated rules about your hours are confusing. Though I don't know that it'd be better not to mention it."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Seems like it'd be rude, someone would be like 'ha, I thought of an obvious flaw in the system' and show up and I'm closed and they're annoyed, probably."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Yeah. - I suspect we will get some people who accumulate lots of them and come to you with an order. Even with the substantial debt-related deterrent to doing that."

Permalink Mark Unread

"I mean that seems a little like - investing? Generating value and hanging on to it for a while. Maybe eventually there will be better investments available. But yeah I can put in the compliance paperwork how they plan to square it?"

Permalink Mark Unread

"Sounds good."

Permalink Mark Unread

"It'll be fun when there are better investments available!"

Permalink Mark Unread

"Yes. It will." Bounce bounce.

Permalink Mark Unread

"Although we might have to do more complicated finagling for things structured like functional loans with an expected loss rate to work..."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Hmmm. Debt doesn't account at all for the probability it won't be repaid, debts accumulate exactly the same to someone who's about to die."

Permalink Mark Unread

"I mean, ideally you want it to be possible for some fraction of people to default on a loan put toward a risky but worthwhile venture without everything being ruined forever, and then the investor just invests in a thousand things and enough of them pan out."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Oooohhhhh." Longing sigh.

Permalink Mark Unread

"Doesn't work so well if your risky venture failing means you get stuck tangled up with your investor though."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Yeah. There might be some way to do it as a series of bets, I'd have to think about it."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Ooh, that might work depending on how debt handles bets, investments aren't that dissimilar from bets except both parties hope for the same outcome..."

Permalink Mark Unread

Nodnod. "That makes it not obvious how you finagle it but it feels like there ought to be some way. Debt handles bets pretty gracefully. If I bet you some of my possessions that something won't happen, and it does, they're yours now and transferring them to you doesn't create debt in either direction. Having an open bet creates entanglement. You can't use this to clear large debts for free because it doesn't count if both parties are confident in the same direction, and it doesn't count if the disagreement is too complicated for the universe to resolve it. I wrote a book - it's called "Betting" -"

Permalink Mark Unread

Cam has a copy of this book now. "Can you make it work if they merely have different confidences in the same direction, that works for human betting..."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Yep, as long as they meaningfully disagree or if they're both about even odds and willing to take opposite sides of that."

Permalink Mark Unread

"That'd limit investment but not cut it off altogether, especially if it only cares about odds and not about return - see, an investor can afford to invest in stuff that will almost certainly fail as long as a success would be good enough and there's enough of the things and they have enough fallback cushion in case they're unlucky on every one."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Hmm. I think there's a way to do it though I don't see the structure yet. What are investors - being promised, exactly -"

Permalink Mark Unread

"A typical structure is that you construe an enterprise such as a business - originally I think it was boats or boat voyages? - as a thing you can own a tiny fraction of. If the enterprise survives, the investor collects some number of tiny fractions of it, 'shares', and is entitled to sell them at a value that winds up tracking the value of the enterprise entire, and also sometimes the enterprise just gives all its shareholders money in proportion to their ownership. If the enterprise fails the shares don't exist, or I guess if necessary you could have them exist as a legal fiction but they wouldn't be connected to anything profit-generating."

Permalink Mark Unread

He considers this for a while. "I think the hardest thing to solve is that shareholders will be entangled."

Permalink Mark Unread

"I wonder how far you can get on the idea of corporations. Those are legal fictions that under some legal structures can act as people, and don't necessarily have to have more than one person operating it."

Permalink Mark Unread

"You can incur debt to a court but this functions identically to incurring debt to its head."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Probably doesn't help then. Damn."

Permalink Mark Unread

Sigh. 

Permalink Mark Unread

"Do courts always have exactly one head?"

Permalink Mark Unread

" - that's a good question and I have no idea why I've never - many courts present themselves as having two but I don't know how the debt accumulates."

Permalink Mark Unread

"We can ask at a court that presents as having two if we're visiting any?"

Permalink Mark Unread

"Yes, we definitely should. I think some of them are." He squints at this list. "This one, at minimum."

Permalink Mark Unread

Cam makes a squiggle next to that court on the list.

Permalink Mark Unread

"If that part works I think I see a sketch of how the rest might. A endeavor would be a bet between a person and the enterprise that the enterprise can take the person's money and get returns in excess of it. The person takes the positive side of the bet, they're betting that the endeavor will succeed; the endeavor has to bet against itself, so if it's 'right' it claims the money invested in it and if it's 'wrong' it has to pay out its profits."

Permalink Mark Unread

"That's a little psychologically wacky but I don't think that sinks it."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Not everyone can finagle the right state of mind probably but I think anyone who'd do a good job running a business is capable of arriving with an investor at a shared estimate of its odds of success and then taking the other side of the bet that sets up."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Yeah, it makes more sense phrased that way."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Just gotta figure out the entanglement."

Permalink Mark Unread

"How does borrowing stuff work in general?"

Permalink Mark Unread

"If you have an explicit agreement to return it that's entanglement. More often there's an expression of intent to return it, which means you get all the debt for taking-with-permission but not entanglement from agreeing to return it, and then the debt goes away once you do return it."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Do people or courts ever have things that are just freely borrowable under some condition - I don't think this relates to the project, just curious if you can have a communal saw or whatever - what counts as a thing, surely there's any maintenance required on walking paths and ceilings and such that undergo some wear and tear..."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Courts have communal tools which you don't incur any debt by picking up to use for chores around the court, but you'd get debt if you took them outside the court. People are indebted to a court for the hospitality if they stay in it and that adds up to more than the cost of the food and room and probably incorporates costs like that. Walking paths don't count."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Are people liable for accidents? Trip and break a dish?"

Permalink Mark Unread

"Yes, you have to pay for that."

Permalink Mark Unread

"I suppose there are any advantages to it working that way."

Permalink Mark Unread

"It mostly seems reasonable to me, does your society mostly not make people pay for things they break?"

Permalink Mark Unread

"If the thing matters much the owner has insurance!"

Permalink Mark Unread

"That sounds like it'd create some incentive problems."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Insurance fraud is illegal."

Permalink Mark Unread

"I was mostly thinking of carelessness."

Permalink Mark Unread

"The insurers charge you less if you can demonstrate that you're doing things the fancy insurance statisticians, called 'actuaries', think reduce your risk."

Permalink Mark Unread

"That's clever."

Permalink Mark Unread

"By the time I'm from they have a lot of chances to try stuff out! Without having to navigate debt! In a population that thinks debt is pretty well approximate to the be-all and end-all of the important stuff!"

Permalink Mark Unread

"Maybe you could structure something like that as bets, here, too."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Ooh, yeah, insurance is a lot like a bet - it runs on risk aversion, not so much on differing odds, you could come to an agreement about how likely qualifying issues are and then take opposite sides just because the insurer doesn't think all their payouts will come due on the same day and the insured is willing to take an expected loss to mitigate a really bad tail risk."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Still got to figure out some way to not entangle everyone with outstanding agreements but if we had one we could totally arrange that. ...tail risk is..."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Oh, that's a graph thing, if you graph the odds of a thing being bad and most of the curve is a big hump over here in 'not too bad' and there's a low line -" He gestures. "- over in real bad outcomes, that looks sort of like a tail attached to the hump."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Like, the amount of suffering a court will experience due to natural disasters, in any given sun day?"

Permalink Mark Unread

"I guess?"

Permalink Mark Unread

"What sorts of things are structured that way for humans?"

Permalink Mark Unread

"Well, natural disasters over a longer period of time, I suppose, they're not generally quantized by the day."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Natural disasters would be hard for fairies to insure against because no one's really rich enough to much mitigate them."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Well. Soon."

Permalink Mark Unread

He sure is the most wonderful person in the entire world.

Permalink Mark Unread

 

So how about that next court huh?

Permalink Mark Unread

Most of the other courts go similarly. The idea is a bit too abstract for people until, motivated by goodies, they manage to figure it out. Cam is very popular.

Permalink Mark Unread

Faeries liking food is fun. Do faeries like popcorn shrimp? Marzipan? Banana chips? Little bagels with cream cheese and capers and lox? Donut holes? One-bite cheese frittatas? Honey glazed ham? Deep fried pickles? Assorted interesting cheese? Jalapeno poppers wrapped in bacon?

Permalink Mark Unread

Faeries like all of these things!!!! Everything he produces goes pretty fast but their strongest preference seems to be for light, snacklike, interestingly flavored and textured things. Also no root vegetables and things that are like flower nectar. They get lots of those and are not very excited about them.

Permalink Mark Unread

No root vegetables? But they haven't seen half the things humanity is going to invent to do with potatoes and onions, seriously. Garlic fries! Vinegary chips! Beer-battered onion rings! (But, yes, light snacklike interestingly flavored and textured, how do faeries feel about the weird molecular gastronomy foams?)

Permalink Mark Unread

Faeries think that's amazing.

Permalink Mark Unread

Weird molecular gastronomy foams for everyone! And little toasts with hummus on them. And baba ganoush. And tzatziki. And he's just gonna continue on a Mediterranean theme for a bit now.

Permalink Mark Unread

Well it's good he isn't getting tired of this all that quickly because there's going to be so many of these.

Permalink Mark Unread

There might be repeats after a few courts.

Permalink Mark Unread

Well, he won't tell anybody.

Permalink Mark Unread

"Where are you going to sleep?" Cam asks. "Do I like, buy you a room in one of these places, or...?"

Permalink Mark Unread

"That'd probably be most convenient. I've been napping a little once people run out of questions for me and before they run out of orders for you but I won't be able to get away with just that for the whole trip."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Do you have a preference which of these ones we stay at?"

Permalink Mark Unread

"Not particularly. They'll all have beds and the debt's about the same."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Next one, maybe, unless you have reason to expect one soon after to have a baby so I can occupy myself investigating the baby."

Permalink Mark Unread

"I don't know if any of these have babies so next one sounds good."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Cool."

Next court. Does the next court like spicy things? Cam is in the mood to make spicy things. And little mochi ice creams in fun flavors for anyone who is startled by a spicy thing.

Permalink Mark Unread

They're startled by spicy things! Some of them come back for more anyway. If he makes the things spicy enough the debt system actually thinks that he has harmed them, though it takes a lot of spice to get there and the ice creams pay it back.

Permalink Mark Unread

Cam does not surprise anyone with an entire pickled habanero but he does apologize to the people who are dismayed by wasabi tuna poke.

Permalink Mark Unread

What, they don't mind, this is a fascinating experience and they didn't even have to pay for it!

Permalink Mark Unread

...Cam waves the certificates he has been paid for wasabi tuna poke.

Permalink Mark Unread

Maybe they will need to have two words for 'pay' at some point or something.

Permalink Mark Unread

Maybe! Though Cam's native language uses 'pay' both neutrally for currency and also metaphorically for e.g. revenge.

Permalink Mark Unread

This inspires some curiosity about Cam's native society.

Permalink Mark Unread

Well, it's very different and completely inaccessible at. Uh. This time.

Permalink Mark Unread

Luckily they don't badger him for more of an explanation since it'd be expensive and mean they got less food.

Permalink Mark Unread

Who wants CUPCAKE POPS?

Permalink Mark Unread

Faeries!!

Permalink Mark Unread

And at some point he'll buy Econ Faery a hotel room and ask if there's a baby here by any chance.

Permalink Mark Unread

They have a kid who's knee height and talking?

Permalink Mark Unread

Not a baby, but still interesting! Can he meet the kid?

Permalink Mark Unread

Uh, typically people are pretty hesitant about that because it's easy to trip up kids into making mistakes that indebt them.

Permalink Mark Unread

"Is there some kind of best practices about that I should know if I do ever meet a kid? Or if necessary can we do that thing with the crystals - how long does that take? - and I'll take certificates for it?"

Permalink Mark Unread

"If you intend to transfer any debt that results we can do that, yes. It doesn't take long."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Then I'd be interested to meet the kid."

Permalink Mark Unread

"All right."

The kid is interested in the wings, and runs up to touch them. "You're soft," he declares.

Permalink Mark Unread

"Wings are fine but not the tail, please. How are you doing? Did you wind up getting any of the food?"

Permalink Mark Unread

"I did. It was better than a feast even though there wasn't as much of it."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Why's that?"

Permalink Mark Unread

"I liked the food."

Permalink Mark Unread

"You don't like regular feast food?"

Permalink Mark Unread

"I like regular feast food ALSO."

Permalink Mark Unread

"I see. What do you do when you aren't feasting?"

Permalink Mark Unread

"I like to do lots of things."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Like what?"

Permalink Mark Unread

He is lost in thought for a little while. "I like learning to draw! And singing. And climbing trees."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Do you think you'll learn to read?"

Permalink Mark Unread

He looks at his mother. She shrugs. "Maybe when he's bigger."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Do you remember before you could talk?"

Permalink Mark Unread

"Before I could talk I was a baby. I was in my mommy's tummy and then I got taken out and I grew and I grew until I was me."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Yup, do you remember any of that?"

Permalink Mark Unread

He seems sort of confused by that question. "I was in my mommy's tummy and then I grew and grew."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Okay. Do you ever get to hang out with other kids from other courts?"

Permalink Mark Unread

"No-o. That would be bad. We would get tangled."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Oh. Yeah, I guess."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Someday I will be big and know how to be smart talking to people and then I can go to other courts."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Are you looking forward to that?"

Permalink Mark Unread

"Yeah!"

Permalink Mark Unread

"What are you gonna do when you can go visiting?"

Permalink Mark Unread

"I dunno." He looks to his mom again. 

Permalink Mark Unread

"Does your mom pay for all your drawing supplies and stuff?"

Permalink Mark Unread

"Yeah. And toys and things."

Permalink Mark Unread

"What kinda toys do you have?"

Permalink Mark Unread

"I have little fast aminals. A bird and a cat and a snake and an ant and a worm. And I have a wagon they go on. And I have little people. And I have a little fairy court the people pretend to live in. It's pretending because they aren't real people so everything they do is pretending. And I have a ball that rolls, and blocks."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Sounds pretty good. Do your parents tell you stories?"

Permalink Mark Unread

"Yeah."

Permalink Mark Unread

"What's your favorite one?"

Permalink Mark Unread

"I don't remember."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Is there one you like and do remember?"

Permalink Mark Unread

"I like all of them."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Wow, all of them?"

Permalink Mark Unread

"ALL the stories."

Permalink Mark Unread

When Econ Faery is up the next subjective... wake... time..., Cam finds him and says, "I got to meet a kid. Didn't seem too worrying to chat with him, but then my first guess about why faeries are how faeries are would not in fact have been 'child neglect' based on talking to adults either, so I don't know exactly how to count it."

Permalink Mark Unread

"I'm curious what your first guess was."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Uh, 'just kind of like that as a species inherently' followed by 'sensing debt alone does this, it's sensorily compelling in some way'."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Some people report really disliking the feeling of running debt - in either direction - but that's not typical. More people report enjoying the physical sensation of debt running the right way but I think that's probably mostly downstream of the ways it's socially important and useful. Most people dislike the experience of someone else doing something that sharply increases debt - like lying to you or breaking your stuff or refusing a request or whatever - but again, that's hard to separate from the implications that has and the kinds of contexts in which you'd experience it."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Something doesn't necessarily have to be conspicuous to be sensorily compelling in the way I mean. You can condition a human into stuff with very small stimuli."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Huh! Then maybe that does affect us."

Permalink Mark Unread

"I mean, I'd be surprised if it didn't, I just don't know how much to attribute to it. I'll be fascinated to see how the certificates work out though, being able to settle things quickly and impersonally without further negotiation seems like it could make everything sting less."

Permalink Mark Unread

"I really really hope so."

Permalink Mark Unread

"I could imagine it making some things worse. Sometimes if you have a rule against a thing, and there's some people breaking the rule occasionally, and then you impose a fine on that with the intent of reducing the behavior, people are just like 'oh, that's what it costs to do this thing if I feel like it' and do it more - which is frustrating enough when you can just jack up the fine, and may be worse if you're stuck with the debt system assessment of the matter and can't even do that. I could see someone hating being lied to enough that getting a wad of cash didn't cut it and I could also see some people being willing to lie - out of spite maybe, even though you can't really do it to deceive - once they'd be able to predict the cost to themselves."

Permalink Mark Unread

"I mean, lying's different, it causes misfortune, not just debt. No one considers a lie settled when it's debt value is, if it was intentional and there's entanglement."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Same principle applies to other things. Being careless around fragile stuff, maybe. When I got first summoned I used a figure of speech that counted as a lie and the guy started hitting me and kicking me, it was really confusing!"

Permalink Mark Unread

"Wow. He sounds like - an unfortunate first person to meet. I guess smart people mostly don't do experiments with some one in a thousand chance of getting them killed."

Permalink Mark Unread

"I'm told he was a disposable idiot and that's why he had permission to try it!"

Permalink Mark Unread

"Well, there you go, then. Behind almost every mystery there's a selection effect."

Permalink Mark Unread

Cam giggles. "Time to collect our poll answers and hike to the next one?"

Permalink Mark Unread

"Yes, let's."

Permalink Mark Unread

Onward!

Does this court like... mini pies? And the nacho cheese genre of snackfood? And yogurt covered raisins? And olives? And little mini salamis and pepperonis and such?

Permalink Mark Unread

Yep, and yep and yep and yep and yep and yep.

Permalink Mark Unread

Bribing people to adopt new social technology is fun!!!

Permalink Mark Unread

He's sort of uniquely suited to it.

 

By the later courts word of them has spread and everyone has already gotten a garbled explanation and the real explanation is very well attended.

Permalink Mark Unread

Oh, what kind of garbling is going on? He probably can't visit every court personally so it's important to know what needs to be emphasized or clarified in the first instance.

Permalink Mark Unread

People are confused about what he is and when the certificates can be exchanged with him for double their face value and whether you need specific physical materials to make them and what they need to say to be valid.

Permalink Mark Unread

He will go over all these facts! (He is an apsel. Dawn on the fourth of each month according to the Julian calendar but updating in the event that the human Pope should ever decide to change calendars. In principle anything you can stamp or write the correct affidavit of surplus on but he recommends paper yea big. This phrasing is standard.)

Permalink Mark Unread

People will crowd him with certificates, asking for goodies.

Permalink Mark Unread

SUSHI TIME! Also herby meatballs and cheddar biscuits and various dumplings and Christmas cookies.

Permalink Mark Unread

Wow he's amazing.

Permalink Mark Unread

He appreciates their regard and their food-motivated interest in his economic reform project!

Permalink Mark Unread

One of the courts has a baby! The baby is not yet sped up but he can see it if he wants. 

 

Permalink Mark Unread

He would like to have a look! Is it safe to touch them while they're still slow or no? May he watch them give the baby dew?

Permalink Mark Unread

You can touch slow things but they all feel like stone because of being slow. If he wants to stay that long he can watch them give the baby dew.

Permalink Mark Unread

How long is that long? How often do they feed it?

Permalink Mark Unread

When it's awake but it's not right now and it's hard to predict when it will be.

Permalink Mark Unread

How do you even get dew into a slow baby?

Permalink Mark Unread

There's a little mechanism you can set up around its mouth.

Permalink Mark Unread

Anyone know when that was invented or what people did before?

Permalink Mark Unread

You can basically make do with a dew-soaked cloth.

Permalink Mark Unread

That doesn't ever suffocate the kid?

Permalink Mark Unread

You shouldn't obstruct their nose, but otherwise no.

Permalink Mark Unread

Cool. Do babies ever randomly die or can you pretty much expect that if you have a baby and don't forget about it for a year you'll have a kid?

Permalink Mark Unread

They die very rarely and generally only if the court has misfortune.

Permalink Mark Unread

Neat. Do they have close calls?

Permalink Mark Unread

Honestly it's kind of hard to tell?

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Is it?

Permalink Mark Unread

Like sometimes they seem unwell and then recover but maybe they weren't unwell and were just briefly in pain or something?

Permalink Mark Unread

Has anyone ever tried having a slow person watch over them?

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Doesn't work very well once they start to speed up but it works until then, yeah. 

Permalink Mark Unread

No known way to partially slow an adult?

Permalink Mark Unread

When slowing a person down they slow down gradually and you can stop this partway through though that's rarely advisable.

Permalink Mark Unread

If you can only do it in that direction it'd make it hard to match the baby for very long.

He looks at the baby.

Permalink Mark Unread

It is very small and pink and only vaguely human-shaped.

Permalink Mark Unread

Does it match a fetal development stage? (How old is this baby?)

Permalink Mark Unread

It does not, quite, match a fetal development stage. This baby was extracted about three weeks of sidereal time ago.

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Cam makes an anatomical diagram as best he can without being able to move it around. He supervises the baby for a while to see if it will wake up before Econ Faery does.

Permalink Mark Unread

It does not.

Permalink Mark Unread

"How's the baby."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Doesn't look like a human baby or fetus, quite. I might make a mindless one to have a closer look at later."

Permalink Mark Unread

"That's such a convenient ability. Did you want to stay and watch it more?"

Permalink Mark Unread

"Nah, I have no way to know when it'll wake up."

Permalink Mark Unread

"All right. Did you get any guesses about what you were curious about?"

Permalink Mark Unread

"Baby faeries are almost certainly not just running on magic to survive delivery at three months. I did watch the baby long enough to see it was breathing, so it's got lungs. I want to find out more about how things behave at various intermediate speeds but that's more of a separate question."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Yeah, that's interesting but it's mildly annoying to learn so I've never done it. There's not a lot of reason to be anything other than slow or fast."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Well, I mostly want to avoid being slow, since somebody might spot me, but probably if I were only two hundred times faster than a human I could avoid that with just a little effort and conduct research while I was there. I expect to get around to that in the next million years."

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Snort. "I guess so."

Permalink Mark Unread

"There's no real rush because the difference in tech between now and three hundred years from now is not significant but at some point I'm going to need a sidereal itinerary, like, 'if anyone wants to go to space, do it before this date or somebody'll see you'."

Permalink Mark Unread

"How many certificates will you trade for a ride into space?"

Permalink Mark Unread

"Good question - unlike you I don't really have an intuition for their buying power, that'll take me a while and I can't even just convert them into a familiar currency in my head."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Yeah, that's reasonable. I can get you a list of values all assigned numbers for convenience but I don't know how close that gets you to the cost of a ride to space, intuitions aren't very good outside the domains we've seen before."

Permalink Mark Unread

"I don't actually know how future humans calculate exchange rates under normal circumstances. There'll be news like 'the euro is falling against the loonie' but I'm not sure what goes into that and would have to look it up. And I haven't operated in currency much since I died so even knowing things like 'wow, bananas are thirty dollars a pound, inflation is crazy' doesn't quite substitute for routinely participating in transactions."

Permalink Mark Unread

"What do people do in your world? If they don't use currency?"

Permalink Mark Unread

"In Hell? Hell's an anarchy, the closest thing demons have to an organizational structure is like, neighborhood associations and club charters. In theory since the invention of demonproof cryptography we could do cryptocurrency but while there have been some attempts they haven't taken off - it's not like you can pass out hors d'oeuvres and get demons super excited, they'll just go 'cool idea, I will make some of those for myself whenever I want for all eternity now'. There's not really enough stuff we can't get any way other than by buying it."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Huh."

Permalink Mark Unread

"You can list things we could allocate that way. Like spots at live concerts. My - friend, acquaintance, not sure where she falls - this person I know through music stuff could sell tickets to her concerts. But she'd be giving up at least some of the ability to curate the audience, which she values, and maybe under this condition she'd have to pay the person who was managing her auditorium half her ticket money instead of coasting on personal connections for that, and then - what's she gonna spend the rest on? Tickets to other people's concerts? She can already get those for free unless there's personal drama and the personal drama wouldn't go away if she waved a few bucks under somebody's nose. She has no reason to think any of that's appealing."

Permalink Mark Unread

"And there's just not that many of you? So the personal-connections thing doesn't fail?"

Permalink Mark Unread

"Oh, there's billions, in my time, but the subcultures get insular. And she's friendly enough to new people showing up being 'hi I'm five years old and can play the recorder kind of but really like your recordings, can I come to your next performance', or letting people she knows who are friendly to those give spare seats to them."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Huh."

Permalink Mark Unread

"And if she actively didn't like strangers, then selling the tickets would hardly improve matters, you know? I'm not really some kind of hardcore devotee of currency. It's way way better than the thing faeries are doing by default and I am delighted to enable it, I don't think it's bad, but demons don't really seem to need it. Angels and fairies do use it and it seems to help them, there's more skill-based limitations on what they can get access to on their own since they can't copy everything it pops into their head to want."

Permalink Mark Unread

"What are the abilities of angels and fairies?"

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"Angels change things, but need to do more of their own detail work. Also don't have as good a range. So in some ways they're effectively equivalent to demons but they can get much better at healing and can get rid of things they don't want any more. Fairies can move stuff - their kind of wings don't actually work, but they can fly anyway, and travel incredibly quickly, and do all kinds of fun things with sound and temperature and manufacturing that way."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Huh. And none of them have debt and none of them ever die -"

Permalink Mark Unread

"Yup."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Well, whatever works for them, I guess."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Hell's natively just nothing in all directions forever, not even air or a direction designated as down. Demons have put stuff in it, obviously, which installs down as a consequence. Heaven's this cloud fluff stuff, slightly glowy, kind of squashy, a bit less dense than water but you can walk on it, with a down, and they live in caves of fluff they hollow out. Fairyland's the interesting one, it's flat in all directions like Limbo but it has an ecosystem and, like, purely cosmetic pretend celestial objects."

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"A normal ecosystem in which things grow and die? Are there animals?"

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"Yes and yes."

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"Like our plants and animals? Does anything but the fairies have magic?"

Permalink Mark Unread

"They're different species but not too alien. And there's some minor things that are a little magic but nothing major apart from the berries that can let them grow new fairy wings if they want."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Huh. 

That feels like - the same kind of odd handling of a situation as debts coming in when a child becomes a person, somehow."

Permalink Mark Unread

"...I don't see a very strong resemblance between Fairyland having magic berries and baby faeries not counting for debt except for their creation retroactively."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Both of them make perfect sense to me if I reason backwards from how I'd expect the world to look and don't make much sense if I reason forward from the other traits it has."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Why would you expect the world to look like faery babies suddenly 'becoming people'? I wouldn't expect that."

Permalink Mark Unread

"What would you expect, that they were people all along?"

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"No, I'd expect it to be gradual."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Huh. Personhood's a sharp line; so is death."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Do you know what exactly constitutes death?"

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"We consider the moment of death to be the moment all someone's debts evaporate, but I think you mean something else?"

Permalink Mark Unread

"Yes, I mean, do you know if the debts evaporate when the heart stops, or when the brain stops doing stuff, or what?"

Permalink Mark Unread

"It's after the heart stops. I don't know how we'd measure the thing about brains."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Fancy equipment. Or, if you'd ever beheaded anyone it'd be a couple seconds after that, for instance."

Permalink Mark Unread

"I have never beheaded someone. I would say that maybe my brother can try that next time he has to kill someone but he's trying not to kill people at all, so."

Permalink Mark Unread

"For which I am glad. Perhaps we can eventually turn up a story of somebody being beheaded, this information doesn't seem to me worth anyone's life especially since you have no obvious afterlife situation."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Yes, I'm sure someone'll know."

Permalink Mark Unread

"You could have a non-obvious one. Faeries yourselves are surprisingly non-obvious, nobody finds out about you for more than a thousand years and then I expect it to become known via, uh, me telling them."

Permalink Mark Unread

"I've been wondering if that's a consequence of your presence. We're - I don't know that I'd say 'reasonably well known' but near circles humans have a fair bit of precedent to work from."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Humans sort of... believe in things less, over time? This mostly makes them more accurate. And if faery circles get less common because of more development and interference that'd contribute too. But it does seem suspicious that nobody's been like 'hi humans, I exist, look at me' credibly and it could be me telling them 'don't do that you'll annihilate the universe maybe'."

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"That or something that makes slowing down become impossible are my two leading guesses."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Even if slowing down became impossible someone could pull a reveal. They'd just have to do it in writing or something."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Most people don't live a million years. If slowing down became impossible, it wouldn't surprise me if the only ones who did were too conservative to pull things like that."

Permalink Mark Unread

"...that might be it. And if you can't slow down you can't have more babies."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Yes."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Which still leaves about twenty billion people, even if they gradually fall to various attrition, whose decision to remain secret must be explained, but at least it's not a high-turnover population... and it could still be something else."

Permalink Mark Unread

"It could, yeah. Maybe faeries speed up relative to humans over time, or slow down relative to humans, or just all die randomly of some faery plague in fifty thousand years."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Oh, hell, please don't die of some faery plague randomly, I would be so lonely, I'm an introvert but I'm not a fifty thousand years with nobody at all to interact with in any way introvert."

Permalink Mark Unread

"I promise I will work incredibly hard not to randomly die of some faery plague."

Permalink Mark Unread

"I suppose if all faeries died I'd get unsummoned. Into who the fuck knows what kind of situation, I guess."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Was Hell about the same back a thousand years ago?"

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"Nah. I mean, similar, broadly, but the languages have changed and the tech level loosely tracks the human tech level."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Huh. Our tech level has almost nothing to do with the human one."

Permalink Mark Unread

"No?"

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"There are courts that do really sophisticated things with magic, which humans don't have. A lot of human technology is weaponry, for the human sort of wars, which are not much like the faery sort of wars, and much of the rest is agricultural. Faeries could in principle plow fields but it's astonishingly unrewarding. Writing was invented independently."

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"Architecture?" Cam asks. "I guess you can't smith things, but woodworking stuff? Do you do boats? Demons don't really need technology for the same reasons as humans, when I say it loosely tracks I mean things like 'humans got computers and demons copied them immediately', not 'the stirrup revolutionized Hell'."

Permalink Mark Unread

"I've never heard of anyone doing boats. I think we got good at woodworking sooner than humans because we aren't in a hurry and don't mind as much if something will only last a couple of years."

Permalink Mark Unread

"I suppose. Do you copy any stuff from them?"

Permalink Mark Unread

"My father copied the Bible. Very diligently. He was trying to figure out what it meant. ...maybe we copied pottery?"

Permalink Mark Unread

"Ooh, pottery! How do you fire stuff? Sneak it into humans' kilns small?"

Permalink Mark Unread

"Yeah. Crystals don't get hot enough."

Permalink Mark Unread

"I did notice that! I wonder why."

Permalink Mark Unread

"My father has a book. I guess probably you shouldn't read it while he's slow and you can't settle. I can read it to you sometime if you'd like."

Permalink Mark Unread

"That just cuts him out altogether, huh?"

Permalink Mark Unread

"Yes."

Permalink Mark Unread

"You realize that's weird."

Permalink Mark Unread

"It'd be such a nightmare to discover knowledge if whenever someone you told shared it that created debt."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Things being a nightmare does not preclude them being baked into the system. - metaphorically."

Permalink Mark Unread

"This is true. But this particular problem doesn't come up."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Well, fortunately this means I don't have to plan to plant gifts in the homes of every author and composer I want to refer to in the next million years when their lifetime rolls around."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Seems like the kind of thing that might change the course of history. Or at least that I wouldn't want to take a chance on."

Permalink Mark Unread

"They could be subtle gifts. I could hide air filters in their rafters!"

Permalink Mark Unread

"I guess you could! Is there a problem with their air?"

Permalink Mark Unread

"You can make air filters that get rid of allergens and airborne germs and stuff."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Huh. Humans seem like their lives would benefit tremendously from more technology. In ways where - more technology will be nice for faeries but it won't be nearly as transformative."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Currency's a technology, after a fashion. And if we can get the computers working fast they'll be amazing. I might need to know how exactly the thing where credit for a creative work accrues to the latest step in the sharing chain works... maybe if a computer program picks what you read next...? And does speech to text?"

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"I have no idea. It'd be worth checking."

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Cam writes this down in his inscrutably English notes.

Permalink Mark Unread

"I think books whose authors are dead are also fine though this does seem complicated by the fact dead people don't stop existing. Like, you're dead, and it's possible to accumulate debts around you normally."

Permalink Mark Unread

"I'm dead but I'm also here. Limboites don't get summoned. And most daeva aren't ex-humans."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Then it's probably safe enough to read dead peoples' books but if we didn't get the books from you I wouldn't want to count on it."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Most of the good stuff is from people not yet born."

Permalink Mark Unread

"That's trickier. It might not count but it might count and show up when they become people, or something."

Permalink Mark Unread

"...I'll hunt around for something by someone who will be born soon somewhere and we can test it carefully?"

Permalink Mark Unread

"Good idea."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Of course, if this interacts with the objective quality criterion this gets harder."

Permalink Mark Unread

"No great inventors or composers in this year of humanity?"

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"It doesn't stand out. Maybe something will jump out at - metaphorically jump out at me when I look up the date."

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Nod.

 

The next court is the one with two heads. They're very entangled. They explain that debt incurred by the court flows to only one of them, but they have heard of this court which claimed it had a ritual that let the debt flow to both of you equally.

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Cam's curious where it may be found!

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Well west of here, coast of France.

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He notes this down on a map.

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And the trip otherwise concludes uneventfully.

Permalink Mark Unread

"You were wonderful."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Thank you! I'm generally happy to feed people." Wag wag.

Permalink Mark Unread

"I think it made a big difference. We should wait and see how it's getting used in practice before we go do another batch, I think, but I'd like to at some point if you're willing."

Permalink Mark Unread

"I'm up for it but I'm glad to have a break, I don't want my life to be nonstop snack parties."

Permalink Mark Unread

"And it is good for your human to have company sometimes, I suspect."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Probably! Solitary confinement is considered torture by enlightened standards."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Huh. I think most prisoners don't prefer company but I guess it's entirely possible that all the company they typically get also counts as torture by enlightened standards."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Seems plausible! Even if somebody doesn't harm them on a given occasion the threat being present does, indeed, by enlightened standards, count."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Does setting standards that high result in better outcomes or does it result in everyone regarding the standards as absurd and not usable to distinguish average people from bad ones?"

Permalink Mark Unread

"Depends how you implement them. And the people judging the situations."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Probably at some point you should talk with my brother about the standards faery courts could be reasonably expected to adopt, people aren't my specialty when they aren't making freely negotiated trades."

Permalink Mark Unread

"I did look over some formal standards of this sort of thing but they're hard to translate, they rely a lot on common sense as of the time they were written for how to implement their details."

Permalink Mark Unread

"And we are different from humans, a lot of the rules for humans might not be a good set of rules for us even if you could get everyone to agree to abide by them."

Permalink Mark Unread

"I think it's likelier that they'd be more conservative than necessary than that they'd be actively harmful, if they were used with a mind to the distinctions between species, but sure, maybe there's something in there that'd really hurt a faery."

Permalink Mark Unread

"I mean, I think 'you can't have sex with prisoners' would make being a prisoner substantially worse, for most faeries."

Permalink Mark Unread

"You can't have sex with your own prisoners, you can let prisoners have conjugal visits with third parties. Still bad?"

Permalink Mark Unread

"No, that'd be fine."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Oh good."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Makes it hard for prisoners to pay for anything but I don't know that that's enough to make them worse off. It'd depend on the specific situation."

Permalink Mark Unread

"The fact that faeries can't lie might mean that you could reasonably dispense with a lot of line-drawing humans have to do to manage incentives and stuff. You could just say you didn't have those motives per case, or promise not to do whatever thing's down the metaphorical slippery slope."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Huh. Yeah, probably."

Permalink Mark Unread

"So I guess it could even be possible with a thorough enough understanding of exactly why humans should not have sex with their prisoners for faeries to credibly announce that this did not apply to some individual situation but I do think for best results I'd want to hold out for that understanding."

Permalink Mark Unread

"This sounds reasonable enough to me but I'm not - there are a lot of considerations about getting everyone to agree to things that I'm probably not thinking of. I do think it's a good goal, and probably achievable."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Considerations about getting everyone to agree to things?"

Permalink Mark Unread

"I assume the idea here is, once you have a set of standards, getting people to abide by them."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Oh, yes, there are clearly steps I'm eliding here in describing my utopian vision of faeries cutting it out with all the raping people all the damn time."

Permalink Mark Unread

"I'd say it sounds impossible but you have a lot to bribe people with."

Permalink Mark Unread

"In a million years perhaps I will send a letter to the inventor of the potato chip thanking him for his contribution."

Permalink Mark Unread

"You're adorable."

Permalink Mark Unread

"The potato chip was invented out of spite! Someone kept asking at a restaurant for, I think it was crispier fries, and a guy in the kitchen was like, he wants crispy, I'll give him crispy, and made potato chips, and the guy loved it! Because potato chips are good."

Permalink Mark Unread

"What a good world."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Much of it, some of the time."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Most faeries are happy. And there's so much that's stupid. And it can all get better and be nice, and get even better in a million years."

Permalink Mark Unread

Wag wag.

Permalink Mark Unread

He beams at him.

Permalink Mark Unread

Aaaaaa faeries are weird how about Cam continues ignoring that for the time being until any of it is put into bullet points or something! How's Auda doing?

Permalink Mark Unread

"No one bothered me. How was your - thing?"

Permalink Mark Unread

"It went well! Faeries get really excited over food and there was good uptake of the concept in every court when I started passing it out to buy. One court had a baby for me to have a look at but it wasn't as informative as I might have hoped."

Permalink Mark Unread

"What were you hoping for?"

Permalink Mark Unread

"I was hoping for one that was sped up but only recently. They apparently don't consider their children people till they can talk, and say more than a few words."

Permalink Mark Unread

"The poor things."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Yeah, I'm considering the theory that faeries are how they are in some part because of child neglect, some unavoidable because of the speed thing and some not."

Permalink Mark Unread

"They seem like they'd be terrible parents. - not that I have any right to -"

Permalink Mark Unread

"No, I agree, they do seem that way, though I did also get to interview a kid yea high and he seemed pretty okay."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Okay how?"

Permalink Mark Unread

"He didn't seem like he was dealing with emotional problems or anything? Seemed to get along fine with his mom. Had toys and free time and stuff."

Permalink Mark Unread

"I guess none of them have to work and they only have one at a time and that'd help."

Permalink Mark Unread

"And they don't have to worry about where to get food for the babies because dew will do, and so on."

Permalink Mark Unread

"My mother had eleven. Five died."

Permalink Mark Unread

 

"That's the kind of thing I knew to expect abstractly but have not personally met happening in my actual life."

Permalink Mark Unread

"It seems kind of unfair if they can do better but I guess maybe they just can. Even if they have no concept of generosity or affection for its own sake or whatever."

Permalink Mark Unread

"More resources - or less need - can patch a lot of gaps in competence. Yeah."

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Shrug. "I"m glad you had a good time."

Permalink Mark Unread

"We'll probably do it again but not right away, we want to see how it percolates first. Might wait till after the fifteen minutes at dawn."

Permalink Mark Unread

Nod. "And you mentioned you'd buy human slaves? If anyone had them?"

Permalink Mark Unread

"Would've. Nobody we visited had one."

Permalink Mark Unread

"'s a good thing. Even if it means I have to get over myself and find a fairy or two I'll hang out with."

Permalink Mark Unread

"It'd probably make sense in the long run. Should I be vetting them for you? What would make somefaery an acceptable companion?"

Permalink Mark Unread

" Even if I make a mistake and end up in their debt they'll just buy it off you when you get back. - and, I guess, we should have a language in common."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Are there a bunch of faery languages? I could talk to all the ones I met."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Oh. I don't know, I haven't talked to ones outside my court. And the one who wanted to do money experiments."

Permalink Mark Unread

"I'd be surprised if there weren't at least dialects but it's at least not one court per language."

Permalink Mark Unread

Nod. "I'm mostly worried about the other thing."

Permalink Mark Unread

"I would expect either of money experiment faery or his redheaded brother Not A Stupid Asshole to be capable of buying any debt you wound up in off me without being horrible about it given adequate explanation of how not to be horrible."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Okay. Then I guess I'd like to be introduced, if it's convenient."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Now?"

Permalink Mark Unread

"Not especially? Whenever. I just don't want to be getting in your way."

Permalink Mark Unread

"You're not? I've been off doing other stuff and ignoring you for nearly two weeks, it's fine. I'll go see which one I turn up first unless there's anything more pressing you need -?"

Permalink Mark Unread

"No, all good."

Permalink Mark Unread

So off Cam strolls to see which of the two he turns up first.

Permalink Mark Unread

That'd be him. "How was your trip?"

Permalink Mark Unread

"It was entertaining! Faeries go nuts over sushi! I think the human got lonely, though, and since I am likely to make more excursions it seems expedient for there to be any faeries she can talk to ever. Her stated criteria are that they have to speak this language - or, I suppose, the local German - and that if she winds up in debt to them over the course of the talking to them they just sell that debt to me, no funny business."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Well, that's practically everybody, any idea who she might get along with most?"

Permalink Mark Unread

"The people I was confident would be able to grasp the no funny business clause were you and Econ Faery but I haven't met that many of you so I'm prepared to believe there are lots!"

Permalink Mark Unread

"The line you are drawing is pretty arbitrary to us but it's not really incomprehensible now that you have explained it and there haven't been ten more equally shocking things and people do have the concept of a polite conversation which is not supposed to turn into anything else. I'd be delighted to meet her but I am happy to meet more specific criteria if there are any."

Permalink Mark Unread

"She might materialize higher standards over time but this is currently what I'm working with."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Okay. I'd be happy to meet her whenever's convenient."

Permalink Mark Unread

"I think now's convenient on her end."

Permalink Mark Unread

"All right."

Permalink Mark Unread

Stroll stroll. "Hey Auda, I located Not A Stupid Asshole for you."

Permalink Mark Unread

"You can call me Lohtê."

       "Okay. I've been - Auda. As you heard."

"What can I do for you?"

       "I just want him to be free to leave when he wants to - I don't just want that. But I want that and it's the thing I want from getting to know faeries."

"As long as he's willing to settle up for you I'm happy to arrange that. Do you want to learn any arts? Music? Weaving? Embroidery? We know how to make very pretty things, I promise, we just haven't been waving them in front of you to avoid being rude."

      "-sure. And if he's not around to settle up -"

"We can run a little debt a little while, or you can tell us stories, or if we're entirely out of options and you've developed no discernible talents and we've no reason to think he'll come back, you can give people massages. I don't anticipate a way for things to get worse than that."

      " - okay. Is this your court?"

"My parents', but they like magic research and children and so they're often slow and I run it for them. How was the court you were in before structured?"

     "No one ever explained. Some people were more important than others but no one was allowed to give me standing orders except the queen. Is she - here?"

"Yes. A number of participants in the mess that brought you both here are imprisoned here now."

      "I only met her once, the time she explained about the standing orders."

"What were those?"

      "Not to leave, not to lie or make promises or share my name, not to physically resist anything, if I was having a hard time with that to tell them so they could tie me down or something, not to end up in a situation where people'd told me to do different things and, as part of that, to remind anyone who gave me standing instructions of this rule of hers. I assume you've said the same thing, to people."

"Something pretty similar, yeah. That was more than a day ago?"

       "Yes."

"That's impressive."

        "I didn't want to die. They didn't want me to die either."

"I hear death is not as bad as advertised." He glances at Cam. 

        "He said, yeah. I think I mostly don't want to die as a habit, now. But I still don't want to."

"We won't hurt you."

       "You would've."

"Yes. Does that bother you?"

       "I don't know. I don't know what people are supposed to feel about things. I guess I'd trust you more if you were different than you are."

"We wouldn't have done anything that'd hurt a fairy. But we should have thought that humans might be different."

       "He'd have been less mad at you," she says.

"Yes. That's not what I meant, though."

        "Oh. - are we even, right now?"

"We're pretty close. Do you want to be done?"

        "Yeah. I - this was good. But - maybe more tomorrow."

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"Small doses," nods Cam, making a shooing motion at Lohtë. "Thank you for your time."

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"Mmhmm." He leaves.

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"Find the other one now or later?"

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"Later, I think."

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"Any time. You still have a day's worth of food, right?"

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"Yeah."

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"Good, because I've been doing almost nothing but meal planning for a while now. Did you like everything okay, I didn't carefully look up what plants have made it to Europe yet or anything when considering spice profiles but I did try to keep it all relatively accessible."

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"Everything tasted wonderful."

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"Oh good. You can be on a pretty much unrestricted diet at this point, assuming you aren't concealing any symptoms."

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"I feel healthy. - might have a hard time if I had to do any work, because I haven't done any in so long, but other than that."

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"That's most likely just lack of exercise. D'you wanna go for a walk?"

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"What, just for fun?"

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"Sure, do people not take walks to go look at scenery and stretch their legs in this year? Even if they're not performing farm labor and getting around in general on foot?"

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"Not really? Sometimes you go visit people."

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"You know what I should bring in to the ambient faery technology situation? Bicycles."

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"What're those?"

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He pulls up a picture of one for her to watch flicker. "These things. They require some materials that are currently inconvenient to source in the environment to work really well and won't be invented for some time, but you sit astride 'em like a horse, there's a learning curve on how to balance but there's variants with three wheels that are easier if less able to handle miscellaneous terrain, and you push the pedals there with your feet. Doesn't leave a lot of conspicuous infrastructure lying around, doesn't require fuel, goes at the speed of the rider unlike I'd imagine an airplane or something would."

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" - huh. Women can't sit astride horses, though."

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"Is that because you don't wear pants or do you have some other reason to imagine that's the case?"

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"I just know women who ride horses have to sit on them sideways. I don't know why, I've never had a riding horse."

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"It's the pants thing, as I understand it, and bicycles can be constructed so you can ride them in a skirt if you object strenuously to pants."

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"Huh! - and I bet future people do not object to women wearing pants."

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"Yup! Other way around takes longer though."

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" - they do object to men wearing dresses?"

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"Oh, not by 2159 they don't, but there was a lag of a couple hundred years."

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"Huh. 

I guess if you have a way for women not to have babies then they can just be - weaker men - and maybe there's no cause to object to that really - but men still can't be women -"

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"- how much future shock do you want, exactly, here?"

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"I'm not going to live to this winter so I'm not sure any of it matters but I don't mind hearing about the strange future people's opinions."

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"You'll still be around, you'll wind up in Limbo," he points out. "Anyway, there's medicine you don't even need magic for that can with varying quality of results make people look like the opposite sex, some people - in both directions, as it happens - feel motivated to do that, once surgery isn't a hilariously stupid thing to do for anything short of gangrene it's possible to follow up with some of that for closer results still, and then summoning gets pretty common and this sort of person can swap physical characteristics around as thoroughly as they might wish up to and including becoming capable of pregnancy."

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"Huh. - and people still get angry about them wearing dresses? If you can get pregnant I think you are a woman whatever you started as."

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"The thing about wearing dresses was already underway at the time summoning got popular and then the remaining opposition to people wearing whatever they wanted didn't last very long."

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"That makes more sense."

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"Daeva and limboites can't have kids," he mentions.

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"Oh."

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"If you want to raise some kids in Limbo, there'll be plenty of infant mortality supplying them for the next while."

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 "I don't really know what I want. I feel like I spent my whole life practicing things I don't need anymore. But that's - good to know."

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"I'm told it's much easier to raise children when they can't hurt themselves and don't need to eat."

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"What happens to them in Limbo if no one wants them?"

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"They still grow. Some places there's a lot of kids all clustered together without enough adults, just by coincidence, and the kids generally manage to invent languages of their own and socialize each other, though they wind up with kind of weird acculturation that way. Infant mortality drops and eventually there's a point where that doesn't happen and someone will always pick up the kids, my mom picks up a kid occasionally."

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"I guess that's all right."

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"It's not great, nothing about Limbo is great, but it's kind of adequate most of the time."

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"Which beats the real world. - I think I do want to go for a walk."

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"Alrighty!" Out they can go.

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Faeryland is kind of neat except for all the faeries.

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Hopefully the faeries can be reformed. They did enough visiting that Cam has a general idea of the court boundaries now, and doesn't go past them.

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Auda is amused by large flowers and large pinecones and so on, and is happy enough to return home once they reach the edge of where they're allowed.

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Econ Faery and his brother are talking in the halls of their court.

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Cam waves at them as they walk by.

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"Were you looking for something?"

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"Just taking a walk, she'd been cooped up. What are you up to?"

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"I just wanted to hear how all of our neighbors are doing. It sounds like they're pretty happy."

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"Oh, yes, everyone loved the food. I can do a snack party here too if people are feeling left out."

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"I bet they'd appreciate that."

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"And they need to learn the system too."

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"Lemme get Auda back to her room and I can come out and do that now, if now's good?"

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"Sounds great."

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Cam escorts Auda home and pops out again.

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People are gathering. Very warily. Ready to flee if cages start dropping.

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No cages today! Just granola and cucumber-watercress sandwiches and, hey, if someone'll bring dishes he can put interesting soups in them, and eggnog, and cocoa, and tapioca pudding, and do faeries do alcohol? caffeine?, and he thinks the best liked thing he's done was meringues here's a ton of meringues.

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Faeries like alcohol a lot and haven't encountered caffeine and are delighted about everything and get gradually less wary as none of the things are cages.

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Personally Cam doesn't like alcohol but since he can nope its psychological effects he's done any investigating into the space of fun cocktails. Pina colada slushies! Also he knows a ton about caffeine drinks because he does like and use the effects of caffeine all the time, here are so many kinds of tea and so many varieties of coffee and so many sodas.

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Tipsy buzzed cucumber-watercress-sandwich-eating faeries! 

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He does announce the advisable doses of these things for humans in case the faeries want to be conservative.

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They don't, particularly. 

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"I think that's enough of that," he says to Cam at some point. 

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"Of booze or of snacks in general?"

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"Just the intoxicating ones."

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"You got it. Have you guys even invented alcohol?" Here, everyone, have some pizza and ice cream and peanut butter balls, fat will slow down the alcohol a little bit.

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"We can make wine but I think your wine has more alcohol content and also it's a great deal tastier, and I don't know how it combines with the other drugs."

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"I wasn't sure because humans will wait a very long time to get around to consuming their alcohol sometimes so you might have had the patience for it. Caffeine and alcohol aren't dangerous together except insofar as caffeine can make it unclear how drunk you are."

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"It takes twelve days to make wine. It's not very good wine but it'll get you drunk. A lot of people spend as much of the winter drunk as they can afford."

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"Well, that's kind of depressing."

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"I think sunlight is good for people."

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"It's good for humans! Both for vitamin reasons you can replace dietarily and for other reasons to do with getting a look at light on a routine basis. I'm actually surprised that matters much to faeries, since you aren't just fast humans and if anything was going to change in response to you being fast not needing sunlight much seems like it ought to be first after whatever adaptations are letting you survive premature birth and neglected infancy."

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"I mean, it's never killed anyone that I know of? It just makes them gloomy."

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"Doesn't kill humans outright either unless their diets are real bad."

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"Huh." Shrug. "Maybe we can try vitamin supplements for faeries and see if that does anything."

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"Maybe! I can also do some medical research to see if there's a better drug for being strung out all night, if that doesn't help."

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"If you could that'd be wonderful."

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"What would?"

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"Ways to make the night easier on people. Apparently it's a problem humans have too."

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"It doesn't come up with humans unless they live really far north or south, but it does come up then. Electric lights can also help!"

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"We've talked about getting enough magic lights to have a place that's lit like daytime, but it's hard to make that many. - for us."

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"Hey, making magic lights is, technically, also hard for me. If I can do it at all."

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"Probably at some point in the next million years you can give it a try."

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"I expect I'll get around to it."

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They glance at each other, for some reason.

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"Hm?"

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"A million years is a really astonishing length of time and it's interesting to be planning in those terms, even a little bit."

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"I mean, ever since I died I've been expecting to be around forever, a million years is just the space in which I'm this, ah, interestingly constrained."

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"Faeries mostly don't expect to live forever. We slip up eventually. We nearly did very recently. But it's not impossible in principle and knowing it's likely important -"

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"Faeries aren't noticeably around in the future. The likeliest explanations are somehow dying out or some consequence of the apsel's presence, and I like the possibilities that are a consequence of the apsel's presence better, and I don't know if this line of logic quite makes sense but keeping him around successfully seems like it makes it likelier that our absence isn't explained by our extinction, even separately from how maybe he can help if there's a faery plague."

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"I mean, I can't go off and interact with humans, trying to go back to Hell might disappear me from the timeline so my summoner at least had better live a million years, and I'm not quite introverted enough to hole up in some part of the ocean I expect to remain unexplored and run out of books to read, so I expect to be around faery in general. Ideas I've had in this vein are seeing if there are ways we can get you guys underwater or offplanet, finding some way to have live people travel to a daeva realm or Limbo and hole up there away from the known civilization, and figuring out how the paths work and getting smaller so there's still plenty of room for everyone even after humans settle and plow more space."

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"All of those sound important."

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"Mind, getting smaller might do even more egregiously odd things to physics."

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"I do sort of wonder if the smallest paths get is the smallest people can safely go but I don't have any particular reason to think so, except that the largest paths get is conveniently the size of slow humans and maybe there's something convenient on the other end of the range."

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"How many times smaller is that?"

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"About a hundred twenty five times smaller."

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"- by height or by volume or by mass?"

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"Height. I don't know our volume at full size, it'd be complicated to measure."

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"Eureka," remarks Cam. "- by which I mean, you'd want a tub full of a known volume of water and marked sides and then you'd dunk and see how far up it goes."

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Bounce bounce. "This did actually occur to my father and we have tried it but we don't have a watertight full-sized tub anywhere so we've only tried it at court size."

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"I suppose you can't make small tubs and enlarge them the same way you do the other way around?"

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"Very few things get larger. Clothes do, and crystals, but they're magic."

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"Hmmm... I could make clothes here and we could see if they enlarge..." He writes this down.

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"That's the thing that keeps courts physically small, the fact you can't make things get bigger. It helps with stretching food and wine."

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"I don't expect the clothes to get bigger if they're not magic but it would be really interesting if they did and it's not hard to test."

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"Yep. - hey, maybe when we move out of this court someone can come over to the ruins of it, big, and pick up the green balls. They won't be too heavy then."

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Snort. "About how often do you have to move?"

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"This is a good thick tree trunk but I'd expect it to start rotting in a few years, not more than ten. Courts in living trees or in caves or underground move much less frequently."

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"Does it wreck their architecture when the tree grows? I suppose perhaps it doesn't lose branches if they keep the misfortune to a minimum."

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"I do not personally know how to build into a growing tree so its growth doesn't ruin your house and you don't kill it but I think some people know how to do that."

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"One that grabbed me was in a burrow. How do they keep animals out, just barricade the place when they sniff around till they lose interest?"

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"I think so. It's not very hard to see them coming. And many of them shy away from unfamiliar smells, I think."

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"Oh, that makes sense. And none of them would have evolved to eat you."

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"I'd like to see them tr- no, I wouldn't, it would probably be at least mildly alarming and amusing only in retrospect."

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"Oh, faeries ever have to catch themselves too, I hadn't realized the habit wasn't quite that ingrained!"

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"Faeries sometimes have to catch themselves. More when they're younger, or drunk, or distracted."

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"You're not that young."

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"Nor am I drunk."

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"If any of the cocktails looked good I can make versions without alcohol in them. Personally I just don't let alcohol affect me but that's my being dead privilege."

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"Your food is delicious but I'd rather ask you questions, at least until I've accumulated a pile of certificates so enormous I don't feel like they meaningfully trade off anymore."

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"All right, ask away."

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"Is there a size you'd expect to be the smallest faeries can be? Do your electronics do long-distance communication?"

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"There's not an obvious size I'd expect but I don't know a ton of physics. And yes, but the best way to do it involves putting satellites in orbit around the planet and I'm not sure what next-best option I should go with given how there were not satellites around the planet at this time."

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"If they were fast maybe no one would've noticed them."

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"Things up there move really fast and people learn to detect them anyway!"

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“Huh. Good for them. How do they do it?”

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"Don't know off the top of my head."

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“The communications are not very important yet but it’ll help a lot with coordinating people eventually.”

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"Yeah, I expect it to be a tractable problem. Uh, until the last couple decades whereupon wireless signals of kinds I know how to use will all be detectable."

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“Maybe by then we will mostly be on a faraway world.”

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"Yeah, if I can get you set up on Titan no problem at all."

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“They won’t check there?”

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"There are people living there eventually but not with very much coverage."

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“And I guess we already know that default conjugations for people in an area don’t find fairies, at least not while we are fast?”

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"Or small, it could also be small."

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“Might be good to know which because other worlds might not have paths.”

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"They well might not, someone would probably have noticed."

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"The conventional understanding of paths is that they're responsive to vegetation. I don't know if there's any of that on Titan."

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"Not a speck. Only vegetation? How do the courts in caves work?"

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"Some caves have vegetation in them. If you're really patient you can also plant vegetation and then wait for it to grow in a way that creates the paths you need. Areas that are pure rock with no plants won't typically have paths."

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"Then we should not expect Titanic paths. Drat."

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"We can probably check easily enough whether it's the smallness or the fastness that protects fairies from conjuration, some fairies are big at any given time."

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"It only prevents naive conjuration, and I'm no longer a naive conjurer. I'm not actually sure how to parameterize as though I were one in this case."

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"Huh, all right. I don't really know what you're doing, mentally, when you conjure things."

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"Depends. In the case where naivete matters, it's like trying to get 'all the people in this geographical area at this time', and for some reason a naive demon trying to get that result doesn't conjure and notice any faeries, and I can."

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"Huh." Shrug.

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"Yup. Very weird, hard to figure out without more demons to test on."

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"Can you do things like conjure for the results a conjuration would have for another person if they tried it, or is that too nested for the magic to work with?"

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"This is not known to work - the cases it's been checked for involve private information of other kinds than 'faeries exist' but only generate distinguishable results if some private information is involved."

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"Hmmm. All right. - any distant planets that do have vegetation?"

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"Too distant to reasonably get to unless you can fastify spaceships and also want to spend a longass time on them."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Not my first idea of an entertaining activity but we have a million years so - how long exactly?"

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"We could go to Tau Ceti's system but it'd take about forty thousand years."

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" - so, spaceship fast, any fairies on it slowed down."

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"Do you have any reason to believe being on a fast vehicle while slow won't just paste you?"

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"No. No one's tried changing whether they're fast while on something that's moving, not that I know of, except in the sense that the earth is moving. But you could test it safely enough with a big slow-moving wagon. I think."

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"Since slowing down is gradual I guess you could."

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"But it's certainly not something you could get all fairies to do even if it works perfectly so it can't be the answer to the mystery of where all the fairies are."

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"Yeah, doubt it. And someone would have noticed if I'd made a planet or terraformed one with plants."

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"Even if it was far away?"

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"They might miss one in another galaxy, I'd have to look things up to know."

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"Oh well."

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"Oh well is right."

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"Is there a reason you want to shoo us away from Earth, or is it just that you feel like since we apparently do leave some day it'd be better if that were under our own power?"

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"The latter, I'm worried Earth gets inhospitable or something. But I'm not sure my reasoning here isn't screwy, it's hard to think about the implications of time travel."

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Nod. 

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"It's definitely more cultivated and built up in the future. Also I guess something random like carbon dioxide could affect you badly."

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"I should probably -" he waves someone else over. "What's carbon dioxide?"

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(He comes over to listen).

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"It's the stuff animals exhale as a byproduct of respiration."

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"And it changes a lot in the next thousand years?"

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"There's more of it; it's also a byproduct of some transitional fuel use, and plants which usually soak it up become less numerous."

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"Huh. Are there living things this noticeably affects?"

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"Sure. Plants where there's still uncontrolled plants are a little improved. It's a little harder for animals to breathe, which turns out to make people measurably dumber."

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"Huh."

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"We are trying to puzzle out why in the future there's nothing visible of us."

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Nod. "Is there a way to test whether we're affected by carbon dioxide?"

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"In specifically the being dumber way or in general? I mean, I can make it just fine."

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"I mostly meant in general. Do please test it on someone else, I don't want to be dumber. There're prisoners."

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"I am going to predict that that's considered horrible by civilized society."

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"It's temporary. But also that, yes."

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"I don't have a model."

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"They wouldn't have agreed to it and it's not absolutely necessary to keep them contained at all. It's approximately that simple, except for the sex thing. I feel like you might've gotten a wrong model of how complicated most of it is because it's so complicated in that one place."

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Nod.

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"Some of the perceived complication of the sex thing might just be different expectations about what people'd agree to."

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"I -" he glances at his brother. 

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"You should say that but not now."

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"Maybe that's it and eventually I'll have a one-sentence explanation of that for everyone else too," he says after a second.

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Cam looks between them, confused, but doesn't ask.

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"Do faeries have the same taste in food as humans?" he asks, taking a meringue.

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"Not dead on, I think you don't gravitate as much toward calorie density and you're also more likely to be pleasantly surprised by weird tastes you haven't encountered before, but you sure seem to like things humans find tasty."

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"Is this possible to make in any way other than magically?"

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"Meringues? Yeah, you beat egg whites and sugar and probably other stuff plus whatever you want them to taste like and... I think they get baked."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Awwww. Tragic."

Permalink Mark Unread

"That one can make them without magic or that they get baked? You could probably eat it raw too if you don't get food poisoning from raw egg, it'd just be wet or something - I don't know, I've never personally baked meringue."

Permalink Mark Unread

"The baking, because we can't do that. Maybe eventually someone'll invent a way. Do humans get sick from eating raw eggs?"

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"If there's germs in the eggs, not inherently, but cooking them kills the germs."

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Nod. 

Permalink Mark Unread

"There might be anything that bakes at a temperature low enough for your crystals to handle."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Maybe some of the people with an interest in cooking will accumulate enough certificates to get a cookbook off you and give it a try."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Adorable. Hopefully they can use enough of the recipes for it to be better than just buying the food."

Permalink Mark Unread

"They can bet someone it won't be, as insurance!"

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Wag. "There you go!"

Permalink Mark Unread

"I think it'll make people more willing to try things they otherwise wouldn't consider worth it."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Things more interesting than cookbooks?"

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"Yeah. Long research projects and magic experiments and so on. Maybe there's some way to insure against the risk a kid is a liability and then not have to worry they might be and you'll have to kill them if they are."

Permalink Mark Unread

"...that would be nice, yes, I'm not immediately sure how to do it."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Me neither. The problem is that long-standing bets create entanglement - isn't that always the problem - and also that it'd be hard to compensate rightly for a risk that's about misfortune, not just debt. - no, wait, that's not a problem, the insurance just has to cover buying the kid out."

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"Cover who buying the kid out? Can you make a bet with a child who doesn't exist yet?"

Permalink Mark Unread

"I've never tried it. Otherwise, you'd cover some elderly human buying the kid out, probably."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Need a reliable supply of elderly humans."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Yeah. And other societal things would have to change for buying people out to be enough. But I think they will."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Don't think we can count on having a reliable supply of elderly humans unless for some reason we wind up harboring a breeding human population who keep real quiet in Limbo once they die. Missing persons reports get more follow-up later on in history."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Maybe there's some way to transfer the debt to a slow human without them noticing. I don't know how to accomplish that but it could be possible."

Permalink Mark Unread

"...interesting."

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Bounce. "We can ask some court that has dealings with humans, they'll all know that kind of thing."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Even if they have an interest they haven't necessarily discovered all there is to know."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Well, if we need to we can experiment ourselves."

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"Plenty of time, and all that."

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He glances at his brother but his brother has wandered off to mediate a dispute among drunk people.

"Yeah."

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"...Am I liable for supplying intoxicants to that dustup over there?"

Permalink Mark Unread

"Hmmm? No, they made their own choices. Poor choices, apparently. - if I'd been designing the system drugging people would make you accountable for them at least if they weren't informed about it, but I really really really did not design the system."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Well, you'd invented alcohol so they knew what it was in a general sense - I guess I didn't advertise what proof everything was -"

Permalink Mark Unread

"I suspect those are stronger than what we make but that's possible to taste, it doesn't excuse them. I more meant, sometimes people drug prisoners, and they shouldn't."

Permalink Mark Unread

 

"Of fucking course they do."

Permalink Mark Unread

Slightly alarmed fairy.

Permalink Mark Unread

"Sorry, just, hadn't occurred to me. Ugh."

Permalink Mark Unread

"There's nothing to apologize for."

Permalink Mark Unread

"You looked spooked!"

Permalink Mark Unread

"Not because of any kind of reasoned assessment of the situation!"

Permalink Mark Unread

"I still didn't mean to scare you."

Permalink Mark Unread

"You're the best thing that has ever happened to the world and you could be a lot worse and it'd still be true and I am very very glad of you."

Permalink Mark Unread

"You don't even know my main claim to, uh, anonymous future fame."

Permalink Mark Unread


"Wow. Do tell."

Permalink Mark Unread

"So you know how I've been referring to summoning becoming common at a certain point? It's in 2006, when that happens... I was nineteen."

Permalink Mark Unread

"I don't know very much about human growth, that's an adult? The girl's age?"

Permalink Mark Unread

"Thereabouts, yeah."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Were you involved?"

Permalink Mark Unread

"I found a summoning book in an abandoned house I was exploring, when I was seventeen, and I tried it, and then I spent a couple years doing research and edited the book and then anonymously had daeva distribute it worldwide."

Permalink Mark Unread

" - wow! - why not sell it? - I don't know if I would have sold it, what with it being an entirely random advantage, but I would've been tempted -"

Permalink Mark Unread

"Several reasons! It would have been logistically complicated especially since I wanted to be anonymous. Daeva being common knowledge predictably upended most of the extant forms of payment. And the thing I wanted out of the situation was the end of material scarcity."

Permalink Mark Unread

"End all - how many humans are there by then, how did they live -"

Permalink Mark Unread

"Six and a half billon and a range from 'tolerably well all things considered' to 'not much better than what they're dealing with now'."

Permalink Mark Unread

 

"Did it work?"

Permalink Mark Unread

"Yes."

Permalink Mark Unread

"What's it like now?"

Permalink Mark Unread

"Assuming by now you mean in the time I left? There's people living on Mars and the Moon and in space stations, electricity's too cheap to meter, people don't have to work if they'd rather be raising families or studying Proto-Indo-European, it's a very good time for the arts..."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Wow. I - hope we live to see it."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Me too."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Sorry to bring up a sad thought. I think that's really beautiful. It's just that you have to be really really good, as a faery, to see a million."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Haven't ruled out a faery afterlife... and maybe it'll get easier to be that good."

Permalink Mark Unread

"It really might." He's so good.

Permalink Mark Unread

Wag wag.

Permalink Mark Unread

He will grab a snack and help some people figure out their certificates, which are complicated because there were four people involved in the interaction.

Permalink Mark Unread

Cam can then receive these certificates (he has made himself a nice money clip to tuck them all into) in exchange for California rolls.

Permalink Mark Unread

And eventually the fairies will run out of money and the party will gradually wind down.

Permalink Mark Unread

Cam makes sure all the dishes are squared away and heads back toward his room.

Permalink Mark Unread

Auda did not attend the party but observed curiously from the door sometimes.

Permalink Mark Unread

"Hey. Any of the snacks catch your eye? You do not have to pay me in certificates." He tosses his money clip into his box o' stuff.

Permalink Mark Unread

"Your world's food is so colorful."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Presentation! There's plenty of beige glop out there but people like to at least garnish it with something so it'll look more appealing."

Permalink Mark Unread

Giggle. "I think even rich people don't do that, here."

Permalink Mark Unread

"No? I've never studied eleventh century cuisine but they don't arrange things prettily or put a sprig of herb on top?"

Permalink Mark Unread

"I mean I don't know any very rich people but rich people mostly eat the same things as poor people except more meat, I think."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Huh. What-all do people eat these days?"

Permalink Mark Unread

"Bread. Milk. Birds and rats and so on, if you can catch them. Vegetables. The fairy food was tastier, all told, and it's not that they'd starve me very often, but I got weaker anyway."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Starving even infrequently is bad for you and while your previous diet was almost certainly not what I'd call 'nutritious' the faeries' idea of food has not had to sustain a human population for any length of time and they don't have even implicit knowledge of what you need to have in there. In particular milk is a pretty well-rounded food, I don't know if faeries have a way to get it."

Permalink Mark Unread

"I don't think so. They never gave it to me."

Permalink Mark Unread

"It's not actually true that you can survive on milk and potatoes alone - uh, potatoes are this thing, which you've now had in various forms," he hands her a mini roasted potato, "but it's close. You don't have potatoes here yet though I think, they're a New World crop. ...heck, I'm going to have to worry about invasive species if anybody drops a, a squash seed or anything..."

Permalink Mark Unread

"What's that -"

Permalink Mark Unread

"Squash is a vegetable, I think I gave you a kind of it called zucchini in your meal plan somewhere, it would have been little green disks and I probably would've given it to you a little sour and mixed in with carrots which are bright orange but I don't know if carrots are currently eaten in Germany and bet they aren't orange yet even if they are. If I give out food with viable seeds in it and a seed falls somewhere and sprouts then there's a plant on the wrong continent early and maybe it just dies without incident, I don't know that anyone would notice, but if it happens to grow well in the climate then maybe things get screwy. But I've been giving out food at small scale, so maybe the seeds can't grow because they're not their correct size."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Oh. Can you make it seedless?"

Permalink Mark Unread

"I can make zucchini seedless. Some foods the seeds are the thing you eat, though, like... pomegranates. I guess I could just make pomegranate derivatives. Or run an actual test with small seeds of things that I know can grow in this climate."

Permalink Mark Unread

Nod.

Permalink Mark Unread

"I sure hope I think of all the things like that before I, uh, annihilate the universe." Sigh.

Permalink Mark Unread

"Well, if you forget there's still the other universes. ...right?"

Permalink Mark Unread

"...I mean, there's the daeva realms and Limbo, but I was including them too."

Permalink Mark Unread

"A time - problem - would probably destroy them too?"

Permalink Mark Unread

"Maybe. I don't actually know that this is even in fact a risk, which is pretty damn frustrating, but - like, I was born in the year 1987. I grew up in a world that had certain properties, which affected me. It's never exactly been important to my life that squash verifiably did not grow in Europe until New World crops in general made it across the ocean, but in fact I lived my life in a world where that was the case, among other things that I could also potentially affect. So imagine I go around madly planting squash from here to Rome, and then the future is one in which there was squash in Europe at this time. Then when 1987 comes around, even if I am still born, I can't go on to have the life history of someone in a world where there were not medieval European squashes. And then even if I still travel back in time - then we can't be having this conversation - because the example doesn't work - because of there having been medieval European squashes - because of something I did - and I don't know what the time travel that happened to me is doing. Maybe things don't actually have to line up neatly, maybe everything's just been rolled back and I can prevent my own birth outright and nothing happens going forward. But it could be that the only reason everything's still proceeding to exist is because I haven't had any effects that interfere with time looping back in a consistent manner. I'm sorry if that was confusing, another thing I shouldn't introduce to human culture early is the idea of stories that deal in things like time travel but I've had exposure to enough of them to have some practice with thinking in these terms."

Permalink Mark Unread

She bites her lip. "I think I maybe understand? It sounds very stressful."

Permalink Mark Unread

"It's very stressful and it's going to be way worse during time periods when specific things I know about and want to change much more than the vegetable selection start happening. Certainly a lot of things I'd want to change are going on right now but ones that were belabored as horrible tragedies in my history class are going to really hurt."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Do you...want a hug?"

Permalink Mark Unread

 

"Yeah, all right."

Permalink Mark Unread

She leans against him and is briefly confounded by the wings and then manages.

Permalink Mark Unread

He drapes them around her and hugs her and sighs and lets go before it can get weird. "Thanks."

Permalink Mark Unread

"I'm sorry. I hope you all figure something out so you aren't just stuck here waiting for forever."

Permalink Mark Unread

"I can do things besides wait. Stuff with faeries, since faeries didn't interact with me before."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Unfortunately, they are faeries. Maybe you can improve them."

Permalink Mark Unread

"So I hope."

Permalink Mark Unread

Faeries manage to generate lots of certificates for him to cash in the next few days. 

Permalink Mark Unread

"It's working so well!" Bounce bounce. "Everyone's trying to think of favors they can do each other so they can get your stuff."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Cute. Intracourt only?"

Permalink Mark Unread

"We have some requests to come visit. My brother's sorting them all out, if you have any questions I can pass them along."

Permalink Mark Unread

"I'm just generically curious."

Permalink Mark Unread

"I think it's having a bit less of an effect elsewhere but still enough of one they have stacks of certificates and lists of orders and we're trying to figure out the most convenient way to arrange for them to come get those delivered. - the court's not set up for a lot of throughput, we might want to cut out a path so that there's no chance of people trampling things if we get a lot of volume."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Trampling things?"

Permalink Mark Unread

"We get guests, we escort them in, there's no problem. We get a hundred times as many guests, they all leave with as much exotic food as they can carry, some of them stomp our greenery, now they're in our debt. That still happens occasionally right now, to be clear, it's just rare enough to not be a very big deal. But it'd be a big deal if we didn't catch it or if we were overwhelmed with it."

Permalink Mark Unread

"...what happens if a human comes by harvesting mushrooms or cutting wood?"

Permalink Mark Unread

"The trees aren't ours, they were there before we were. We'd take mushrooms before the humans got to them, because those would count."

Permalink Mark Unread

"...if someone goes for, say, underripe fruit you hadn't gotten around to yet - you see them coming and pick it prematurely and they see the fruit all disappear? Does this only count if you've actually cultivated whatever the thing is, so if you lived near a cherry tree that you didn't plant...?"

Permalink Mark Unread

"Then it's not ours, that's right."

Permalink Mark Unread

"No wonder you don't usually have much food, planting any would be real dumb! - Can plants grow small, I was wondering earlier -"

Permalink Mark Unread

"No, they can't. I mean, some are very small but they're all one-size-only. Some courts grow things inside the court itself, hard for humans to interfere with that."

Permalink Mark Unread

"With... magic lights?"

Permalink Mark Unread

"Yes, or things like mushrooms that grow in the dark, or they have a way to let natural light into their courts."

Permalink Mark Unread

"I'll probably do a business in electric lights. Though ideally not ones that generate a lot of battery waste."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Might make the humans suspicious?"

Permalink Mark Unread

"Yeah, all 'we found this battery in a bog near some, uh, bog butter, dating to around 1250, isn't that weird'."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Are you assuming the girl won't tell anyone in the human afterlife, or that she won't be believed?"

Permalink Mark Unread

"I imagine she in particular might not tell anyone but probably some people tell and aren't believed."

Permalink Mark Unread

Nod.

Permalink Mark Unread

Airquotes: "I died of having been starved by incompetent faeries! Yeah sure you did -"

Permalink Mark Unread

He gasps in pain and staggers sideways into a wall and falls over onto the floor. "Don't -"

Permalink Mark Unread

"- what -" Cam drops to his knees, picks up his hand for a pulse automatically before his brain catches up. "Oh. Oh, airquotes don't - oh - what do I do, can I -"

Permalink Mark Unread

"Don't do that! Does it not hurt you?"

Permalink Mark Unread

"I - I guess not - I'm sorry, I was - making a gesture that's supposed to do a use-mention distinction I'm sorry -"

Permalink Mark Unread

"Well, lucky you." He grits his teeth. "You could say how you did actually die, some people think that helps -"

Permalink Mark Unread

"I got murdered by a lone gunman in front of an auditorium full of my students."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Sometime - gonna ask you about that -"

Sigh. 

 

Permalink Mark Unread

 

Cam takes a deep breath and sits down on the floor next to him and slaps a strip of duct tape over his own mouth.

Permalink Mark Unread

 

He seems to take a bit to make sense of this.

"I'm not mad at you."

Permalink Mark Unread

Cam makes a piece of paper, reads what is on it a couple times, and turns it: I don't want it to happen again, regardless, so I might need some practice for a while. If I re-read your book does that count again?

Permalink Mark Unread

"No. That works - sorta - for things whose merit is artistic but not for things whose merit is informational."

Permalink Mark Unread

I'm sorry.

Permalink Mark Unread

 

"I hate it. It's so - stupid and pointless and it's there for everything and it was better when the only alternative was to be a miserable short-lived starving human but there is something better and I can't ever have it and I hate it."

Permalink Mark Unread

Permalink Mark Unread

Sigh.

Permalink Mark Unread

Cam is still sort of holding his wrist. He puts it down.

Permalink Mark Unread

There's a knock on the door. 

"Yep," he says loudly and unhappily to the door. "Won't happen again, I'll explain later."

Permalink Mark Unread

It's slightly challenging to sigh with duct tape over one's mouth but Cam gives it a try.

Permalink Mark Unread

He hesitates a second then gives him a hug. "Don't - it takes kids a while to learn it and they get better feedback."

Permalink Mark Unread

Cam nods. His wing unfolds under Econ Faery's arm to settle on his back.

Permalink Mark Unread

Lean. "Glad you're here."

Permalink Mark Unread

Snort.

Permalink Mark Unread

Lean. Sigh. "...I wonder if you're affected by the non-physical parts of misfortune. We could roll some dice and check."

Permalink Mark Unread

Cam produces a set of dice of assorted numbers of facets and tumbles them to the floor and makes an inquiring noise.

Permalink Mark Unread

"Uh, the usual way is for us to play a game against each other, we both roll, we bet on the outcome, whoever rolls higher wins. If you don't get nonphysical misfortune either you'll win by a margin that would be really unlikely otherwise after twenty rolls. If you do I should win."

Permalink Mark Unread

Cam revises his reply a couple times before he's sure of it. I am not confident I can accurately remember the rules to any dice games without looking things up.

Permalink Mark Unread

"I mean, usually what I described is the whole game. We roll a dice each and bet on whose roll will be higher. There are dice games that are more fun than that but this one's the quickest for testing."

Permalink Mark Unread

Cam duplicates the twenty-sided die in a different color and hands Econ Faery one.

Permalink Mark Unread

Then they can roll dice!

Permalink Mark Unread

Cam does not win conspicuously.

Permalink Mark Unread

"So you're probably not immune to all misfortune."

Permalink Mark Unread

And I didn't lose really badly either so it's probably not converting whatever happened to you into more luck stuff for me, right?

Permalink Mark Unread

"Yeah. My best guess would be that you are just immune to physical effects and affected normally by other effects."

Permalink Mark Unread

That's not that surprising but I wish I'd found out in some more controlled way. I'm really sorry.

Permalink Mark Unread

"You're really sweet."

Permalink Mark Unread

Why, because I feel bad about being careless and hurting you?

Permalink Mark Unread

"Most recent item on the list, I guess?"

Permalink Mark Unread

Not-quite-a-laugh exhalation.

Permalink Mark Unread

"But it's an impressively long list. - is there a longer version of the story of how you died?"

Permalink Mark Unread

This takes a while to pass vetting.

After I publicized summoning I made it known that I'd been a summoner before, though not that I'd been behind distributing the book. I started teaching classes on summoning. When I was 22, someone who I think but can't guarantee had tracked down who was behind "Revelation" (the publicization event), possibly through a daeva I'd summoned, located me. He came into my classroom while I was teaching, armed with a ranged weapon that hasn't been invented yet in this year, and shot me in the head, and I died.

Permalink Mark Unread

"Why?"

Permalink Mark Unread

I suspect but cannot confirm that he resented my having disrupted his business, which I think was based around having summoned daeva make scarce things for him to sell.

Permalink Mark Unread

"That's so tragically stupid."

Permalink Mark Unread

Nod nod.

Permalink Mark Unread

"Fairies can't die of violence unless we've run up some really atrocious misfortune or are sufficiently in someone's debt."

Permalink Mark Unread

...what happens instead?

Permalink Mark Unread

"What would happen if you tried is an interesting question. Usually the wound is not deep or well-aimed enough to be lethal and the attacker is dropped with a stunning headache and can't try again."

Permalink Mark Unread

I intend to pass on finding out what would happen if I tried.

Permalink Mark Unread

Snort. "Good plan."

Permalink Mark Unread

I agree.

Permalink Mark Unread

"Should I go? - I forget what we were doing before but I probably won't be up to it for a little while."

Permalink Mark Unread

Cam folds his wing up. Don't let me keep you. I'm really sorry.

Permalink Mark Unread

"I didn't mean 'I prefer to', just, you might've had plans aside from wingsnuggles and really boring dice games -"

Permalink Mark Unread

I didn't really have an agenda, we were just talking before.

Permalink Mark Unread

"I assume this is some kind of cultural difference but it's really hard to discern whether you derive any value from my presence from most of the things you communicate about it."

Permalink Mark Unread

How do faeries normally signal that besides, like, voluntarily hanging out with each other?

Permalink Mark Unread

"'Should I stay' usually gets a yes, or a no, or a 'I'd be happy to do you a favor' or 'I consider you owed one', or - you don't want to be unclear about what things are for, right, that makes it unpredictable how much they'll cost -"

Permalink Mark Unread

This takes a while of looking at his paper for a reply to pass muster too. That makes sense but it still strikes me as sort of rude. Even with you having asked the question in the first place a straight yes or no seems like it's presuming I have more information than I feel like I ought to claim about what else you would be doing with yourself and how you feel about your options.

Permalink Mark Unread

" - see, I feel like I was clear about that too - you are wonderful and on that account I'd almost always prefer to be here if this happens to be valuable, with the exceptions being urgent things I needed to work on and 'I am supposed to finish a report on trade goods in the next hour' is the kind of thing I'd mention."

Permalink Mark Unread

Operating on that assumption feels rude even though you have now said so explicitly in words! And if I try to screen that off I still have the sense that not having a specific plan for what to do prevents me from having a good answer about whether to do it.

Except insofar as I seem to be keeping you talking by default but if you'd benefit from going and lying down or something seriously please don't let me keep you.

Permalink Mark Unread

He reads that and makes a puzzled face. Shrugs. "I'm appreciating the distraction. And when i leave everyone else will want to know what happened, which can wait."

Permalink Mark Unread

I am entirely willing to serve as a delaying tactic.

Usually idiomatically I'd say 'happy to' but I'm being careful and don't know how emotional about it I'd have to be for that to be true.

Permalink Mark Unread

"'s generally fine so long as your emotions about it are positive but better to be safer, right now especially - subsequent lies are worse -"

Permalink Mark Unread

Shudder. How long does that last?

Permalink Mark Unread

"None of this has been measured very carefully, mind, it's too risky to too many people to do any interesting experiments. But what I've heard is that the effect is most significant the same hour and might persist through the night."

Permalink Mark Unread

I need to get my error rate down, I can't tolerate a mistake on even like an annual basis, are there established techniques that aren't putting duct tape over my mouth?

Permalink Mark Unread

"With kids, their parents interrupt them really aggressively when they might be making a mistake and are with them every time they're talking to another person, until they stop making mistakes or even near-mistakes. And there're drills - my mother liked drills where we had to come up with ten true things to say in response to something someone said, and my father liked asking for how confident we were in everything we said - but I think that's an easier task than what you're trying to do, because kids wouldn't be trying to avoid using unmarked metaphors, they just wouldn't know any -"

Permalink Mark Unread

I'm managing surprisingly well on cutting out sarcasm but that's one that might get me, and the metaphor wasn't even unmarked just not marked in a suitable way but those could get me too.

This sounds like a tedious way to talk for a million years but maybe I'll just get used to it.

Permalink Mark Unread

"We can't even just get you unentangled from all faeries because there's some ongoing entanglement between you and your summoner. I assume it's a consequence of the fact you'd go home if he died."

Permalink Mark Unread

Probably. I should apologize to him too and anybody else I hit.

Permalink Mark Unread

" - that'd be the whole court, courts're entangled. You really don't have to, we - knowingly made decisions that caused us to be entangled with you because we liked the balance of the effects that'd have."

Permalink Mark Unread

It's customary when I'm from to apologize for hurting people even if they decided to be around you. Also that isn't true of my summoner, is it?

Permalink Mark Unread

" - yeah, fair, he probably signed up for none of this and regrets it all immensely."

Permalink Mark Unread

So I would like to apologize to him and I'm curious if there's anything to be done to make it up to him that doesn't do Debt Things. Like, I don't know, maybe I can make myself more convenient to perform transactions with to his friends or something.

Permalink Mark Unread

"You could have him moved somewhere if he wants, or get some guests prohibited or something."

Permalink Mark Unread

Is he currently obliged to receive guests he doesn't want?

Permalink Mark Unread

"Unless my brother told you otherwise recently, that's how the dungeons work."

Permalink Mark Unread

Permalink Mark Unread

"Within-court everyone's clear on which things will get you arrested. Between-court I guess it's more complicated than that but it's still very rare to arrest anyone who didn't know perfectly well you'd do that if you learned of the situation."

Permalink Mark Unread

Well, I suppose if I have the leverage to make that stop I can apply it in an apologetic fashion but I'm not sure it should count since I would have done that anyway.

Permalink Mark Unread

"I mean, 'I want him treated differently, as a favor" requires much less leverage than 'change how you treat all the prisoners'. Though you probably have enough for the latter, you kind of have a lot."

Permalink Mark Unread

I've noticed and it's really weird and frequently uncomfortable.

Permalink Mark Unread

" - why? It's because you have things people want."

Permalink Mark Unread

Yes, but I only want some of the things that gets me.

Permalink Mark Unread

"And you can't just specify those things and let people figure out how to offer them because that's rude?"

Permalink Mark Unread

I don't want to claim that I'm generically uncomfortable with having power but I really don't like the kind I can wield accidentally and I'm not clear on how to stop.

Permalink Mark Unread

"Can you, like, give an example -"

Permalink Mark Unread

A lot of the problem is I don't know exactly where examples might be found, though I have guesses. There seem to be a lot of expectations to do with who is in whose debt and what they're entitled to because of that and in what forms and how it's to be solicited with what consequences for not producing the repayment on request, and meanwhile I don't even have a way to tell which way debt's running at any given time, though again I have guesses.

Permalink Mark Unread

"We should set something up with your computer so you can approximately track debt. But I think there's less of - people are broadly walking around with the understanding that you want payment in certificates and you do payments in food, and probably they're doing some things you disapprove of to get the certificates sometimes but they're not expecting you to suddenly demand something else. And if you did give someone who was in your debt something they parsed as an order, I think people in this court would still object to you or conceivably to me if it were one that really bothered them. There's a fair bit of latitude for - clarification and backchannel objection and so on before one would expect any trouble from disobeying an order from a stranger they're indebted to."

Permalink Mark Unread

I don't know that the faery standard of "really bother" is where I'd want it to be.

Permalink Mark Unread

"Surely there are some kinds of interactions apsels have which other apsels find moderately annoying but not annoying enough to bother asking for them to stop?"

Permalink Mark Unread

Sure, and it might even be a similar threshold. This bothers me less with people I'm not interested in being friends with.

Permalink Mark Unread

" - well, who all are you even interested in being friends with? - the human I absolutely believe would take orders from you too seriously. I will tell you if you're doing something that parses to fairies as an order or a threat - actually, you totally noticed when you made me nervous, when you were angry about people drugging prisoners. My brother's constitutionally incapable of misinterpreting anything."

Permalink Mark Unread

Maybe I don't know how to explain the thing. Or I guess I could be imagining it.

Permalink Mark Unread

Sigh. "Maybe talk about it with someone who's good at people?"

Permalink Mark Unread

Maybe, though I worry cultural familiarity will turn out to be important.

Permalink Mark Unread

Nod. "I don't - I can believe there's something I'm missing that'd matter to you but I don't think there's something about how you're acting that's a source of stress to people here. Uh, aside from the mistake with the lying."

Permalink Mark Unread

Well. I can work on that.

Permalink Mark Unread

"It'll be appreciated."

Permalink Mark Unread

Do you want me to explain to whoever needs explanations for you?

Permalink Mark Unread

"I think I should explain first though you can too if you want."

Permalink Mark Unread

Okay. Why?

Permalink Mark Unread

"Because they'll be really nervous if you're talking to them that you might say something you shouldn't and they'll be all twitchy about it and once it's been conveyed that you understand the problem and are taking it seriously and so on then they won't be as twitchy."

Permalink Mark Unread

I was imagining the tape on my face would do that.

Permalink Mark Unread

"It will probably help but it's weird and weird isn't usually reassuring, not without context. It will definitely help once they have context, which I can provide."

Permalink Mark Unread

Okay. Would something less conspicuous be better?

Permalink Mark Unread

"Nah. Just - lemme explain first." He stands up, slowly. 

Permalink Mark Unread

Do you think painkillers that work on humans would be worth trying?

Permalink Mark Unread

"I find the idea of getting around the universe's attempts to punish me very aesthetically compelling but it's probably unwise."

Permalink Mark Unread

Okay.

Permalink Mark Unread

"Please don't - I don't want you to be miserable. We'll figure out how to do better but -" Sigh. "More people being unhappy is worse, here. You being unhappy is worse."

Permalink Mark Unread

Thank you.

Permalink Mark Unread

He heads out.

Permalink Mark Unread

Somewhat contrary to Econ Faery's instruction, Cam mopes around a bit and then decides to eat a pint of ice cream.

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He reassures people who need reassurance and then goes to take a nap and sends someone to tell Cam

" - that things have been communicated and he can come out and apologize if he still wants to do that or petition for prisoner's rights or whatever I'm going to go take a nap, he said," she repeats dutifully.

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Thank you, Cam displays rather than re-writing.

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She nods and leaves.

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Out he goes.

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The court is somewhat subdued but some people are out and about and do not flee in terror at the sight of him or anything.

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He writes up an apology and shows it to people he passes and keeps an eye out for Not A Stupid Asshole Lohte.

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In his office with the door open, reading something. "Hello," he says when he sees Cam passing by.

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Well, first of all, here's the apology letter, look at it.

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He reads it. He nods. "A million years is - a very high bar. It'll take changes on our end to reach that level of caution too."

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I will also still be around after that, hopefully.

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"But the universe will no longer annihilate you and, who knows, possibly end if your summoner dies so I'll feel a lot less obliged to be extraordinarily cautious."

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Nod.

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"Why don't you sit down?"

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Plop.

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"I don't know if you made the connection but this is the mechanism by which you were expected and intended to harm us, when you arrived."

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Hadn't, actually, I thought they expected me to do magic. I showed up in a gag and stuff.

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"Not by talking. Hurting someone you're indebted to counts the same way as lies. More strongly, typically."

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Your brother told me that doesn't usually work though?

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"When there's fighting within a court the fighting won't kill anyone and the misfortune frequently will."

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Oh.

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"It's very common for there to be mistakes when people are learning, though, and a couple of them won't sink us. Are you all right? Did it hit you?"

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We checked my luck and that seemed to hit me normally but I didn't get a noticeable headache.

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"Huh. Well, that's better than not-that, I guess. The luck should be mostly back to normal after a couple of sleeps, it's probably worth checking if it lasts longer than that. Do you think there's something we could have thought of or warned you about to prevent the problem -"

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I'd probably benefit from just all the information you have on what does and doesn't count. I didn't even just forget, it just turned out that air quotes don't work - there's a punctuation mark that marks the use-mention distinction in writing and a gesture that mimics the shape of the punctuation mark and I don't know if it didn't work because gestures don't - but nodding does, doesn't it? - or because air quotes in particular are not valid for some reason, or because your brother didn't happen to understand them, or what. So if I knew more about the edge cases I might have been able to notice it was going to be an edge case and marked the sentence more explicitly.

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"Gestures work. Gestures work even when someone misunderstands them if they're the sort of gesture almost everyone would understand. I don't know if it's going off '80% of people around today understand the gesture' -- maybe of all people or those speaking the language or those in the vicinity or something else -- or 'the magic's ideal of an informed person understands the gesture' or 'some gestures are objectively correct and most faeries know them through some process of cultural osmosis', or maybe none of those. In general you want to disclaim out loud before starting anything that's quoting someone or retelling or paraphrasing them or otherwise a representation of some words that aren't yours. You don't need to be very specific, 'as they say' works if someone actually does say that and 'I heard once' works most of the time. 

Gestures work if the other party understands them even if they're not common or universal but you don't want to count on that."

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Is having conversations in writing like this dangerous, if a statement I write is true in context but then someone picks up the paper later?

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"No, unless you're deliberately leaving the paper for someone else to mislead them in which case probably still no but I wouldn't bet on it. Similarly if someone overhears part of a conversation and hears a statement without disclaimers and what they hear is false, you're fine unless you were engineering the conversation such that they'd overhear something false -- say, by saying those parts much louder when you knew they were at the door -"

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Cam takes notes on all this. I was able to read him an entire fictional story and hypothesized that opening it with the descriptor 'a fable of economics' sufficed even though he didn't quite get till afterwards that it had been fictional.

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"'I'm reading you the words on this paper' is a context where you're reasonably safe if you haven't represented yourself as confident in the truth of the words on the paper, too, if you didn't write them. Even if it weren't, 'a fable' is probably enough disclaimer."

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That's good, I don't think a million years' worth of things I want to read have been written and I'm kind of hoping I can inspire faeries to generate more things to read which aren't exclusively factual because that's a very limiting constraint.

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"If you get very bored we can always slow you down."

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There are probably a thousand years of things to read if I deliberately develop some tastes I don't currently have but I'm worried about being findable or having causally significant interactions if I'm slowed down.

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"That makes sense. It is possible to get slowed down while small and remain in the court but I don't know if this solves your problem, I don't know what makes people findable."

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I don't either.

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"I can try to think about, and write up for you, any other edge cases I can think of, I'm not coming up with much right now. - you can only get penalized for lying as a result of intentional communication? Talking in your sleep isn't lying, instinctive sounds of pain or pleasure aren't lying, talking to yourself without expecting anyone to hear you isn't lying, facial expressions not meant to communicate anything aren't lying. It's considered hard though not proven impossible to lie with facial expressions, actually, I know of plenty of cases of lying with gestures but I do situationally appropriate facial expressions that don't have much to do with my mood all the time and have never had a problem."

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I do talk in my sleep but I'm told it's usually not in sentences and I mix up all the languages I know. - what does mixing up languages do? What's the threshold of expecting someone to hear me?

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"You can't be considered to by lying if the person you're talking to doesn't speak the language. Expecting someone to hear you seems to run off a threshold somewhat resembling the one for expecting a gesture to be understood - it could be that most people in your place would expect it, it could be that the universe has a concept of a reasonable person who would expect it, it could be that in the local culture there'd be an expectation they're listening. Very few people sincerely disagree with the judgment of the universe when it's described to them though some people will express uncertainty about whether they would have expected that to count. I could do some examples - I'm expecting you to hear me. If you start to walk away and I keep talking, I'd still be expecting you to hear me until you're through the door. If you're through the door and I raise my voice, I still expect you to hear me; if you're through the door and I keep talking at this volume I'd no longer expect you to hear me. If someone comes in and whispers something to me and I whisper back I don't expect you to hear, unless you lean forward and do something else to indicate you're trying to. If you're asleep I don't expect you to hear me but if I'm not sure if you're asleep I do expect you to hear me. If you are wearing earplugs I don't expect you to hear me unless I'm speaking loudly or gesturing to get your attention or something. 

All of this only matters if you're wrong. If you don't in fact hear me I don't get in trouble even if the universe thinks a reasonable person would have heard me. If I'm sufficiently confident you won't hear me I can do things the universe considers unreasonable, but I'd be taking a risk every time."

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What if someone speaks the language but not very well and I deliberately use overwrought phrasing?

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"Haven't tried it and don't know of anyone who's tried it. I'd expect that to be fine because it's generally fine to outmaneuver people verbally while not actually saying anything false."

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I guess experiments should probably be done by someone who is not entangled very much with anyone.

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"Yeah, it's not a realm where we've experimented much and there's not an obvious good setup to do so."

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Sigh.

I am inclined to apologize to my summoner and try to make it up to him. Your brother suggested he might currently be not only stuck in the dungeons but also receiving visitors he does not want and that I could arrange for that to stop without a debt interaction to deal with from doing so?

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"Yes, what I tell other people is permitted within the court isn't the sort of thing the debt system tracks. I don't know if he actually dislikes any visitors but maybe he'd appreciate the assurance even if he doesn't."

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It occurred to me that this might not be a great apology since I would have pushed for it anyway as soon as it occurred to me for whoever you have in there whether I have recently given them a headache or not.

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"I don't want to change how the dungeons function in general. You can make arrangements on behalf of the people we're holding for you, that seems fine."

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"Punishments are supposed to be punishing. A reputation for having the nicest dungeons around is a really unhelpful one. And that'd be a particularly visible-to-outsiders way of making things nice for prisoners."

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I'm going to want to circle back to this at some point but I will settle for the ones you're holding "for me" now.

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"Happily."

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In your estimation would it be more reassuring if I apologized in person, such as that is at the moment, or not?

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"Not necessarily more reassuring but much likelier to actually get your point across. It is kind of a confusing thing to do and if it's being conveyed secondhand there's more opportunity for confusions about what you intend by doing it."

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I don't think I understand why it's confusing.

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"You're apologizing to a prisoner because you accidentally hurt him."

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Yes! I made a mistake and it hurt a bunch of people including him! This is pretty much the central case of what I understand apologies to be for!

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"understand why you're doing it! But people don't usually apologize to prisoners and if they do they usually have a point besides 'I am sorry I hurt you'."

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A point like what?

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"'I consider us on intimate terms' or 'if I hurt you again it'll be on purpose' or 'now I think you have some things to apologize to me for' or something."

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Ugh.

He can't read, I'll need someone to help me unless I take the tape off earlier than I'd intended.

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"I can go with you if you'd like."

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Thanks.

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"Of course." He stands up.

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Cam remembers approximately where the dungeons are.

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Cam's summoner is in a cage a little smaller than a twin mattress. It does not have a mattress. He's slumped against one side; he stiffens slightly when they enter.

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Lohte gets a Look. The prisoner gets the apology note held up angled so he can see it and also so Lohte can see it to read from.

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He reads it. The prisoner looks confused. 

" - I think in his culture you apologize to prisoners when you injure them," he adds, "and the intended meaning is that you wanted better for them, because it's a generous sort of culture that way. Nothing else."

The prisoner looks suspicious.

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Cam nods at this explanation, and writes up his supplementary apology note about the visitors thing.

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The prisoner looks slightly less suspicious when this is translated and names some people who shouldn't visit him.

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And has Lohte got that?

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"Yes, I'll arrange that."

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Thanks.

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"Of course." And they can head out?

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Yup.

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"If it's comfortable they incur debt for the hospitality. We do offer, but it'd be stupid to accept, and no one does."

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Well, that's stupid and I hate it.

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"I am not very surprised."

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Your brother suggested I talk to someone good at people, by which he may have just meant you, about... I'm not sure how to summarize the topic we were on at the time, my cultural discomfort with illegible interpersonal power?

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Nod. 

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But I'm not sure what to ask.

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"Would you be having this problem if you were wandering around among the eleventh century humans? That is, is it a consequence of the species difference or of some cultural ones?"

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I think I'd have better guesses about the humans' thought processes even though my knowledge of the century is vague and gappy. I think it's... cultural differences but specifically the ones that arise out of the species difference, maybe.

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"Do you think we'd solve it in significant part if we worked out some kind of computerized debt accounting for you? Or if, I don't know, people carried abacuses and moved beads around when anyone spoke to let you know where the debt stood?"

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It wouldn't hurt and it'd give me practice that I expect would be useful in the long term, but, well, for one thing I'd be surprised if the computer could do it effectively, and for another it'd tell me about what people are reacting to in reality but not what they expect or want or anything.

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"They want sushi and popcorn, for the most part.  - unless we're talking about my brother. Are we?"

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He is among the topics we could be talking about.

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"He is in love with you because you fulfilled all his dreams and at least as much because you understood them, and I don't think he has the faintest idea what he wants but he's happy and he's not expecting anything and he's too literal-minded to take anything except an explicit statement about what you want as a hint about what you want."

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I do not know what to do about him being in love with me at all!

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"What would you do about it if he was a human or an apsel or something?"

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Then I'd probably ask him on a date, which I don't know if faeries do, and be way less worried that I would suddenly find myself metaphorically neck-deep in something that would be really kinky if a human or apsel or something did it!

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"Faeries go on dates. I'm not entirely sure what you mean by the - are you worried that you don't know what sex acts he likes? Does it not work to ask him?"

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Well this is a weird conversation to be having with his brother but that's more of a subset of the issue.

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He has no idea why this would be a weird conversation to be having with his brother but decides not to ask. 

"Can you maybe - describe something that would be a bad outcome?"

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It's probably relevant that I (as an individual, this isn't a culture thing) am not a big fan of casual sex and if he's in love with me "casual" is not the right word but a thing I don't like about it is that it's too much a matter of

Actually I wound up using I think eight different languages figuring this out for myself when I was like forty, I'm not sure I'm going to be able to successfully explain it in this one.

It'd be a bad outcome if we dated and then it turns out faeries don't even have the emotions I'm interested in relationships involving, or don't think of them as important or don't think of them as important compared to making sure whoever's recently given the other party more sushi gets more stuff, or something.

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Nod.

"I think you might actually just have to talk with him about that. If you want to. I haven't really known any humans but it doesn't seem impossible to me that there are some emotions around relationships which humans have and faeries don't."

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Yeah, that's probably the mature responsible thing to do instead of awkwardly pretending I haven't noticed.

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"I hope for your sake it is not the case that no faeries have the sort of thing you want."

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Yes, that would get annoying sometime in the next million years.

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"It really would! Good luck."

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Thank you.

Well, last he heard Econ Faery was taking a nap and who knows how long a nap, so he goes back to his own room, continuing to issue his form apology to anybody he passes who hasn't seen it yet.

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People are confused but appreciative.

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He plops in his chair.

Auda probably cannot read this entire apology yet. He peels the tape off his mouth so he can ask, "Are you okay?"

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" - hmm? Did something happen?"

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"I made a mistake, the kind that gives people headaches, but wasn't sure if it propagated to you."

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"I don't think so. Did they hurt you?"

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"No. I didn't even get the headache. I wish I hadn't screwed up, though, I don't want to hurt anybody."

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"Are they angry?"

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"I don't think so."

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Nod. "I'm sorry. It gets easier with practice."

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"That's good."

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Hug?

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Hug.

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"What did you say?"

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"I don't remember exactly. I was trying to make it clear I wasn't asserting it, but I did that with a gesture that the system doesn't seem to recognize as sufficient."

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She nods. 

 

"Poor faeries."

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"Yeah."

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"First time I lied to them I yelled at someone that he hadn't fed me in a week. It'd been five days."

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"...well, he kind of deserved that if you ask me but I assume it was pretty bad all around for you."

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"They were really angry. I hadn't been - I wasn't trying to hurt him, I had forgotten it'd do that."

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Nod.

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Sigh.

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Sigh. "I took off the tape I had on my mouth because you probably don't read very fluently yet, but I want to try to train myself to be more careful by not having trivial access to talking out loud, since I can write notes and read them over to make sure they're okay instead. Is there anything you want to talk about before I put it back?"

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"I don't think so. I'm all right. You're better than they deserve, you know."

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Snort. "Thank you."

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She glances at the door and goes back to her room.

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Cam tapes his mouth shut again and organizes and studies his notes on what constitutes a lie.

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He drops by a while later with the next batch of certificates.

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Hi. What are these for?

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"I've got a list." It's of various requested foods; a lot of people wanted to be surprised.

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Is there a way to charge extra for surprises? It's more work. People who want surprises get crackerjacks and assorted breakfast cereals.

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"Hmmm. There's not a straightforward one, the debt value of the food doesn't change ...maybe it would, actually, if 'surprise me' had to be written as 'as a favor, select some foods for me'..."

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Perhaps that will be my policy going forward. What would happen if I screwed up an order?

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"Then the debt won't be quite even and presumably they'll complain, no one wants to be entangled with you - no offense -"

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Makes sense. Should I be coming up with ways to square up with you?

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"I should probably be more attentive to not letting it run up very far in either direction - you could add some snacks or a book or something to that," he nods at the pile of packages.

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Machine translation isn't at a very high standard yet. Chocolate coins, why not.

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"That'll be close enough. I'm sorry for not paying it more attention earlier."

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You're the one who got hurt.

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"And a bunch of other people." Sigh. "If I keep a closer eye on it the risk'll be much smaller - you'd still hurt your summoner, but not the whole court."

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Which should at least prevent it from snowballing, if I understand right?

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"Snowballing?"

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I keep translating idioms, I think I do it because this language doesn't have enough of its own for what I guess are obvious reasons. Snowballing means continuing to accumulate more of a thing than the original input as a result of that original input like if you roll a ball of snow downhill.

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"It shouldn't do that either way but not affecting the court means there's a lot less likelihood of misfortune affecting everything we're doing."

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Does the subsequent slipups are worse thing only apply to the person who makes the mistake in the first place?

How "smart" is the misfortune in targeting complex projects?

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"We're really not sure, to both questions. You're right that us being unentangled from you should protect us from the worse consequences of followup slipups if there are any. People have hypothesized that complex failures are down to misfortune but it's hard to test. Machinery failing is the kind of thing it'll do; all the foods going to people who don't particularly like them is the kind of thing it'll do; it probably wouldn't do something like ensuring that specifically influential people have a bad experience or hear about it in a bad mood or something, but some people claim it does do stuff like that, so I can't say for sure."

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Cam nods. He realizes he has been asking questions and adds another chocolate coin, letting it fall so Econ Faery can hear it.

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"Thank you." Sigh.

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You're welcome. I assume you'd tell me if that was the wrong amount.

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"It's close enough. If there's a little entanglement we'll notice if you do something wrong but it won't be that unpleasant and the effects will be very short-lasting."

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Cam nods. I talked to your brother for values of 'talked' that include me writing my end.

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"Are the prisoners better accommodated?"

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The one is. Apparently making anything more comfortable has complications and he's concerned about being known to have nice dungeons and I didn't want to get into a whole conversation about prison conditions right then, it didn't seem like a good time.

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"Because you feel guilty?"

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No, actually, mostly because trying to get people to do things I want that they have reason to object to when I have just harmed them seemed like a losing move.

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"Fair enough."

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Anyway, I more or less already knew this but he convinced me that I should probably be having a conversation with you about our feelings like a grownup instead of awkwardly pretending not to notice that you have a crush on me, or actually he was characterizing it as 'in love with' but I am not sure on what basis.

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"Oh, I told him. I wanted advice and was worried that I would offend you or something and it'd interfere with the project and I wanted him to figure out who he could substitute in if it did."

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...blink blink. Well, I'm not offended, mostly I'm just awkward.

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" - it would be pretty surprising if you didn't have a lot of experience with people falling in love with you. I guess the publication thing was secret."

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As far as I know no one has ever fallen in love with me before! I barely have friends back in Hell!

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"That's honestly very weird!"

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I'm pretty introverted, don't publicize my major accomplishment, and am nothing particularly special on an interpersonal level to most tastes, I think?

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"Well, lots of people here would want you so if you perceive yourself as not having a lot of options I think you should reconsider that."

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I don't perceive myself as unable to find people to hook up with, I'm aware that I'm reasonably attractive, but 'in love with' is normally a different matter.

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"I guess it's possible I am overestimating how obvious or how universally desirable your traits are but it sure feels like there should be a lot of people who notice this."

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Nah, I've historically settled for people thinking I have nice shoulders or something when there's anything going on at all. Shrug.

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"Okay, if you don't want - whatever - at least let me find you someone who thinks you're the best thing that ever happened."

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Confusion about the nature of the whatever is why I have been being so awkward!

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"I don't really know what humans do? Faeries usually arrange their projects so they can do them together and maybe move in together and stop tracking debt internally not that we can really do that and make long-term plans and are smug at other people about how well their life is going and... I could survey people and put together a list or something?"

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...giggle. How does not tracking debt internally work?

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"You just - stop worrying about being even and accept that you'll be entangled, which lets you have a lot more interactions that you couldn't afford otherwise."

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Does it matter in which direction they're not even, though?

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"Some people care about it, some people don't, some people need it to work one way or another for political reasons - harder to do negotiations if you visibly don't have the authority to follow through on anything -"

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Huh.

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"A lot of people find it really nice to have one relationship that is not governed by debt management. But - we should really be keeping it around even for now anyway, for the peace of mind of my court -"

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Yeah, I actually feel very differently about it having internal relationship significance versus it being a thing that occasionally requires passing around snacks and certificates.

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"I'm not super clear on what you want, here -"

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I'm trying to sort out what's available, at this stage.

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"...pretty much anything it'd be in character for you to want?"

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Okay, but it's not in character for me to want to dictate all the terms without any input, does that make sense?

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"So, right now I don't even have any idea what you want? If you give me a list of things I can rank them or invent a scale and assign them values on that scale or - or ask my brother what normal people do instead of doing those things - but I don't even know what to put on that list right now."

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You could likewise give me a list, is my point?

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"- sure. We can both make lists and exchange them."

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That actually sounds really embarrassing but maybe that is the best we can do here.

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"We could ask my brother to have a five minute conversation about something unrelated and then recommend an activity we'd both like, if you'd rather?"

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Snort. That does sound less embarrassing.

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"I don't really see what's embarrassing but I'll take your word for it."

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My mental image of doing the lists thing is of us managing to have very different mental pictures of what kinds of things belong on the lists and being mismatched and this being weird.

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"That seems like important information to have, though!"

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Yes, I'd just normally expect it to come up over the course of conversations naturally in contexts where the information was relevant.

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"I have this feeling it won't do that because doing that requires some conversational skill I'm no good at but we could try that too."

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What skill do you mean?

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"Raising things naturally instead of figuring them out with a spreadsheet and a checklist?"

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We have fairly normal seeming conversations on a frequent basis though.

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"Well then maybe eventually they'll uncover whatever it is that a list would uncover, but in a more socially normal sort of way. Are there human stories you particularly recommend or anything. Like the Cambist and Lord Iron but featuring more than one character with a redeeming trait."

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It's a standout in terms of being about economics but I can translate more stories for you and many have larger casts of decent characters.

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"That sounds neat, then!"

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Do you have any more specifications? Humans and also daeva write a whole lot of fiction in the future.

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"It should probably be fiction that you like or it is unlikely to offer any insight into what kind of life would make you happy."

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I like a lot of things and unfortunately my very favorite is an aerial ballet and I don't yet know how to play recorded music or smooth video fast.

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"Oh no! I am sure we'll figure it out at some point in the next million years. Hmm... I like it when people are good at things? I like it when most of them are behaving sensibly?"

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...okay, that had me think of something, and it's a rather weird something but I suppose I don't know if it'll seem any weirder than The Cambist and Lord Iron to you since you start with very little background in fiction tropes.

Permalink Mark Unread

Bounce bounce. 

Permalink Mark Unread

A demon decided to write a series of stories in which a small group of Limboites - specific admirable famous people - slide into various fictional universes other people's works are set in and have adventures in each before moving on. They get better as one goes along but unfortunately don't make as much sense read out of order. I might need to explain the accomplishments of the protagonists first and I suppose assign them all nicknames since they'll be real one day.

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"Sounds interesting."

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Cam assigns the protagonists nicknames (Jeremy Bentham gets to be "Util", Nikola Tesla gets to be "AC", Seretse Khama gets to be "Botswana", Nellie Bly is a pen name anyway but maybe too entangled a pen name, how important does a name have to be -?)

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"Some combination of how many people know it and how much of significance is associated with it and how long it's been around."

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Nellie Bly can be, let's see, Ironclad, etcetera, and eventually he has named every real person who appears in the first story, and given brief biographies of each one and why the author thought they were particularly cool Limboites as Limboites go, and can proceed through translating their visit to Narnia, which is clearly the tossed-off crack fic of someone with talent but no practice and an idea that wouldn't leave them alone.

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He is so fascinated and so confused and has a lot of followup questions about who these people are. And after a while he leans against Cam, hesitantly.

Permalink Mark Unread

Awww.

Cam puts his wing around him.

Permalink Mark Unread

That would totally be on the list, if there were a list. 

He listens to the story.

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The stories aren't individually that long but Cam can't read them very fast since he's translating and also the explaining all the everything as it comes up takes longer than the stories themselves.

Permalink Mark Unread

He has so many questions. ...he should be trying to manage debt here but he has so many questions. He likes all these people quite a lot.

Permalink Mark Unread

Cam can take back his chocolate coins?

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"Probably should, yeah." Sigh.

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He puts them away and then plops back down next to Econ Faery and puts his wing over him again.

The advantage of this method of sharing the story is that now there's a written copy Econ Faery can keep!

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Oh good! (This will make it more expensive but he wants to keep it anyway).

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Maybe you should be telling me faery stories.

Permalink Mark Unread

"Maybe I should. Hmmm, do you want very pointed stories for children about the dangers of miscellaneous misconduct or do you want grand historical dramas or do you want grand historical tragedies which are like the dramas but everyone dies?"

Permalink Mark Unread

Let's start with a drama where not everyone dies!

Permalink Mark Unread

"All right!" So he tells the story of two feuding courts whose diplomats gradually become convinced the feud is petty and stupid and attempt to engineer an end to it through an overcomplicated plot that involves manufacturing a common enemy and setting up a lot of ill-advised romances and poisoning a couple people (merely to the point of moderate illness) so they'll be out of commission at key moments. Their plan does not exactly work as intended but the courts are, eventually, reconciled, and the plotters forgiven when discovered (for a definition of forgiven that involves being beaten to within an inch of their lives) and everyone lives happily ever after.

Permalink Mark Unread

Cam mostly finds this story charming, though he's queasy about the beating of the protagonists.

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Snuggle. "They were okay. They wandered for a while telling the story."

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I mean, them recovering is better than the alternative but still!

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"It's pretty bad incentives!"

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...I guess that's among the bad things about torturing them in this situation, sure!

Permalink Mark Unread

" - I can't really pretend I have a lot of other objections? It makes sense that their courts wanted them gone, and it's not like they didn't know you get in trouble for poisoning people and fabricating evidence of a conspiracy and so on."

Permalink Mark Unread

I'm against torture in virtually every situation and I'm including 'virtually' only because I admitted to Auda that a faery she lied to kind of deserved it and because I might have forgotten something.

Permalink Mark Unread

"It's not really on the list of the first ten things I'd try to get people to stop though I guess its absence is usually better than its presence? I'm worried that any options available to their courts to cut them out would be torture from the perspective of your civilization."

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It's a seriously complicating factor, needing to disentangle them, I acknowledge that. It doesn't seem obvious they needed to be in so much of a hurry though.

Permalink Mark Unread

"If my court wanted to cut me out and couldn't do anything painful or involving sex it'd take... a couple of full moons? Maybe longer."

Permalink Mark Unread

Even assuming you were cooperating? Yikes.

Permalink Mark Unread

"Parentdebts are very large and - the magic system gives sex and violence a lot of weight compared to most faeries. They're sort of - opportunities to generate surplus, in a way - because the universe cares and we mostly don't -"

Permalink Mark Unread

I don't think I'd be as generous as calling it surplus, violence is probably usually deadweight loss, isn't it? Unless there's a really high incidence of sadism in the population. I guess it's surplus in the same way that my being open for fifteen minutes at dawn is a shortage because the system isn't tracking convenience or speed.

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"I don't think very many people enjoy inflicting punishments though maybe a solid share of the people who pick it as a career do. It's a thing that is worth a lot more in debt than its disvalue for the involved parties, though, and there aren't a lot of things like that."

Permalink Mark Unread

This is a career? I suppose it would be inconvenient to have everyone who one has had had any remotely careless interaction with line up to kick one.

Permalink Mark Unread

"It's not a full-time occupation or anything but there's a bunch of skill to doing exactly as much harm as you intend to and not more, and for most things you want pain but not injury and you want to be credibly competent not to injure someone, physical punishment is far more unpleasant - and not even in a way that gets you more credit with the debt system - if you think they might mess up and cripple or kill you -"

Permalink Mark Unread

...well, now I can't decide whether I should be making a point of exporting capsaicin or not.

Permalink Mark Unread

"What's that?"

Permalink Mark Unread

The stuff that makes the burny-tasting food taste that way. Popular in small doses, for varying values of 'small', but it gets worse if it's more concentrated. Does not generally cripple or kill people. And I wouldn't like it a bit but if it'd be harm-reducing to have it handy...

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"It might be. You could stipulate that people have to choose it, if you wanted."

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I guess. I mean, I'm not sure how much that would help under the circumstances.

Permalink Mark Unread

"I think it matters kind of a lot. Even unpleasant things are different if you chose them because they were the best way to get what you wanted."

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Yes, but I perceive a difference in kind between "you can eat a ghost pepper and get this over with, or we can hang around for months while you perform tedious services" and "you can eat a ghost pepper or we revert to our default plan of beating the crap out of you".

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"Those seem different to me but I think I'd still care for the choice in the second case."

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I guess. I have pretty high opportunity cost though, you know?

Permalink Mark Unread

"Sure. It can be somewhere on the list for a hundred thousand years from now when you've done everything else."

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I'm hoping it'll be even less low-hanging metaphorical fruit after that long.

Permalink Mark Unread

"I think certificates will replace a lot of use cases of punishment once they're widespread. You can fine people. But they won't replace everything."

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They're faster than beating people up! If people have enough savings...

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"Yeah, exactly. Most people will have some going spare and can hand them over. But some people have nothing and still make trouble."

Permalink Mark Unread

Yeah.

Permalink Mark Unread

"How do the future people solve that?"

Permalink Mark Unread

Depends on the trouble but they don't make them eat ghost peppers.

Permalink Mark Unread

"I was curious if they do something I'd prefer."

Permalink Mark Unread

Sometimes they lock them up but the prisons can be nice and aimed toward trying to fix whatever situation led them to go committing crimes.

Permalink Mark Unread

"And people don't commit crimes just because nothing very bad will happen if they're caught?"

Permalink Mark Unread

I couldn't confidently claim that this never happens but in humans worse prison conditions are actually associated with higher recidivism rates. I don't know if the mechanisms behind that apply to faeries though.

Permalink Mark Unread

"Huh. That seems important."

Permalink Mark Unread

Understood mechanisms include people getting treatment for mental health problems or at least not making them worse with bad conditions, getting job training so they can do something other than what they were doing before, and avoiding setting up an excessively antagonistic relationship with the justice system. But maybe faeries don't have mental illnesses and never get sucked into a life of crime because they have no marketable skills and all understand perfectly that everything is how it is because of inalterable impersonal debt-related forces, I don't know.

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"Some faeries are - irretrievably out of touch with reality - but there's nothing that can really be done for them. I don't think not having skills is a typical reason to commit crimes."

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How do you know nothing can be done?

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"People are often highly motivated to try - if it's one of their kids or something - and I've never heard anyone report more of a success than 'we cut out her tongue and now it's safe to keep her around'."

Permalink Mark Unread

Well, I can't give an unambiguously positive report on all the kinds of psychiatric drugs there are, but there are those and I haven't seen evidence of a faery pharmaceutical industry at all.

Permalink Mark Unread

"That sounds worth publicizing."

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I will have to brush up on my psych notes.

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'I don't know if things meant for humans will help us at all but I'm sure there will be people willing to experiment."

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It'd be sort of weird if nothing did, since alcohol and caffeine work and you can eat the same food.

Permalink Mark Unread

"There are mushrooms that make people hallucinate and I've heard have the same effect on humans."

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So it'd be strange if no more elaborate drugs worked though I'd be likewise surprised if everything worked exactly the same.

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"It seems odd to me that there are drugs that can make people more in contact with reality though I guess there are drugs that can make people less in contact with reality so perhaps it shouldn't seem odd."

Permalink Mark Unread

Assuming I have the right idea about what contact with reality should be understood to mean the drugs that do it have worse side effects than lots of medications for other things but they still exist and might compare favorably to de-tonguing people.

Permalink Mark Unread

"Or to killing them, which is what lots of places do."

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That too.

Permalink Mark Unread

"I can mention the possibility next time we get a big stack of questions about what you sell."

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If I'm going to recklessly pharmacologically experiment on people I'd be slightly less uncomfortable about doing it to people who will get murdered if they can't behave.

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"Some bad incentives to publicizing that but we can try to filter for it."

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Is there a way to filter for 'more severe cases' and not 'more asshole families'?

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"Maybe? I'd expect how resourced the parents are and how strict the court to matter more than how severe the problems or how unpleasant anyone involved is on a personal level, for whether someone gets killed."

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I think I was implicitly lumping 'asshole families' in with 'strict court' but perhaps this was unfair of me.

Permalink Mark Unread

"Some people are very nice and very ruthless at need. And - you can hold it against them if you want but they live longer, their families live longer, 's not a stupid tradeoff to make even if you really care about lots of people."

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Cam nods.

Permalink Mark Unread

Sigh.

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Sigh!

Telling stories with all the cultural translation necessary in these cases is time consuming. I should probably feed Auda.

Permalink Mark Unread

"Okay. Should I head out? I get the sense she doesn't find faeries being around very reassuring."

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She's actually hoping to be able to socialize with more faeries gradually so she isn't totally isolated when I go on a business trip or whatever... He gets up and knocks on her door.

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She opens it. "Hi?"

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Breakfast?

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She takes a minute to read this. "Yes, thank you."

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She can have eggs Benedict. Some of the covered dishes from when he was away seem to be washed and back so he fills up a few of those too for the rest of the day's meals.

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She smiles at him and glances suspiciously at Econ Faery and then withdraws to eat.

Permalink Mark Unread

I guess she's not in the mood to say hi right this minute. Oh, so you're aware, she can hear some through the door.

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"We could get you separate rooms but maybe that'd be frightening for her?"

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Probably. But if we're doing a lot of story swapping you might need to check her for spillover debt I should be paying for in case she hears much of yours, and if anything requiring genuine privacy comes up we should go somewhere else.

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Nod. "She's not in my debt right now."

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She may've been asleep. I will try to think of a way to not wake her up whenever it occurs to me that it might be breakfast time on her sleep cycle, I guess. I miss my computer not being annoying to look at and mute.

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"What would it take to design one that didn't have those problems?"

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The screen flicker is probably fixable, and probably even fixable with expertise I already mostly have; it flickers because that was a convenient design under the constraints which didn't include people being sped up by a thousandfold. I'm incredibly confused about how sound works sped up, though, and don't know if that's solvable in principle or not.

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"My musician brother has made some efforts at recording devices but I don't know if any of them have been successful, they hadn't last I heard."

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I'd naively expect phonographs to work all right but that doesn't help at all with digital sound, I think. Maybe there's something clever to be done with interfacing phonographs and digital sound but it'd have to be pretty strange.

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"Maybe we can get my father on it once he's fast again."

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When will that be?

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"Later this afternoon, probably. We left him a note but he has to walk to the nearest circle and it's a ways away."

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Did I interrupt anything particularly important?

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"He was excited about the research he was doing but he'll also be excited about you, and you're more time-sensitive."

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I'll be around for a million years!

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"Well we don't want to count on you wanting to spend all that time with us personally!"

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I guess that's fair.

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"You are here kind of randomly. I think this is one of the best courts but if I were you I'd want to go check that at some point."

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I guess that would make sense, though I can hardly evaluate twenty billion people's worth of courts in any remotely reasonable expenditure of effort.

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"You could invite them to send pitches and have someone filter the pitches and give you those they think you're most likely to find interesting?"

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Nod. I should probably do something like that to decide where to visit in person anyway.

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"Yeah. Though for that size and trade influence might matter more than personality."

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I can still have everybody send combined applications, though, to streamline it.

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"Sounds good." Though he looks slightly sad.

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Wing goes over Econ Faery. I like you more than most people and don't think faeries as a class are going to enjoy an especially high average.

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Bounce bounce bounce.

"I think you ought to check, though!"

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And I will! But you looked bummed about it.

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"I would be very sad if you find nicer people, I just think you ought to look anyway."

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I mean, I could still visit. It would take me a long time to fly all the way around the world, or wherever, but not so long that I wouldn't do it sometimes.

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"Well, that's something." Snuggle.

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Snuggle. And maybe there's a way to get a shuttle working at speed.

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'I don't know enough about shuttles to even speculate but that'd be great if there were."

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I'd expect it to work under similar principles as any other vehicle, maybe with some complications if engine-type stuff works different from more purely mechanical locomotion.

Permalink Mark Unread

"When do humans invent all this stuff?"

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Spaceships in primitive form are twentieth century and they get fancier from there. Airplanes are a bit earlier than rockets that leave the planetary atmosphere but by a surprisingly small margin, I forget how small.

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"Huh. Neat."

 

And eventually he'll run out of questions or allowance to ask them. "Thank you. This was - nice."

Permalink Mark Unread

Good, because we can't go witness the invention of the joint stock corporation till the thirteenth century. We missed the Chinese version already!

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Apparently against his better judgment he sits back down. "Joint stock corporation?"

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Do you need me to cut you off here?

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He makes a face. 

Permalink Mark Unread

Sorry.

Permalink Mark Unread

"If it were your fault I wouldn't like you at all. - maybe a little bit. I wouldn't like you very much." He shakes his head. He heads out.

Permalink Mark Unread

Poor Econ Faery.

Cam does some work on the screen flicker problem, humming to himself through the tape.

Permalink Mark Unread

A while after that he comes in with an impressive stack of certificates. "Hi! I would like to learn all the languages you speak."

Permalink Mark Unread

As you can probably see I currently have tape on my mouth, which I was planning to leave there for awhile to observe where I tend to talk too carelessly. Example sentences in dozens of languages seem like they'd be especially hard to curate for accuracy.

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He sets all of the certificates down, looking very sad. "How long're you going to be at that?"

Permalink Mark Unread

I was thinking at least as long as it takes for all the misfortune to wear off but I've taken it off temporarily to update the human. I don't actually know how long that will take. Do you have a usual language learning protocol that doesn't have this problem?

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"Mostly people say 'this is a coin, this is a berry, this is a rock' and other things that are true."

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That's going to really limit your vocabulary. Or clutter your court with objects, I guess.

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"Hmmm. Do all the languages have the same written form?"

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Not even close. There's a most common alphabet, it's about the same as the current local language.

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"Ooooh! Then can you teach me the alphabets for the other ones? And we can do spoken words some other time."

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I guess that seems safe if I just pronounce individual sounds and words for you without forming any sentences?

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"Yes, that's not posing any risk of lying."

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Cam peels the tape off and starts teaching him the Arabic alphabet.

Permalink Mark Unread

He's so so delighted about this.

Permalink Mark Unread

When they're done with Arabic he can do hiragana and katakana with some written explanation of why this language has three alphabets.

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He's a fast learner.

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Then they can also get into Cyrillic and Devanagari.

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And eventually he has run through all of his certificates and thanks Cam very enthusiastically. "I'll get some more."

Permalink Mark Unread

How are you getting this many? That was pretty fast.

Permalink Mark Unread

"I sold most of my possessions."

Permalink Mark Unread

That sounds unsustainable.

Permalink Mark Unread

"Well, this is very important."

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Is it? These languages won't be spoken in the forms I know them for a long time.

Permalink Mark Unread

"Languages are just very important to me, personally, not because they're useful."

Permalink Mark Unread

You're still going to want another revenue source if you want to learn many of them.

Permalink Mark Unread

"I'm working on it."

Permalink Mark Unread

I'm curious what your ideas are though!

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"I'm writing something up about what we know of future technological progress and changes to human civilization, and I'm writing something up about how you got here and what things you have been observed to be capable of doing, and I am copying a lot of our books, and I have done some research on the plates and am writing a book about that, too."

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On the plates?

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"Yes! They're fascinating."

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Giggle. It's called plastic. It's cheap and common in the future.

Permalink Mark Unread

"Then we'd better trade it all before then, I guess."

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I'm not sure it'll be cheap and common for faeries, it's not exactly naturally occurring.

Permalink Mark Unread

"I determined that!"

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Giggle. How?

Permalink Mark Unread

"Animal and plant matter looks different than the plates look under a magnifying lens. And they're not stone or metal either."

Permalink Mark Unread

How would you have distinguished pottery?

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"I haven't studied pottery."

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Well, it isn't pottery. Do fairies do pottery?

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"Not really. I've heard of people sticking small things into humans' kilns but it's tricky to get right."

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I guess it would be. Did that tangent of questioning buy you a few kanji or what, I can't tell.

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"We could do a couple more, yeah."

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Here are a couple kanji.

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And then he will reluctantly head out.

Permalink Mark Unread

Cam picks up the screen flicker problem for a bit. Plays some violin. Writes up a proposal for the more humane treatment of prisoners, as long as he's doing everything in writing anyway. Goes for a walk.

Permalink Mark Unread

No one seems to be recovering from pain anymore; they've gone back to their normal games and conversations and so on. A couple still regard him warily.

Permalink Mark Unread

He has the apology on him too, if they haven't seen it yet.

When he locates Lohte he hands him the prisoner treatment writeup, including a section about recidivism and mental health in humans.

Permalink Mark Unread

"I think this might be another difference between humans and faeries. We've taken in people who were poorly treated at their previous court and many of them experience intense fear at weak signs that something similar could be planned for them but none of them have a marked inclination to commit more crimes. I guess it's possible there's a very small effect, too small for us to have noticed."

Permalink Mark Unread

Yeah, I can't guarantee it's the same. It's just what I have.

Permalink Mark Unread

"This is important to you even if there's not a noticeable difference there?"

Permalink Mark Unread

Yes, my interest in prisons being as humane as is feasible doesn't actually have much to do with recidivism except insofar as that statistic informs feasibility.

Permalink Mark Unread

"I really don't want you to be unhappy here. I remain very concerned that most ways to make the prison nicer either aren't debt-neutral or are very visible to other courts, the way banning many visitors would be."

Permalink Mark Unread

They're a tourist attraction?

Permalink Mark Unread

"We're holding one person on behalf of his court, which didn't have space. We're holding others who we took from the court that summoned you, and people from their court visit. And people have friends, rivals, family in other courts, or courts think that visiting disgruntled prisoners is a good way to hear rumors they might not hear otherwise. It's not rare for prisoners to get out-of-court visitors and it'd be notable to ban them."

Permalink Mark Unread

I don't want you to ban people they do want to see.

Permalink Mark Unread

"Right, but banning just people they don't want to see is even more notable. I can do it, I just expect that everyone around will know that I did it and - you want a million years, you don't want a reputation for being very unwilling to hurt people, even if you in fact want to not hurt people ever."

Permalink Mark Unread

That seems really hard to reconcile with everyone around me being able to detect lies. And lies hurting people.

Permalink Mark Unread

"I think the thing you should do is go on having your principles except about anything that endangers you or the people entangled with you, and be noticeably not inclined to be gentle, there."

Permalink Mark Unread

I'm indestructible. And trying to avoid being entangled with people.

Permalink Mark Unread

"If you accumulate enough misfortune it'll kill your summoner even if it does nothing else."

Permalink Mark Unread

By what mechanism are you imagining forbidding nonconsensual visitors gets there?

Permalink Mark Unread

"People notice that you care a lot about prisoners being treated nicely, between that and how gently we handled your summoners' court. That makes them more daring, directly, or more able to demand favors from other people who'd normally be deterred by the prospect of being caught and punished, or more able to outright threaten people into acting against you, knowing that their threat is more credibly terrible than any plausible punishment. Then anyone with a grievance or a competing interest or a issue with societal change can do that, and some of them will, and some of those succeed, and people start getting hurt."

Permalink Mark Unread

Succeed at what?

Permalink Mark Unread

"Taking your summoner away from here, or tripping him up, or entangling someone with him who they can subsequently force to make mistakes, or convincing him to invite misfortune on himself, or getting him to share the details of how he got you and doing it themselves and doing dangerous things with the product of that, or something more complicated than that."

Permalink Mark Unread

 

Well, now it's occurred to me that in the early 2000s it's liable to become impossible to keep it secret from faeries in general how to perform summonses even if infosec is perfect until then, but I suppose there's a while to consider ways to handle that yet.

I'm not actually sure a deterrence-based policy buys me enough added confidence to be worth the compromises involved in having one.

Permalink Mark Unread

"Under this system, I know how people behave. Under a new system I don't."

Permalink Mark Unread

I don't think anyone should be betting on things remaining recognizable over the next million years.

Permalink Mark Unread

"If you want us to be reliably five percent nicer and gentler than anyone else around I don't mind that. And if they all get better, we'll get better. The problem is being unilaterally better."

Permalink Mark Unread

You don't think having a good example would be useful to the project of everyone getting better?

Permalink Mark Unread

"It might. If you want referrals to courts that might be well-positioned to be good examples then I'd be happy to offer those. If we fuck up everything collapses, this tradeoff looks much worse for the court holding your summoner than for any other one."

Permalink Mark Unread

I see your point, but I'm not sure you're devoting the creativity to this problem that you would if you actually saw it as a problem instead of my personal quirk.

Permalink Mark Unread

"I don't suppose it's helpful to observe that I really do care very deeply about accommodating you and making you happy here."

Permalink Mark Unread

Yes, but you can hope to make progress on that by arguing cleverly about how little anything needs to be done, whereas if you saw the problem itself as troubling you would have to do something about it directly for your goals to be satisfied.

Permalink Mark Unread

"A lot needs to be done! Faeries do not normally live a million years and if we want to we'll have to be significantly more cautious and significantly smarter than most faeries who were doing about as well as us! I'm thinking about cutting out half the court once I can get them set up somewhere else and prohibiting children and cutting back our territory or paying our neighbors to keep an eye on it for us. I'm not trying to keep living in the world the way it used to be. But all the other things I'm doing are about minimizing already-small risks that'll nonetheless get you in less than a million years."

Permalink Mark Unread

That's kind of missing my point.

Permalink Mark Unread

"It's important to me. Worrying about a risk this small would be unreasonable if we weren't worrying about other risks that small. If we weren't, generally, acting like we'll make most possible sacrifices to stick around for a million years then of course you'd conclude we find this particular sacrifice easy to make."

Permalink Mark Unread

I'm mostly concluding you find it easy to make because it's what you already found convenient to do before I came along.

Permalink Mark Unread

"It's actually much more convenient to kill people. We were doing the right thing, as we understood it, and now with the prisoners from the court that summoned you we are doing an awkward hybrid between what we think is the right thing and what your world thinks is the right thing, and it might kill everyone I care about, I don't know, I'd want to wait a while and see how they react and correct course if it looks likely to."

Permalink Mark Unread

What sort of observations would lead you to respond in what ways?

Permalink Mark Unread

"If people go 'oh, seems reasonable' then we can do more. If they go "oh, the strange apsel's running that court now, I guess he wanted everyone taken alive for mysterious apsel reasons, better not mess with him', then we can do some more but cautiously. If they go "oh, the strange apsel's running that court now, I guess he'll make a lot of mistakes because he's new", we shouldn't change anything for a long while. If they go 'okay, look, the strange apsel won't kill you if you're caught doing this plan and I'll absolutely kill you if you don't do it', we - kill the people attempting that, and then people stop saying that."

Permalink Mark Unread

Do you have reason to think highly of your intel on what rumors are floating around?

Permalink Mark Unread

"It's a priority. I think most rumors will reach us eventually, with so many people coming to trade."

Permalink Mark Unread

It seems likely to me that reactions will be mixed rather than any uniform attitude.

Permalink Mark Unread

"I'm concerned with whatever the most worrying reaction we encounter is, since it only takes one person to give us trouble."

Permalink Mark Unread

Sigh.

Permalink Mark Unread

"Can you alter the temperature of a room?"

Permalink Mark Unread

Not directly but there are ways, why?

Permalink Mark Unread

"We could figure out what the most comfortable temperature is and keep the dungeons that temperature without that changing the hospitality debts, I suspect."

Permalink Mark Unread

Climate control doesn't really directly trade off against them being indefinitely vulnerable to assorted maltreatment from whoever feels like dropping in but sure, I can add making air conditioning work small to the to-do list.

Permalink Mark Unread

"There's probably a lot like that. Small and not visible to observers, or not very visible, but an improvement."

Permalink Mark Unread

Cam is not super impressed but he just sighs again rather than thinking of something to write.

Permalink Mark Unread

"Anything else I can help you with?"

Permalink Mark Unread

I don't have anything else on the agenda right now unless you needed to be alerted that one of your brothers is selling his possessions to learn various alphabets for some reason.

Permalink Mark Unread

"Nothing nefarious. He just really really likes languages."

Permalink Mark Unread

I noticed. I didn't think it was nefarious, just unsustainable.

Permalink Mark Unread

"Then he will learn a lesson about the hazards of passion, maybe. - I arranged to buy his favorites in case he regrets it later."

Permalink Mark Unread

That's cute. Cam's tail swishes.

Permalink Mark Unread

"Just wait until you meet my father, he'll be even worse."

Permalink Mark Unread

He's on his way, right?

Permalink Mark Unread

"Yes, and he'll be very distressed to have missed so much. And you can bribe him to override me on court things, though please don't do it too wantonly, I really am trying."

Permalink Mark Unread

How wantonly is too?

Permalink Mark Unread

" - there's a book. It's called 'how they could have lived' and it looks at two thousand courts that fell, over the last hundred winters."

Permalink Mark Unread

And who needs a plate of sushi when I read it?

Permalink Mark Unread

"A person at another court, which is why I didn't recommend it sooner, but you can get someone to read it to you - or I'd be happy to, if for some reason they can't."

Permalink Mark Unread

It's weird that works. Is there any risk it'll stop, perhaps in response to my not having to propagate payment to the author at all in order to get a copy in the first place?

Permalink Mark Unread

"The debt system doesn't usually change how it functions, but I agree it doesn't make a lot of sense. I actually don't know whether it'll charge the person who reads to you, but if it does we can go pay it back."

Permalink Mark Unread

What I'd be worried about would be debt kicking back to the author, who we don't have eyes on if they're in another court.

Permalink Mark Unread

"It seems plausible it'll decide the reader is indebted to the writer; I'm pretty confident it won't decide the listener is."

Permalink Mark Unread

I lack this intuition but you're the expert trying to be ultra-conservative so perhaps you have a good reason to think so.

Permalink Mark Unread

"I wish we had a good way to give you an intuition for debt. My brother was talking about having a computer do it but I don't think that'll work. In a million years we'd probably work out something with crystals but I think it might take a while."

Permalink Mark Unread

Computers can do a lot of things but I don't think sensing debt is one of them.

Permalink Mark Unread

"Debt uses information that's not otherwise accessible, like whether a statement's a lie or how much someone cares about the answer to a question. There couldn't really be something programmable to estimate debt using only visual and auditory information. But there are crystals used for debt manipulation and I am imagining you could design one that changes its opacity to represent a debt-relationship, something like that."

Permalink Mark Unread

Ooh, that could work. And for convenience a computer could monitor it for me.

Permalink Mark Unread

"That'd make it significantly more useful, especially since I think you might need one pair of crystals for each pair of people."

Permalink Mark Unread

How big are these things?

Permalink Mark Unread

"You can make them small. People mostly don't because for most other purposes it's useful for them to be big enough to handle and hard to lose, but you could do tiny ones if you needed a shelf of dozens."

Permalink Mark Unread

Yeah, I'm imagining wanting them really tiny so I could carry them all around in a mount of some kind with cameras watching them for opacity changes.

Permalink Mark Unread

"If it can be done at all that can be done, yeah."

Permalink Mark Unread

Cool.

Permalink Mark Unread

"And if there are any particular visitors you're concerned with I can find some pretext to shoo them off."

Permalink Mark Unread

I don't have that kind of detail. I'm broadly more concerned by anybody showing up to commit rape and torture than by people showing up to, say, gloat harmlessly.

Permalink Mark Unread

"Visitors aren't allowed to leave with the prisoners in their debt, which really constrains how much you could hurt them. I guess my brother could go sing to them all day and then beat them when he's finished but he doesn't do this, most people aren't him, and - I expect you'll find this unconvincing but - if I were in prison I'd prefer it to spending the day bored, it doesn't take that much pain to settle a lot of debt."

 

Permalink Mark Unread

I'm definitely interested in ways to make them less bored. Without the last part.

Permalink Mark Unread

"If we could figure out some way to make prisoners useful that'd make imprisonment much better. It doesn't take a lot of useful work every day to pay for very comfortable conditions."

Permalink Mark Unread

Well, what's stopping that being the default?

Permalink Mark Unread

"There's not a lot for them to do? Most people can't write or they could copy books. You can't let them out to do chores around the court. People who are capable of magic do get slowed down to do that. We used to let prisoners pay with sex for better conditions but we have now prohibited that."

Permalink Mark Unread

There's probably a way to structure that which would be fine. I suppose they won't let you teach them to write up front for some reason?

Permalink Mark Unread

"We could try to get someone to sell them on it and I bet we'd succeed eventually but it's not typical and so it'll be met with some suspicion. People know what to expect, right, and as long as things are about what they'd expect they're mostly cooperative, and when things aren't what they'd expect they're looking for the catch."

Permalink Mark Unread

Is this court unusually literate for some reason, that scribe services aren't common for prisoners in general?

Permalink Mark Unread

"This court is very unusually literate. It was a priority from my parents and once you have a lot of literacy then you develop habits that depend on it, right, like we have written instructions in various places and books available for entertainment."

Permalink Mark Unread

Doesn't that serve as an adequate explanation for why you'd have them do scribe stuff?

Permalink Mark Unread

"The problem is that it's not actually advantageous to be useful, might get you imprisoned longer."

Permalink Mark Unread

Ah. Can you just say that's not your policy?

Permalink Mark Unread

"Yes. - it's not universally not our policy but we can commit to it in this case."

Permalink Mark Unread

Permalink Mark Unread

" - that one I actually thought you'd been told about. We brought most of the useful people from your summoner's court here, and the rest of them are remaining where they were, lightly supervised."

Permalink Mark Unread

I do not always pick up on every implication of everything I hear. My mental image was like the other court effectively lending you those people to more efficiently pay down what they collectively owed.

Permalink Mark Unread

"I mean, more or less? But on the individual level they're more inconvenienced precisely because they're skilled."

Permalink Mark Unread

True. But not because they accepted training once already captured. Actually, if you were training prisoners you could stop preferentially taking prisoners who already knew stuff quite as much.

Permalink Mark Unread

"I'll give it a try."

Permalink Mark Unread

Permalink Mark Unread

"Let me know what you think of the book."

Permalink Mark Unread

...If I say I will am I then bindingly promised to do that? Because I might forget.

Permalink Mark Unread

"With no timeframe specified this couldn't cause you any trouble but if you want to avoid things like that on principle you might say 'I'll try' or 'I'll write myself a reminder' or 'I probably will'. - I really appreciate you being cautious there."

Permalink Mark Unread

It's what the tape is for, much of what I'm showing you is a second draft.

Permalink Mark Unread

"Thank you."

Permalink Mark Unread

You're welcome.

Permalink Mark Unread

"I've asked some courts that'd've had humans if they have any records of what their humans had trouble with. Nothing yet but I'll let you know."

Permalink Mark Unread

I'd be mildly surprised if it was common to keep track.

Permalink Mark Unread

"If you're planning to get humans again you'd want to warn them about anything that gave the last ones trouble but a lot of people seem to think of it as deliberate stupidity rather than a genuine difficulty and accordingly not to think about how it could've been avoided."

Permalink Mark Unread

That's really very unobservant, thinking the humans are just being willfully stupid. It's known that humans do not in general have debt among themselves! Do slowed down faeries ever hang out with humans?

Permalink Mark Unread

"Widely known, yes. Slowed down faeries mostly don't hang out with humans because they might learn their names and then be entangled."

Permalink Mark Unread

Right, I should have thought of that.

Permalink Mark Unread

"My father is frequently tempted! He wants to know if he got their language right."

Permalink Mark Unread

Maybe eventually Auda can be coaxed into helping him with that, or he'll settle for future German.

Permalink Mark Unread

"I think he might get along with Auda. He's very disarmingly obsessed with the way people speak and absolutely nothing else."

Permalink Mark Unread

I can suggest it to her.

Permalink Mark Unread

"Sounds good."

Permalink Mark Unread

Cam swishes his tail. I'm not in the habit of counting questions, and have little idea how to rate how much the answers were wanted, do I owe you anything -?

Permalink Mark Unread

"No, we're even."

Permalink Mark Unread

Cool.

- but now I have another question, which is, if I fix my flickery screen and start doing this same sort of thing with my computer, do I need to have an opaque backing so people don't read my first drafts from the far side while I'm working on them, or does that not count as an intentional attempt at communication, or might it start to if I accidentally thought about it the wrong way?

Permalink Mark Unread

"You'd want a backing. If you put it where they can see it and they read it that'd count."

Permalink Mark Unread

Okay. Do I owe you a meringue now?

Permalink Mark Unread

"A meringue would be delicious."

Permalink Mark Unread

Meringue! How about this one is rosewater flavored, that seems like the sort of thing faeries would like.

Permalink Mark Unread

It seems that faeries do like this.

Permalink Mark Unread

Oh good. Cam waves and goes back to his room to work on the screen flicker issue some more. Continuous output light projection has been done, it's just hard to make it work with the chiplock mechanism which requires very frequent refreshing to serve its crytographic purpose...

Permalink Mark Unread

He interrupts him eventually with yet more certificates. 

"Lots from courts we didn't visit this time! They mostly did it right and had heard the whole explanation already!"

Permalink Mark Unread

Oh, cool! Mostly? Are there any tricky messes to sort out?

Permalink Mark Unread

"One or two." Bounce bounce. "These people didn't understand the concept of writing down excess value generated and instead just wrote down all of the value generated, and the certificates were still worth something, probably because everyone in their court was willing to trade with them as normal, but now we have them and they're done wrong and I'm not sure if we should just reject them or try to calculate the excess value generated, which should be possible though not to a high degree of accuracy because they also wrote down what the transactions were for. Then some people miscounted their own certificates but I straightened that out. Then some other people wanted to know if we'll buy a human they raised from early childhood but the human doesn't want to be bought."

Permalink Mark Unread

I am disinclined to buy a human who doesn't want to be bought but I'm really curious to meet them, and maybe find out exactly why they don't want to be bought. I think probably we should refuse the incorrect certificates but I don't feel very strongly about it.

Permalink Mark Unread

"I think we should refuse them. It'll annoy some people but they'll learn to be more discriminating, and they will still get a lot of goodies so they shouldn't lose faith in the whole system. The human for sale is regrettably not here but we can go out and meet him."

Permalink Mark Unread

Next time we go on a trip, perhaps. Poor human, depending on why they don't want to be sold that could be a terrifying thing to even have brought up.

Permalink Mark Unread

"I'd be pretty nervous if some court announced they were collecting people like me. Maybe Auda can come and vouch for you."

Permalink Mark Unread

I don't know if she'd be up for that but I can ask!

Do you think you'd get sold if you didn't want it? What's even the going rate?

Permalink Mark Unread

"Not right now, no, the court's stable. But there's no reason to think it'll be stable forever and if we can't hold it together it's better not to all die. You sell people by transferring their debts to their court - mostly my parentdebts, everything else is trivial next to that. So people're worth about as much as their parentdebts, which is a lot."

Permalink Mark Unread

What about humans, are those about the same?

Permalink Mark Unread

"Nah, you can transfer a human for just the amount they're in debt to you - which often isn't very much - and the complication around humans is mostly feeding them, sometimes they're effectively free and in good times lots of courts aren't willing to trade them at their debt-price at all."

Permalink Mark Unread

If it would only happen during an unstable time is there a reason you'd be specifically nervous if somebody was collecting, uh, economists? Are there nefarious reasons to want economists?

Permalink Mark Unread

"Not that I can think of but maybe that just means I haven't thought of it!"

Permalink Mark Unread

I guess that's fair! Cam starts filling orders, tail awag.

Permalink Mark Unread

Bounce bounce bounce. "I'm collecting data on what transactions people made certificates off because I'm curious which are the things that have the biggest gap between their debt value and their actual value."

Permalink Mark Unread

Ooh, what've you got?

Permalink Mark Unread

"Musicians and storytellers who derive value from performing! Travel! Lots of sex that's debt-neutral but in fact a good experience on both sides, and same with long conversations that ended with no debt but with everyone lots happier. I'm so pleased we're incentivizing that."

Permalink Mark Unread

Wagwagwag. Travel?

Permalink Mark Unread

"Doesn't create any debt, but people value it a lot! Usually courts don't have a lot of reason to enable tourism but now they're figuring it out!" Bounce bounce.

Permalink Mark Unread

Brilliant.

Food food food food do any of these people want anything besides food?

Permalink Mark Unread

There is one request for a metal knife and one request for an animal if he can make them fast and one request for a book that was damaged in a flood (the book is enclosed).

Permalink Mark Unread

...gosh, can he make a fast animal? Fast butterfly?

Permalink Mark Unread

The butterfly flutters about.

Permalink Mark Unread

He attempts to say 'ha', can't, and settles for wagging furiously while he cages it and writes up care instructions and the expected subjective lifespan of the butterfly.

Permalink Mark Unread

"Oh, that'll be wildly popular!"

Permalink Mark Unread

Demons can't make things with minds, so the animals won't behave normally if they're normally any smarter than approximately a bug or snail. But it's still an improvement!

Permalink Mark Unread

He watches the butterfly, fascinated. "It's amazing."

Permalink Mark Unread

Do you want one? Is it expensive?

Permalink Mark Unread

"Very. I want other things more anyway. But it's very neat."

Permalink Mark Unread

Cam makes the book and the metal knife. It's eventually going to get really hard to keep up with billions of people's orders, even if it's only for things they can't possibly do themselves with any amount of economic bootstrapping.

Permalink Mark Unread

"Yeah. We can do some amount of consolidation but at some point the logistics problem is too much."

Permalink Mark Unread

I guess that's at least straightforwardly handled with more (metaphorical? depending on what they are ordering?) bread lines and then people can buy each other's places in line, or whatever.

Permalink Mark Unread

"Yeah. And maybe eventually with more infrastructure, we're working on that."

Permalink Mark Unread

Yeah, if there were a setup to have someone vet all the orders and organize them so I could just do a whole warehouse full at once, that'd be more efficient than me reading them all and making sure there are appropriate containers and butterfly care instructions and such.

Permalink Mark Unread

"I could probably do that. And train some other people, too, for once it gets to be too much."

Permalink Mark Unread

I bet! Are people picking up the stuff here, or is someone delivering?

Permalink Mark Unread

"Most courts are sending one representative to pick everything up, but we already had one example of a court that was paying another for delivery!"

Permalink Mark Unread

How entrepreneurial!!

Permalink Mark Unread

Bounce bounce bounce!

Permalink Mark Unread

Do you need to run this somewhere or is this a good time for more reading?

Permalink Mark Unread

"I should drop it off but can come right back."

Permalink Mark Unread

Wag. Your brother recommended me a book.

Permalink Mark Unread

"Oh?"

Permalink Mark Unread

Cam had not conjured it before but does so now.

Permalink Mark Unread

"Oh, that one! It's interesting but if you read it too much you just get paranoid."

Permalink Mark Unread

Maybe it will best be read in small chunks between other things.

Permalink Mark Unread

"That sounds good! It's a good book, just makes you start jumping at everything."

Permalink Mark Unread

I suppose that could be why he recommended it.

Permalink Mark Unread

"I guess you're trying to practice being more cautious? But along a different axis."

Permalink Mark Unread

It came up in the context of prisoner treatment.

Permalink Mark Unread

"Did you guys work something out for that?"

Permalink Mark Unread

Not as much as I'd like.

Permalink Mark Unread

"Huh."

Permalink Mark Unread

He has reasons to be conservative but I'm not convinced he's trying as hard as I'd like to find ways to make fewer tradeoffs. Cam sits down on his bed and almost opens the cover of the book and then stops.

Permalink Mark Unread

"Should I hold onto it?"

Permalink Mark Unread

Please. Cam hands it over.

Permalink Mark Unread

And he goes and delivers packages and comes back.

Permalink Mark Unread

Wag wag. Is it going to be inconvenient for you to settle with the author if you need to?

Permalink Mark Unread

"Hmm? Nah, you can make me candies to take over or something."

Permalink Mark Unread

I don't know how far away it is. He extends a wing invitingly.

Permalink Mark Unread

Ooooh. He comes over and sits down and snuggles.

Permalink Mark Unread

Snuggle! Did you like the first installment of the thing I was reading enough to want to hear more of it?

Permalink Mark Unread

"Yes, definitely!"

Permalink Mark Unread

In the long run there's a case to be made that everybody should be consuming future media in an order at least informed by its publication date and prerequisites but a few things out of order doesn't seem like a big deal. Installment two appears.

Permalink Mark Unread

"We can send out lots of different reading orders to people and do surveys on which goes over the best."

Permalink Mark Unread

I suppose, but there's a lot of stuff to read, this would have most people waiting quite a long time to learn the best proven order.

Permalink Mark Unread

"Well, then we should do it before most of them have learned to read!"

Permalink Mark Unread

I guess that makes sense! Do you want to read first or shall I?

Permalink Mark Unread

"Let's start with the sad depressing book about faeries and then we can read the happy optimistic one."

Permalink Mark Unread

Nod nod.

Permalink Mark Unread

So he reads from the faery book.

It's very meticulous, without being particularly dry, probably because it picked juicy subject matter. The first court chronicled had an irresponsible member who ran off while in a lot of debt; they tried and failed to track him down, and then tried harder once things started going disastrously south for them, and succeeded but too late to avert the fascinatingly vicious destruction of their whole court by the universe. The second one had a succession feud with enough characters that there are charts every page by about halfway through the accounting. Some of them survive, thanks to some fantastically ruthless management by the eventual winner of the feud.

" - enough for now?"

Permalink Mark Unread

I believe that will hold me for a while, yes. Wow.

Permalink Mark Unread

"See, better to get it over with first."

Permalink Mark Unread

The adventures of Botswana et al will make a nice chaser.

Botswana et al visit a new universe. A native hits on Botswana and he explains that he has a wife back in Limbo, though he is flattered.

Permalink Mark Unread

" - huh?"

Permalink Mark Unread

I'm finding the copious loanwords unavoidable, here, was it 'wife'?

Permalink Mark Unread

"We have the concept, it just seems kind of irrelevant to mention there?"

Permalink Mark Unread

 

Bringing it up in this context is meant to imply that he and his wife are monogamous, although this is not true of all people with wives.

Permalink Mark Unread

"Man, I'd just turn people down, I wouldn't bring up a partner's kink over it."

Permalink Mark Unread

It's not customarily classified as a kink, just a - relationship style? Also it's sometimes considered an especially polite way to turn people down because it doesn't imply anything about their personal appeal.

Permalink Mark Unread

" - huh. 

Do you, uh -"

Permalink Mark Unread

Uh. I wouldn't describe it as a kink and I don't know that it's necessary for my happiness but it'd be my preference by default?

Permalink Mark Unread

"It is not really a thing with fairies so I don't really - have a good understanding of what its boundaries would be or what things make it desirable or -"

Permalink Mark Unread

 

I assume it varies. I guess in my case it's something like the corollary of how you think I should be with somebody who thinks I'm the best thing that ever happened? I'd naively interpret somebody having me available and then going off to other people all the time as implying that I was not actually that great. I don't think I'm indelibly attached to this opinion but it's the one I seem to have natively metaphorically installed.

Permalink Mark Unread

Lean. "I think you are all that great."

Permalink Mark Unread

Snuggle. In case it was ambiguous, this preference doesn't kick in this early.

Permalink Mark Unread

"Okay. We can talk about it at some point then, I guess. Maybe if we read more I'll get more intuition for it."

Permalink Mark Unread

Maybe! I suppose if you specifically want to triangulate this sort of thing I should preferentially be picking stuff published in English when I was a teenager.

Permalink Mark Unread

"I really want to know what happens next in this story! But maybe later."

Permalink Mark Unread

Then Cam will finish the second adventure of the admirable Limboites. Nellie Bly Ironclad gets up to some investigative reporting and Cam explains why this is funny in the context of the canon of the setting they're in.

Permalink Mark Unread

"Sounds like a neat job. I'm impressed with societies that pay people to do that."

Permalink Mark Unread

She was a pioneer in the field! The pricing model got more challenging in the Internet age, though, it was much easier to make a return on articles that were more like 'ten potato chips that look like celebrities' and things like that than on stuff requiring upfront investment. Summoning becoming common didn't help in the sense that it made it even less remunerative but it did make the cost of living so low that people who found it interesting could do it for nothing.

Permalink Mark Unread

"Ten potato chips that look like celebrities.

- well it seems like a really valuable career."

Permalink Mark Unread

The ten potato chips that look like celebrities articles were well positioned to claim a minute or so of people's time when they were, say, in an office job and flinching away from work for a moment but didn't want to admit that to themselves and commit to something that would take half an hour, only then they'd read a couple dozen in a row.

Permalink Mark Unread

"What a - tragic sort of society. Not as tragic as human society now but - differently tragic, in a way I hadn't thought of before."

Permalink Mark Unread

I never actually thought about potato chips that look like celebrities in quite that way. Exasperating at worst.

Permalink Mark Unread

"Maybe it was just the way you described it. Sitting in work they hate, flinching away from doing it, reading about things they don't care about very much but can pretend they'll be done reading soon."

Permalink Mark Unread

They don't necessarily hate the work! It's just not psychologically realistic for most humans to do work continuously for the hours they wound up being set. I think the hours were mostly set against the benchmark of manual type jobs it's generally more possible to do for eight hours in a row with a couple breaks, people can often do that unless actually injured.

Permalink Mark Unread

 

"I think I can do most work I do at all for eight hours. I haven't measured."

Permalink Mark Unread

I suppose it's possible there are conditions under which humans can too. I think some of them can. This wound up not being a frontier of research because it became way less necessary for everyone to put up with eight hour workdays if they would prefer to do something else.

Permalink Mark Unread

"Thanks to you."

Permalink Mark Unread

Yep! Wag wag.

Permalink Mark Unread

"Maybe we can read some news investigations at some point, I'd be interested in how they do it."

Permalink Mark Unread

Sure. You wanna read some of Ironclad's actual work?

Permalink Mark Unread

"How sure are you that she wasn't lying about anything -"

Permalink Mark Unread

...Not, I guess. Does that mean you have to wait till she's dead? That's going to impose a heck of a constraint on what interesting reading orders we can test.

Permalink Mark Unread

"Or go through a secondary layer, you saying 'this is the article she wrote' - but yeah, human writing that's not fiction might be more of a problem than human writing that is, if some of them embellish."

Permalink Mark Unread

Some of them do and I do not know her particular habits, though there might be forensics on it. On the factual matters, not on her judgments, no way to forensic that.

Permalink Mark Unread

"We can do it! But not advisedly."

Permalink Mark Unread

A disentangled faery in the future prepared to endure some misfortune and headaches could do a business as a lie detector!

Permalink Mark Unread

"Oooh! Future humans would value that?"

Permalink Mark Unread

Oh yes, by a lot. You could probably get most of the value just by making it a theoretically available option and seeing what people do when somebody says "we have a faery on retainer".

Permalink Mark Unread

Bounce bounce bounce bounce bounce, "I'll certainly have paid off my parents by then."

Permalink Mark Unread

If that's something you're aiming at, should be. Do you want to be a lie detector?

Permalink Mark Unread

"I mean it sounds kind of unpleasant but - I was assuming that there wouldn't be that much potential to trade with the future humans. And if there is then I want it."

Permalink Mark Unread

...why wouldn't there be much potential?

Permalink Mark Unread

"We can't straightforwardly interact with most currency systems without adding our own bizarre layer on top and I don't know how well the bizarre layer will work for most currencies, and we're still going to overwhelmingly want to be fast and they, I assume, slow, and they find lots of things about how we pay for things internally upsetting -"

Permalink Mark Unread

Oh, they might want to speed up, I can actually see that being really popular at least on a temporary basis especially once they know to expect an afterlife. I'm really optimistic that we can get the other stuff smoothed out to 'interesting fantasy creature' levels of complication and culture shock in that time.

Permalink Mark Unread

"I really hope so. That'd be wonderful."

Permalink Mark Unread

I'm excited!

Permalink Mark Unread

"Shall we read another?"

Permalink Mark Unread

Sure. Depressing or cheerful?

Permalink Mark Unread

"Cheerful!"

Permalink Mark Unread

Third installment. Nikola Tesla has been written as asexual in this story, though interpretations differ and Tesla himself apparently doesn't talk about it in real life (there's a footnote).

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"Is the guy uncomfortable with stories being written about him that have character interpretations about things he doesn't talk about?"

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"I don't know him to have commented about that either way, and would have expected a footnote on it if he had."

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Giggle. "All right. - some faeries don't particularly like sex ever, though I don't know that they'd have identified as this being a particular trait they had."

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The word's undergone some definition messiness over time, and so have corresponding words in other languages, trying to capture natural categories of experience. I'm accustomed to the vocabulary that was popular in English in my twenties but that's probably just because it was popular in English in my twenties.

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"Is the human culture we'll eventually make contact with very different?"

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Some, yeah. It got hard to keep track of after I died, none of my summoners till my current one ever let me talk. Reading noninteractively just isn't the same.

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"Wait, what? Why not?"

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Uh, apsels have a bad reputation. I don't know if you've read any of the Bible pages you reportedly have transcribed around here somewhere or if any of them mention 'demons' but they call us the same thing, mostly for cosmetic reasons.

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"But you can't hurt humans by talking to them."

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They are under the impression that we can, actually, many of them think demons want to steal their souls and can do that and are supernaturally good at persuading them to do that.

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" - weird. Do they have souls?"

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They have whatever makes the jump from life to the relevant afterlife situation. You could call it a soul; it certainly isn't the original physical body. Other than that not as far as I know.

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"Huh. And can apsels interfere with that in any way?"

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Not to my knowledge and I've been one for a while now!

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"Huh. Well maybe some day I can be a lie detector about that."

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Cam leans his head on Econ Faery's shoulder.

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Oooh that's nice.

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What's the exchange rate on depressing versus cheerful stories of these lengths? Is it by length or is it also assessing literary quality?

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"It's a mix of length and quality and - differentness from other stories you've heard, the depressing stories will cost you less for one once you have heard more of them, and that should be true the other way around too but less so because your stories vary more in general structure and in takeaways. Yours are costing more mostly because of all the explaining you're doing right now."

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Oh, huh. So formulaic stories you can read lots of compared to an assortment? Does it matter how recently you read others of the formula?

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"It matters how well you are predicting this one but not how long it's been per se, and if a story were really predictable for some reason other than having encountered stories like it, that'd count."

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Huh! What if you're guessing correctly but not for a good reason?

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"Good question. I have no idea."

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Cam writes this question down with other things he wants to know.

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Econ Faery pulls out a certificate, writes a very large number on it, hands it to Cam. "Hey, guess what? We just generated a lot of excess value for me."

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These are primarily backed by things I make, you could hang on to that if you wanted.

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"Yes, but now we're settled and if you'd like you can read me another story."

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Oh, I see. Cam tucks it away and moves on to the next section. This setting has people in open rebellion against their parents, which the narrative considers unremarkable, though it is later revealed that in one case the parent is adoptive.

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"Huh, I didn't even think about that. - that humans could ignore or fight their parents, I thought about how they could run off."

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Oh, yes, rebellion in adolescents in particular is a trope. Usually pettier than this business, things like sneaking out at night without permission or whatever.

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"It's interesting that humans have kids at a rate high enough to keep up their population at all. Faeries average less than two and would average even less if you didn't get to own them. - of course the pregnancy is also a bigger cost for us."

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Yours take less subjective time but the unanaesthetized surgical delivery would... be a serious deterrent for a human but I don't actually know how large it looms for faeries, what with the not caring as much as I'd expect about violence? Is it all about the lost time?

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"Almost entirely? I've heard people complain about the delivery but not in a way where it was decisive about whether they'd do it again, just, you know, 'also delivery is incredibly unpleasant! this kid had better be good'."

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I wonder if not thinking of babies as people and also not getting to interact with them right away is a factor. Human parents are often pretty enthralled with their new babies.

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"Oooh, that might be it. The baby comes so much later, and the person even later than that."

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People report that their first kid gets to be a few years old and they miss the having a little baby experience in particular. My mom has claimed this happened to her but her second husband didn't want kids and she met him a little late to have more anyway.

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"A little late?"

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Humans, especially women, have limited windows of fertility sans magical assistance. My parents were pretty young when they had me but my mother didn't marry her second husband till I was seventeen; she probably could have had another kid but it would have been a bit more difficult and a bit more dangerous.

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" - that's so little time, oh no."

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Oh no? - you know how long humans live, right? They're dying in childhood a lot in this era but even now the old ones are fairly old.

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"We actually don't know very precisely! Because even our oldest records don't stretch back nearly to when currently-old humans were children."

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...but people could have... asked... humans?

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"I'm sure someone has done that but Auda's the first human any of us met in this court."

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Wow. Well, human women can't nonmagically have any more kids past about age... sixty or so, sometimes earlier or later. As of 2179 the oldest living human is 141.

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"Sixty's not so bad. By sixty faeries are pretty much grownups. But at Auda's age they'd have no business having children."

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Human conceptions of how old someone has to be to be a full-fledged adult vary but do not range that high. Is this a matter of actual delayed physical maturity or just life experience and stuff you can afford to accumulate for a long time because you're unaging? - how old are you, I'm 172.

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"I have three winters? So, subjectively, a couple thousand years? I think it's mostly that we have to accumulate a lot more experience at talking before we can go out among others, we physically mature at about the same rate."

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Don't people get sick of being treated like children at some point in there?

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"Yes, they do."

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I suppose if that often led to teenage rebellion things would look different.

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"It's really rare for people to have to kill their children. It's the sort of thing that gets talked about a fair bit, but - I only know of a handful of examples that really happened."

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Close calls?

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"I think the possibility is very focusing for everyone involved even in most cases where it isn't seriously considered."

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I mean, do you know anyone for whom there was a genuinely dicey situation.

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"No."

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Well, that's good then. In humans dwelling on being able to kill one's children - at least in a way that they notice - is straight-up child abuse and this is the case even though killing one's children is illegal like all other murder.

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"I mean I think it's very bad for children but if you took them by surprise you'd kill more of them, and that would be worse."

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Rather emblematic of the whole wretched pattern.

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"Ah huh."

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Snuggle.

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"It's not - that people are doing their best with what they've got. But the best they could possibly have isn't even inspiring enough you can really get them to reach for it."

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In some ways that's even more depressing!

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"I guess so." 

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I might have the wrong mental image again but I'm imagining kids trying to, like, play pretend games like human kids do, and getting slapped and sat down and lectured only instead of "don't run into the street, you'll get hit by a car" it's "learn to mark your epistemic states with one hundred percent accuracy really fast or mommy and daddy have to murder you"...

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"That is probably some kids' experience. My parents didn't go past - 'you can't talk if you're not going to be careful', you know, that sort of thing."

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That's better, then. Sigh.

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"I don't see a way to fix it, really."

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...yeah, I got nothing. Can't even cleverly route it through humans should one come by an unlimited supply. I want to figure out if you guys get an afterlife, but... well, if it were obvious someone would have noticed in the, uh, naive timeline.

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"It'd be really good to know! - if we were fast in a normal afterlife would they have noticed that -"

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They wouldn't have (if speed and not only size is a thing blocking naive conjuration), but I would have been able to get your grandmother, since I'm no longer conjuring naively.

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"Right. Okay." Sigh. "It'll help some that it'll be easier for children to buy themselves out."

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I hope so.

If there's some complicated interaction between what dimension one is in and whether one is at the time one does conjurations oneself fast, that could have them tucked into Limbo at speed, but they'd still be able to, like, write the Limboites notes... I guess unless they were just hilariously far away, far enough that even people trying to find out if Limbo is infinite wouldn't notice any buildings they'd made?

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"It'd be nice but it sounds kind of unlikely."

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On a few levels, yeah. It just seems really weird actually for there to be a human afterlife that catches everybody - and handles summoners specially - and for faeries to be able to summon, living on the same planet, and very human-like - and not get one! Beyond being disappointing that would be weird!

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"A highly magical afterlife would make a lot more sense! I just don't know how to ever tell if we've got one."

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The concordances are all pretty close together, in all three daeva realms and Limbo - I mean, miles and miles away, but not light-years. If there were another world I'd expect it to have a concordance nearby but none's been discovered...

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"Curious about faeries who die slowed down but I don't know of any offhand to check."

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If you run across any names of faeries who did die that way let me know, I guess.

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"For sure."

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...or, well, not names, but identifying labels.

I have just been calling you "Econ Faery" in my head and it's getting increasingly weird.

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"I came up with a system to randomly generate nicknames that were reasonably pronounceable, because I was bad at coming up with them! Do you want me to generate you one for me?"

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Sure. How often do you have to change them?

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"Every couple decades is more than enough but it gets to be a lot after a while."

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It sounds it. Is "Econ Faery" un-name-like enough that I can at least consistently use it to refer to you in my notes?

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"Yes, if you'd like."

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Good, it'd make a mess of search to change that often.

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"And tomorrow I'll bring the dice and get you a name."

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And one for me too, I guess. Dangit, I like my name and I can't use it for a million years!

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"Well maybe in five hundred thousand you'll feel confident in your not-lying skills and won't much mind entanglement. I guess you still can't use it broadly."

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You know what's going to be a problem? Faeries will not be able to move around in human-inhabited areas where they can read the language because there's going to be advertising signs up and stuff.

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"Do those have names? If it's just the information that might be sufficiently little it'll fade over time."

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They have falsehoods!

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"Oh jeez. Why would they do that - I guess I can see why you would do that if no one could tell. Poor humans."

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Eventually people develop a healthy skepticism but then they keep doing it anyway.

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"One point for faeries. ...half a point."

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Half a point?

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"Well, the humans are getting to have currency-mediated voluntary transactions without any ridiculous bullshit in the first place, so our advantage from true advertising doesn't really count for very much."

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Cam laughs a little around the tape.

By the time Econ Faery returns the next day with name generating dice he has taken it off.

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The name generating dice have valid syllables in his language on them and you roll three. "I usually do it a couple times and pick one I like."

He gets Ohtatya, Merone, and Corendi.

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"Corendi's aesthetic."

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"Okay! Then I will be Corendi for a couple of decades. Do you want to roll too?"

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"Sure." Roll.

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He gets Dunari and Ellehar and Yulane.

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"Ellehar's all right."

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"All right. Nice to, uh, know a name of yours."

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"I'd call it a pseudonym. I guess people who spend enough time around each other over a long enough time usually just tolerate some entanglement? Does it accrue to made-up names like this in those cases or does it wind up sticking to - I don't seem to have any pet names in this language, a lot of them in English are desserts but that's probably not what faeries do."

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" - both. People usually think of that as romantic, the fact that as you get to know someone and have names for each other and names you've known each other by you get entangled."

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"That makes sense."

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"Entanglement is in one sense always a disadvantage but also when there's enough of it you stop tracking debt between you and just - reason, strategically, as one entity from a debt and entanglement perspective - and that's nice. I think. It seems like it would be."

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"Compared to not having to deal with it at all or just in the environment where you do?"

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"Not compared to not having to deal with it at all, that'd definitely be nicer."

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"I could draw analogies to things humans do. Like, in some legal contexts the function of marriage is substantially performing the function of making it more inconvenient to break up."

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"Huh. And that's meant as a romantic gesture?"

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"I don't think I'd say gesture. But it's a romantic commitment thing."

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"That makes sense. Probably the human version doesn't even give both sides the permanent option of slowly killing each other!"

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"Not via magic, though there are unfortunate jokes about it being debilitating to be in an unhappy marriage!"

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"Huh! - some of the stories in that book are about bad ends to relationships."

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"I guess that stands to reason."

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Sigh. "But perhaps we can get to them some other day?"

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"I'm not in a tearing hurry. Oh, I looked up somebody who wrote things and is going to be born soon. Someone will need to learn Latin to read what he wrote and travel to Italy to supervise his being born in order to test the hypothesis that people might be indebted for things they read by humans who have not been born yet. And then they can surreptitiously vaccinate him against something he is not recorded to have ever had, perhaps, to pay it back if it turns out they are."

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"Do you know Latin?"

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"I read it. I didn't get the language from someone with an authentic understanding of its pronunciation."

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"I bet my brother would be delighted if you were to teach him Latin in exchange for the travel to Italy and all as a favor to you."

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"I expect I can correctly guess which brother!"

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"It's odd how rarely I have to specify."

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"You don't have any very indistinct brothers?"

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"The babies don't have much personality yet but presumably will grow it."

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"I don't remember you mentioning babies here when I was interested in meeting faery children!"

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"Oh, they're a couple hundred years old, subjectively."

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"It takes that long to break the habit of calling them babies?"

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"A nickname like that won't accumulate any entanglement."

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"Oh."

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"Also for most of us it stuck until there was a one-word better descriptor."

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"A better one-word descriptor like what?"

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"Politician, singer, explorer, economist, linguist - or sometimes we just call him 'our father's son', which will make sense once you meet our father."

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"I think I was told he is 'even worse', though I don't know that worse is the right word, I found it charming apart from my concern that he was going to drive himself into some kind of genuinely inconvenient poverty over kanji."

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"He might? But I think he'll endorse having done it. - anyway, my father is very similar and even - moreso, if you like that better."

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"I do. Probably I should teach them disjoint things and they should then teach each other those things. Like Bittorrent for language education."

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"I don't know what Bittorrent is but that's the best way to manage the debt, yeah."

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"Bittorrent is a way to transmit computer files so that the person with the full original file doesn't overtax their bandwidth - sorry, I'm trying to cut down on loanwords - throughput capacity? - on sending every piece of the file to every recipient separately. It's mostly efficient in situations where huge numbers of people might want the file and the original sharer might stop participating but it's otherwise similar to the language learning model I just described."

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"How many languages do you know anyway?"

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"Depends on how you count dialects. Dozens, though - uh, as a gesture at order of magnitude, I'm not claiming divisibility by twelve - I took a lot of summons."

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"That must be really cool. Do you find some easier to think in than others, or anything like that?"

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"I still default pretty firmly to my native language, English, in most situations where it's up to me, and I have a bunch of low confidence guesses about factors that could be involved in that, ranging from - it's not a range really, factors such as it being better equipped to express concepts I'm culturally inclined to, and my having had the opportunity to track its linguistic evolution more closely and immersively than with any other language I know. And I get the approximate fluency level of the summoner, so there are some I have at native quality and some I don't, or didn't until I worked on them the long way. This one I speak with native fluency and have a decently large vocabulary in considering that my summoner doesn't seem very bright - it probably helps that he's likely old enough to have picked up a lot of words even without being very bright. He couldn't read, so I had to learn that myself and am not as fast at it as I am in languages where I got a properly literate summoner to begin with. I read faster in English than most languages anyway probably because I'm naturally the sort of person who reads fast but that counts as an aspect of summoner fluency. Also I did learn a few demonic languages the long way, and those I have to practice - the ones I get by magic stick without it."

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"Huh! Does getting summoned by someone who is a speedreader give you faster reading even if you didn't previously know the language?"

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"I think an experiment on this may have been conducted with some... angels, I think it was angels. I would need to look it up to be confident of the details and my computer is so annoying to look at but I think I remember the results being something like people who learned explicit speedreading techniques did not confer additional literacy benefits but people who just read slowly or had dyslexia conferred diminished literacy benefits. They probably did this study with angels who didn't already speak whatever language they conducted it on, so they'd be able to control for the factor, but I do actually get a separate instance of a language every time someone who speaks it summons me because I get their exact dialect and accent, so insofar as the dialects and accents are mutually intelligible, I could get faster at reading for example Latin if someone who was particularly quick at reading it summoned me."

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"Do you get anything other than languages? Skills or so forth?"

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"Languages only. And it's not exact vocabulary, either, so I can't bootstrap up from learning their jargon or anything - we get the summoners' fluency level but geared towards the sort of things we generally learn words for, so I'd get, like, medical and musical and engineering terminology even from summoners whose only advanced vocabulary has to do with obscure lore from television shows and carpentry, but a daeva who was into botany would get botany words from the exact same summoner."

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"Huh! And not names they know or anything like that, I take it."

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"No - not usually, sometimes a name becomes embedded in an idiom and those we can get. Like, there's a physicist whose name gets used in English of a certain era to mean 'smart person', that could come through."

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" - huh. That'd be pretty inconvenient for faeries, if faeries who've summoned someone were to become daeva when we die."

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"I don't think it'd let you identify the physicist?"

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"Then I guess it's probably fine."

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"I hope the Italian bishop whose birth your brother may attend doesn't wind up holding debt over it. I suppose something weird like the debt snapping into place when he writes the piece might happen so we should keep an eye on that date."

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"That makes sense. Is he the only person born around now who is - remembered in your time?"

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"He's the one with the soonest birthday within hiking distance who is remembered for things he wrote in life that may have enough merit to them to count for anything. Also, Latin will take much less time to learn to read than Chinese."

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"Sounds good."

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Time passes. Cam practices speaking carefully, and works on the screen flicker problem, and concentrates on Latin when his-father's-son scrounges up more certificates, and swaps stories with Econ Faery Corendi, and writes up a proposal for how to let the prisoners exchange sex for better conditions without it being too coercive and gives it to Lohte though he's conscious that imposing this procedure on visitors to the court is probably too conspicuously weird for Lohte's taste, and he fills orders and accumulates a ton of certificates and begins to find it annoying to store them and tries to figure out if there's a way he can destroy small denominations and create certificates for large denominations in their place that won't wreck things, and after another subjective week has gone by, the brothers' dad is only ten sidereal minutes away (...so like yet another week), Corendi says something cute about the fourteenth adventure of the Limboites and Cam kisses him.

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Surprised happy Econ Faery Corendi! Quite surprised. He giggles and bounces.

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"- did I not telegraph that well?"

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" hmm? - I think I was assuming that you or some subset of humans you belong to or - something like that - didn't like to mix physical affection and intimate relationships."

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"What gave you that idea?"

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"...mostly just that you didn't seem interested and didn't seem to think this was notable? And I know it's a - touchy area - and I didn't want you to worry you were doing something wrong so I didn't - this also wasn't a very examined intuition it just would've been my best guess."

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"When I am considering someone as an actual relationship prospect and not just a hookup, and am still getting to know them, I prefer to retain for a while the option to never have slept with them. That's weird?"

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" - faeries do not really do that."

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"I guess that... fits in with the rest of what I know."

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"So if someone's not interested it's ...not usually for a reason that'd change at some point? Like it could be lots of reasons but they're mostly persistent ones."

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"Hm, it's not that I wasn't interested, it was that I was waiting to find out if I would continue to be not not-interested for long enough, where 'long enough' is not a very well defined amount of time but isn't 'immediately'."

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He smiles and shakes his head. "Well, I'm - happy. Not that I minded immensely or anything, but."

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"- for similar reasons I wasn't actually planning on escalating past kissing today but on that one I'm flexible. So it's possible we should relocate just in case."

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He glances at Auda's door. "Have I really not shown you my room yet? I guess there was less reason to once I gave you my coin collection. I had little displays for them with all my notes."

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"That's adorable. But yeah, I haven't seen it."

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He shows him. It's bigger and has shelves full of notes and a empty display case and a wall of interesting moss.

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"I like the moss."

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"Me too!! I spent a really long time persuading it to grow there."

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Smooch.

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Yes that sounds very nice. 

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The "not escalating past kissing" thing doesn't seem to preclude wrapping Corendi up in his wings.

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Honestly he's really confused by thinking of a continuum here at all but like, not complaining.

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If he doesn't ask for an explanation he will not get one! He will only get kisses.

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He is pretty in favor of that.

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Cam does not wind up being carried away on this occasion. He returns to his room later with his tail wagging, though.

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He flops happily in his room and smiles at the ceiling.

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It will not take another entire week for Cam to ask about what sex acts he likes.

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Gosh. He has more detail than would be normal among humans but this is not actually a selection that would parse as kinky among humans.

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That's a lot of detail! Okay! Cam can work with that. Conveniently he is not particularly kinky either.

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If Cam does not have a lot of detail they can experiment and discover some.

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Cam has some detail but not, uh, thousands of years' worth!

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Well that makes sense.

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It does, doesn't it.

He remembers to feed Auda without fail but sometimes he does give her a day or two's worth and disappear for a while.

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Auda is confused about his life choices but happy enough to spend her time reading or having careful interactions with faeries who've been warned not to hurt her.

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Cam will warn faeries not to hurt her as necessary.

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And eventually the kids' father will return!! He bounds up to Cam and demands EVERYTHING.

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"...I think I'm supposed to avoid getting entangled with people and I don't think you've had very long to accumulate certificates."

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"Who told you to avoid getting entangled with people? It's safe enough if they're not stupid people."

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"Did you not get a headache on the way back to the faery circle? If you did that would have been me making a mistake because I'm not well-accustomed to speaking carefully."

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"Oh, that makes sense! Well I'll take my chances."

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"I'm... not sure that's a good idea... and if you decide it's not a good idea in a couple of weeks that's enough time to get into a lot of debt because I know a lot of things, even if you don't want any of the material objects."

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"I was told you speak dozens of languages, many of them with different alphabets, and also know about a thousand years of human technology."

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"Yes."

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"I will not regret this unless you literally murder me."

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"I can't figure out definitively if faeries have an afterlife so I'm not sure you'd regret if it I literally murdered you either. But the various people entangled with you might not like it."

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"Languages," he says pleadingly.

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"I have taught your son several alphabets and a surprising amount of Latin, you could start with him and see if that nets certificates?"

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Such a sad sad fairy.

Permalink Mark Unread

"I just don't want to hurt anyone if I slip up, talking like this is really hard."

Permalink Mark Unread

Nod.

Permalink Mark Unread

"Sorry."

Permalink Mark Unread

He goes off to find his son.

Permalink Mark Unread

Cam goes looking for Corendi. "Your dad was all set to go into really steep debt."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Oh, yeah, I bet."

Permalink Mark Unread

"I didn't let him but he was so bummed about it. However, I think the Bittorrent model might let him and your brother fund a lot of stuff they want just off the surplus they generate teaching each other, that can't reasonably be the going rate on how much value people get out of learning Latin."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Not at all! They get punished for being obsessed, it's very unfair."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Well, now they can get certificates out of it. Hopefully enough of them."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Yep!" Kiss.

Permalink Mark Unread

Permalink Mark Unread

Cam works on the screen flicker problem, determines it will be time-consuming, and in the meanwhile sets up an e-ink grid across his wall, where each of a few dozen screens can display something different and he can do things in massive parallel, or just queue up the first forty pages of a book and have the first one advanced from page 1 to 41 by the time he finishes reading the last. There is a curtain he can draw over the screens to prevent stray faery eyes from gathering debt.

He teaches his boyfriend's dad, and the son thereof, languages on the Bittorrent model. They can mostly sustain the hobby with their own surplus value once they have a good head of steam going and can entertain each other with the languages they're working on.

He fills orders. Fast bugs, conveniently small and normally behaved; things made of metal, of plastic, of anything the faeries like; writing with dead authors including the posthumous works of various Limboites; and of course food. Food food food. Apple tarts and malted Scotch and sushi rolls and rabbit hearts and butterscotch and donut holes, all arriving by pedestrian courier as far away as Aragon still as fresh as if they were made half an hour ago since in fact they were. Faeries sure like food.

 

Cam considers the ecology. Faery courts are small; faeries are small. They don't need food, just dew, and not much dew. They reproduce seldom... as they count time. Their burden on the food web should be light.

But they do like food. They do want food. And even without Cam they can get it. They have to police their borders for anyone trying to take anything. Not just mushrooms and nuts and berries - firewood, medicinal herbs, pretty rocks. They have obstacles to hunting but nothing actually stops them from throwing a net around a bird in flight and dropping a rock on it to suffocate it, even if they can't shoot it. They can't smoke a beehive but they don't have to, they can walk in, tiny and too fast to see, carrying buckets. They can go to an orchard full of pears and over the course of a leisurely several years from their perspective pluck and eat every single one before a human eye, let alone hand, catches it at being ripe.

They have not yet driven bees extinct. Enough human staples require more cooking than they're capable of that they probably haven't made a big dent in the human food supply even if they've destroyed some orchards that happen to be convenient to courts. But in Cam's future there is such a thing as a wild blackberry, people plant plum groves, unattended nestboxes aren't ransacked for their potential meringues, and all this is true even in Ireland, which is supposed to be absolutely lousy with faeries. Is it just careful land management?

Careful land management by a people who even where literate do not have records of the time when currently old humans were children? By a people whose understanding of theft is mediated entirely by their sense of debt, which understands a slow human's field of vegetables as, maybe not prime real estate - too highly trafficked for paths and therefore for residences - but certainly fair game for what might generously be called gleaning. By a people who would see the consequences of their consumption in a thousand years, if at all.

By a people who number some twenty billion.

 

Cam remarks to his boyfriend's father, "Your estimate is twenty billion faeries in the world, right? - how long have there been twenty billion faeries?"

Permalink Mark Unread

" - well, presumably there are more fairies now than there were at any previous point."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Yyyyyes but - how fast is the population growing -"

Permalink Mark Unread

" - I think I read an estimate of the population twenty winters ago, somewhere." He goes looking for it. "Ah hah, yes I did. Twenty-two winters ago someone estimated there were between seven and ten billion of us."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Okay, so - something close to doubling every twenty sidereal years. Which would seem very modest from the faery perspective but - I don't think it can keep going, not and have things turn out how they do when I'm from. I'm not even sure it can go on another twenty sidereal years."

Permalink Mark Unread

" - huh, why's that?"

Permalink Mark Unread

"Uh, in principle, a whole heck of a lot of faeries would fit on the planet just fine, maybe as many as there's enough dew for but it's possible there are bugs or something that rely on dew so maybe not that many. You get real little, you don't need to eat anything else. But you don't - live in the way that would let you grow that far. You hold territory and you have to defend it and its contents. You like food and you can get it, even out of human-cultivated places if you want - right? It's only artificial things you can't interact with, you can walk right into a field and take all the non-artificial growing things you want. You have to go about it in a weird way to hunt but it's not impossible. And faeries might eat a million times less than humans, but everything you do, you do about a thousand times faster. Uh, imagine being a human walking around in the Misty Isles, after every place that isn't trafficked daily by humans is a faery court. This human sees - no wild berries, no edible mushrooms, no birds' eggs, no flowers, no honey in the beehives. Right? You don't know when you see a human coming toward a flower whether they're going to pick it or just sniff it. You have to get it out of the way to be safe if it might be the first thing. But if every wild square foot of the island belongs to a court, and the humans start, say, trying to forage a little more because somebody - it wouldn't take many faeries - if somebody went after their fruits and vegetables and grains, maybe even their chickens if a coop was left open or something, in order to throw a party every week -

- then a human would see all this nothing, and maybe history can absorb some humans dying of hunger because there's nothing in the forest or walking into faery circles about it, but the ecology can't absorb faeries collecting everything every year. If you pick all the flowers and berries they can't reseed the plants - planting them yourselves just opens a vulnerability. If you take all the honey the bees don't have any left and if you take the eggs then no new birds hatch and every year there are fewer and fewer bees and birds. Anything that eats those starves. And solving coordination problems about how to manage your environment is hard - maybe easier if you can't lie and everybody answers to a court leader so they can negotiate directly, but if there are forty billion of you? Eighty billion? A hundred and sixty billion? Three hundred and twenty - you presumably see where I'm going with this -"

Permalink Mark Unread

" - yes. There's a thousand years before the history you remember and by long before then every bit of land that's worth having as territory will be."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Exactly. So - either you're going to run into an extinction event and I can't save you without risking obliterating the universe, or you all manage, soon before it gets too much worse, to agree to stop having kids and rely mostly on me for food, or - you go somewhere."

Permalink Mark Unread

" - is there somewhere to go?"

Permalink Mark Unread

"I'm... not sure. We did cover the 'space' possibility before and it didn't look promising.

There might be enough time to figure out how to upload you. That's - not been invented yet in my future but it could possibly be figured out before you guys double again."

Permalink Mark Unread

"I am not sure I know what the suggestion is concretely -"

Permalink Mark Unread

"You've seen me use my computer some - it's theorized that by scanning a brain in enough detail, perhaps destructively, one could render all the information such as memories and personality as a program on a computer, which could if you did it right think like a live person of flesh and blood. We'd also have to solve the problem of getting an environment people wanted to live in rendered so the uploads can interact with it and stuff like that. I don't know if any of your magical properties would make the trip but the environment might be able to mimic some of them - running fast, being various sizes - whereas I have no good prospect of replacing debt tracking or its followon traits."

Permalink Mark Unread

"It seems like we could at least use debt to check if it worked - we track debt between people, I'd expect regardless of whether they're on a computer - and if there's not debt among computer-people I guess that would be socially disruptive but not that much of a loss...

You won't get sufficiently high compliance, not voluntarily."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Uh, if I upload somebody and the only indicator it didn't work is that they can no longer be in debt or vice versa, I'm not sure I'd consider that very damning evidence. It could be something that debt tracks that we shouldn't care about, in that case. But I don't have a strong prediction about it.

Are we talking 'I have to take over the world' here or something more along the lines of 'I'd better make the upload environment terrifically shiny and expect a steady trickle of uptake while the holdouts continue to live in regular courts but hopefully don't get to three hundred and twenty billion'?"

Permalink Mark Unread

"- might depend on how nice you can make the environment, and on how convinced people are by conversations with acquaintances who went for it - it wouldn't be reversible, right -"

Permalink Mark Unread

"...I don't think I'd say it would never be reversible. I can make bodies, and it might be doable to figure out how to get an upload stamped into the body's brain. It might never be fully reversible because I can't make bodies with magical properties, so if proper debt tracking goes, it might never come back except insofar as it applies to humans.

I'm... curious why now is the point at which there are twenty billion faeries. If faeries are inclined to double every twenty years, that suggests there were..." He does some math. "...about half a million three hundred years ago, and perhaps just a few hundred a couple centuries before that. Any small population like that ever having been stable would require there to be some condition keeping the doubling rate lower that then changed; if it was never stable, or crashy, and it's always been a doubling every twenty years situation, that suggests a breeding population of faeries popped into existence some six hundred sidereal years ago and I don't see how exactly that would have happened. I can try to forensic it but that will omit any necessary magical information..."

Permalink Mark Unread

"I don't think we have records that old. ...fairies might not have always known how to slow down, and you can't have children without slowing down."

Permalink Mark Unread

"I guess that could do it but it still leaves the bewildering question of why there are any faeries in the first place as opposed to not that."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Well, why are there any humans as opposed to not that?"

Permalink Mark Unread

"Humans evolved over many generations from other species and you can follow it back like that down to the precursors to single-celled organisms."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Huh. Why are there any daeva as opposed to not that -"

Permalink Mark Unread

"We think it started happening when the first valid circle was written but it's admittedly still very mysterious. But daeva don't have children and faeries do."

Permalink Mark Unread

"We do! - I don't suppose you can solve this problem or at least buy yourself time on it by flying all over the world putting down the vegetation that you think ought to exist - it'd belong to you so no one'd eat it and it wouldn't matter if humans did -"

Permalink Mark Unread

"...I don't think so. There's only one of me and I have never taken a course in naturalistic gardening. Also, if someone did eat it - it wouldn't take many, and why would they expect a blackberry bush that sprouted near their court to be mine? -"

Permalink Mark Unread

"Well, if you toss it in fully-sized they ought to guess something's up. But people are stupid. 

 

Probably you could convince most courts, if your alternative was nice enough."

Permalink Mark Unread

"It would take a lot more detail work to add a fully grown berry bush somewhere than to just drop seeds from the air.

I think if it can work at all it can be really nice."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Why hasn't it been done in your time, what makes it hard -"

Permalink Mark Unread

"Uh - for one thing if the process is destructive it might cause the human to duplicate, if they also appeared in an afterlife as well as on the upload server. I can't rule out that faeries also have this problem but it at least doesn't obviously look like you do. But the live humans don't know that part. It's hard, though. It requires a lot of information about the brain that's hard to get without damaging or killing people and humans are reluctant to do that; demons invented the kind of computer you control with your brain, because we can make disposable human brains to dissect, and can also try stuff on ourselves and then get rid of it without it being permanent or difficult. Uploading can't be tested like that - there's been some groundwork done in trying to upload animals but since animals can't communicate you can only tell how well you did at the fidelity level of 'does the program of the animal retain training it received in life'."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Have they pulled that off -"

Permalink Mark Unread

"I think so, with simple animals, but I'll need to look it up in case I just read sensationalized popular science articles and actually it's complicated somehow."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Well, probably we can figure it out. What would I need to read to get caught up on what they're at now - and what do you want for it, because that'll be more than all the languages, I'd expect -"

Permalink Mark Unread

"Have I mentioned I hate that - I'm not even well-versed in this field myself, unfortunately - let's find Corendi and see if he can help us hack something together where I am paying you in science education for participating in my project or something."

Permalink Mark Unread

"You have mentioned. Yeah, all right."

Permalink Mark Unread

Where is Cam's boyfriend?

Permalink Mark Unread

Working out certificate trade procedures! "Hey!"

Permalink Mark Unread

"Hey! It turns out probably I and anybody who might be able to help all need to learn extremely cutting edge neuroscience or there will be an ecological catastrophe because the faery population doubles roughly every twenty years. Do you have cunning ideas for how I can export all that information efficiently?"

Permalink Mark Unread

"How long will it take for there to be an ecological catastrophe? And maybe? We should check how the numbers cash out if you want someone to read a book as a favor to you so they have the context for other work you want them to do."

Permalink Mark Unread

"I don't know how long it will take because I don't know how bad it is already but it may already be very bad in the places where faeries are densest-packed but it would be worsening on a year to year basis rather than every day. If the author hasn't been born yet is this safe -"

Permalink Mark Unread

"We don't know yet. At minimum it's not a problem for a while?"

Permalink Mark Unread

"Yeah, I guess you can if necessary break into a neuroscientist's house later or summon them to give them stuff as the case may be. If the project doesn't eliminate debt from consideration entirely."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Do you suppose it will? That'd be wonderful."

Permalink Mark Unread

"It could! We won't know till we stick somebody in a computer and see!"

Permalink Mark Unread

"All right. I'll agree to read stuff you make me if you'll make me the stuff relevant to your project, let's see how that goes and we can tweak it if it's too far off in either direction -"

Permalink Mark Unread

"Gimme a bit to look up a curriculum and run my name redaction program." After an annoying amount of time he offers Corendi a book.

Permalink Mark Unread

The debt system seems to consider this agreement acceptably balanced on its own with no lingering debt once he's read the book. He sets to doing that. 

Permalink Mark Unread

"Oh thank fuck, okay." He carefully notes who's reading what by whom and distributes books to interested parties.

Permalink Mark Unread

They do have to agree that they are reading the book intending to help him with his plans which require them to know its contents but they are on board with this! His plans sound wildly ambitious and interesting.

Permalink Mark Unread

Cam writes up a summary of the ecology problem and the proposed solution thereto so he doesn't have to explain over and over.

Permalink Mark Unread

"Wow, what a mess. It seems like there really ought to be some way to solve it with money, even if I'm not thinking of it instantly. I guess a lot of the interested parties don't exist yet."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Also it mostly affects wildlife first, humans later, and humans are poor now and wildlife can't hold funds. Also it would be historically conspicuous."

Permalink Mark Unread

"I am not sure I care about wildlife except instrumentally, for not unrelated reasons. And the humans won't be poor forever and it feels like there should be some way to incorporate that though I don't know what exactly. I guess it would be pretty conspicuous." Sigh.

Permalink Mark Unread

"It's a bad constraint for so many reasons. I wish this were just an alternate universe."

Permalink Mark Unread

"It still seems like you could come up with some kind of deal with future humans although knowing exactly and specifically what they'll be like makes the deal a lot simpler."

Permalink Mark Unread

"What if they don't like the deal you made with them, though, they have no opportunity to disagree if you mispredict their behavior based on their known actions and furthermore you have no opportunity to convince any who are predictably recalcitrant."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Yes, it'd need some kind of weird framework but I feel like someone ought to be able to come up with one! I am in favor of people I haven't met negotiating deals with me that I'm held to to the extent they were working off a good model of me and advanced my actual interests! - probably even if there's a clever way to do it it's not how we'll fix this, though."

Permalink Mark Unread

"You're very yourself." Cam kisses him.

Permalink Mark Unread

"So I've been told! Mostly by you! - we should keep the certificates thing up even if mostly so everyone knows who we are and has a vague sense we do absurd and useful things, can I go over the latest batch of edge cases -"

Permalink Mark Unread

"Yeah, what have we got? Filling orders will help in the short term anyway if people buy food from me instead of getting stuff from farms."

Permalink Mark Unread

He has a huge stack of orders which are straightforward to fulfill and a small stack of edge cases that aren't. People want to claim credit for work that started before they heard about the certificates and came up with this odd set of agreements to try to do that, people want to claim credit for stopping a forest fire that would've affected neighboring courts too, people misunderstood the rules and did half a dozen different stupid things...

Permalink Mark Unread

"I kind of want to credit the forest fire but I don't know if that'd fuck things up?"

Permalink Mark Unread

"Yeah, I wasn't sure either. It seems that preventing forest fires creates value, and if they agree with the neighbors on how much value and stamp it then that seems fair enough. But I'm not sure you couldn't set fires to exploit it, or at least make it known you'd be really happy about them - or let them spread towards neighboring territory -"

Permalink Mark Unread

"Insurance has this issue among humans. I guess we could make them assert that they did nothing to promote or encourage fires."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Yeah. And both they and neighbors might be tempted to upwardly estimate the potential damage of a averted fire -"

Permalink Mark Unread

"Can they do that?"

Permalink Mark Unread

"Not very far. I can't do it at all but my friendly brother can do it by up to ten percent if it's in a domain he doesn't know much about."

Permalink Mark Unread

"...'friendly brother' is the really tall redhead? Uh, I don't think I'd normally be very worried about up to ten percent estimate inflation but again don't know if it'll fuck things up."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Yes, that's the one. My father can't do it at all either. I think it's something about analytical style. Ten percent doesn't sound to me like it'd cause any major problems, but I don't know if I have a strategy here that catches all of them -"

Permalink Mark Unread

"- also flipping back into the ecological perspective for a moment some amount of forest fire can be important for some species and suppressing them as quickly as faeries probably can might be bad. I mean, people's livelihoods are more important than a few years' worth of fire management in a specific forest and also off the top of my head the species I can think of that have this trait grow in North America but there might be some here. - is it just livelihoods or is it also lives, can fire move fast enough to catch a fast faery? I guess you'd lose anyone pregnant or working on magic?"

Permalink Mark Unread

"Yes, and people don't necessarily evacuate prisoners. Otherwise it mostly can't, though if it rings you from all directions - happens sometimes when there's a lot of wind - you can in theory be well aware of it for many sleeps and still not have a route out of it. I've never heard of that happening to any court that didn't already have a huge pile of misfortune but it's possible."

Permalink Mark Unread

"You could dig underground to wait it out, maybe? I guess it'd make it really hard to get dew if you had to wait it out there and can't eat... worms or something to replace it? How often do you actually need dew?"

Permalink Mark Unread

"About once a sunrise, though you'll feel all parched and lethargic before that. You could wait out a fire underground if you had dew saved, which smart courts do, and maybe even if you didn't, as long as you had somewhere you could go for it once the flames burned out."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Oh, I didn't actually realize you could save dew, I think I was under the impression that it had to be collected fresh to work better than any random water source. I wonder if dew I make would count or if it has to have the actual causal history of being dew and if it does I wonder if making it really humid around something that could collect the moisture into dew would work."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Both those are things we should check! You save dew by carefully taking some leaves underground, I don't think it'd work to put it in jars just itself. But it's all right if the leaf has been cut from the plant."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Can you tell by tasting it or would you have to see if someone got parched and lethargic sticking to my dew?"

Permalink Mark Unread

"I also have not checked whether I can tell from taste. I know from a jar doesn't work because people've tried that with prisoners."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Of course they have."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Personally I respect killing your prisoners for science lots more than killing your prisoners for no reason but I acknowledge that both of these things are bad and we should incentivize everyone to stop."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Agreed. Uh, popping the stack from forthcoming dew science... fires. I'm still kinda - there are many easier less risky ways to get money than this but there are so many people so if any of them have a taste for setting fires..."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Yeah. Maybe we can send them a nice card with some candy attached saying that we haven't come up with a way to sensibly credit people for fires yet so we're not doing it but they do receive our thanks for ideas for future changes to the system."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Yeah." Cam pins a caramel to a postcard with a picture of a sunset on it.

Permalink Mark Unread

"And maybe we should assemble a task force of people whose job it is to try to think of loopholes, paid for catching them."

Permalink Mark Unread

"I like that one." Wag wag.

Permalink Mark Unread

"I am not very surprised!"

Permalink Mark Unread

"We're going to have to have some sort of policy update system."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Oh, yeah, we will. Man, it's hard enough to communicate just the very basics to everybody - where are we on internet -"

Permalink Mark Unread

"I'm still working on screen flicker, nothing good is going to be tolerable to use before I have that fixed. Maybe I could set up something without screens but designing it will be a pain without screens. I think I'll have it within the subjective month?"

Permalink Mark Unread

"That's not too long, policy updates can easily wait that long. It'll take half that just to get a task force together and doing things."

Permalink Mark Unread

"And to deliver devices, yeah."