« Back
Generated:
Post last updated:
shrewd counsel and common sense
A new cleric of Irori looks for advice from one of Erecura's
Permalink Mark Unread

Eisethia is just starting to realize how much she doesn't know in regards to legal and political matters.  Her reading is informative, but she lacks both the mundane everyday context someone not raised in a monastery has and the higher sensibilities developed in nobility and clergy trained in politics.  She is beginning to worry that she made a critical mistake asking to attend the convention.  She could have tried to go longer eking out a path for her monastery without trying to draw the attention of anyone powerful sooner than absolutely necessary.  Her students are all intimidated by her, and to ask them for advice would break the image of confidence and surety she has developed.

But there is someone in Westcrown with a well established reputation for wise advice.  Theopho of the Runes, Watcher of Erecura.  Erecura, being a hell god but Lawful Neutral might have just the right cleric to give her advice given her own transition from serving Eiseth to serving Irori.  She attends one service, slipping in the back, in the closest thing to ordinary clothes she has.  She follows some of it, but she thinks she is missing too much context to really understand the service's meaning and lessons.  She comes back a few days later during his open time for unscheduled consultations, dressed in her best monk robes (not that she owns many to pick from), and wearing her symbol of Irori plainly visible.  She tries to avoid deliberately intimidating the other petitioners away from the office to get in first, but her tall muscular build and holy symbol seem to cause them to give her space.

Her voice shows none of her recent uncertainty: "Watcher, I would seek your counsel."

Permalink Mark Unread

He noticed a new face; his congregation is not very large.

Also, just a glance at her is enough to see that she is dangerous. His first thought is 'Hellknight armiger', probably Order of the Scar, but none of those would be seeking him out without one of their officers and probably their armor, leather even if they hadn't earned steel. And also, on second look, this is someone who moves like she will stab you in the back, not the front, and even the assassin-hunters of the Scar are mostly not subtle.

The symbol of Irori doesn't exactly clear that up, but it does make it more interesting.

"I have time to give it. How much privacy do you require?"

Permalink Mark Unread

She thought she had prepared for this... but already his first question gives her pause.  She doesn't think anything she has to discuss should be that secret, but on the other hand it's hard to be sure?  Her old Sisterhood would guard every last detail carefully for any clue could prove critical.  Maybe if she phrases things in a way that puts the question back to him with more context?

"Much of the counsel I would seek and questions I would ask are those any new cleric without a senior mentor or church hierarchy and only the most basic of written material to reference would consider.  Of course these are chaotic times, and I worry even such straight forward matters might be delicate, in fact it is handling such delicacies I most strongly need your counsel about.  And I assume from your own candidacy you have many useful thoughts about the upcoming convention?  I had thought the convention would not be secret?  And I do have a question... which might reveal what anyone that observed me closely could tell, but perhaps it is best not to be careless with such details?"

There, hopefully enough hints to let him take whatever precautions he would think best?  He is supposed to be good at divining things from small clues and staying well informed right?

Permalink Mark Unread

Wow, is she even Chelish? She is the worst liar he's met in years, even the occasional sailors from the port.

"An understandable uncertainty, and a wise choice for who to ask about it. I think... best we step aside, though I don't think any magic will be necessary."

He gestures to a small room to the side, tile coating stone walls that were probably stone shaped. "In here, ma'am."

Permalink Mark Unread

She was raised in a monastery to fight, not socialize!  And even her more recent assassination focused training (just prior to the Four Day War) was more stealth and disguise and less social subterfuge!

She steps inside.  Hmm... best just to get the big thing out of the way, and also see how much he knows in the process?  "So... for background, what do you know about the old crematorium on the other side of town?"  She avoids the name Massacre House, best to make him work for it.

Permalink Mark Unread

"A crematorium off on shore, worth knowing about? You'd have to mean the Massacre House, wouldn't you? Which means you've been a nun significantly longer than you've been Irori's nun. Though the Sisters of Eiseth have been very quiet this last year, as far as I've heard."

Permalink Mark Unread

She's pleased, he's well informed, and seems more interested than intimidated, so hopefully his advice should be good!  "Indeed, you are as well informed as people say.  To round out your knowledge, in anticipation of the sage advice you are sure to give me, after the Four Day War, a few of the nuns deserted, and then every fully initiated nun abandoned the monastery."  She resists the urge to simply give him the full story right then, best to let him talk some.  She wasn't good at such social tactics, but she was at least vaguely aware of them, and the best way to improve is practice.  

Permalink Mark Unread

"I see. Natural enough, I suppose. But you remained, and eventually sought out different patronage. Where did you find Irori's lessons in enough detail to start learning them?"

Permalink Mark Unread

"Ah well, I went through several booksellers and only managed the most tangential knowledge, but then I had the good fortune that one of the book sellers remembered a cleric of Asmodeus that had an interest in books not allowed to most people.  I had heard many cleric of Asmodeus have lost their power, so I paid him a visit and convinced him I would be better suited to hold on to several books in his collection, seeing as how he no longer needed such religious knowledge."  She's smiling with unconcealed glee "Among the books I now have, are a Godclaw instructional text, a Asmodean comparative religious text, and a Avistani translation of The Unbinding of Fetters".  The Godclaw text was the most straightforward and immediately useful, but I've been working my way through The Unbinding of Fetters.  The more layered metaphors often lose me, but overall I think a challenging text is appropriate for a God such as Irori."  In her pride Eisethia starts to forget her previous commitment to sound conversational strategies.

Permalink Mark Unread

"I imagine some of that was only dubiously legal, but, as is my policy when giving counsel, unless compelled to serve as a witness I will not reveal it.

And yes, that sounds like a proper Iroran perspective on the matter. I can't help you any better than you already have, if you have a genuine Unbinding of Fetters; most of my time abroad was in Rahadoum, which is useless here, of course, and I know Irori largely by his reputation here and Absalom."

Permalink Mark Unread

Dubiously legal, maybe?  But Unlawful?  Eisethia used her superior discipline to obtain her desire by allowing a weaker foe to generously surrender it!  Well, such distinctions between Law and legality weren't among her questions and it sounds like Theopho won't complain to any lesser authority anyway.  "Well in that case, on to the more delicate matters?  Are you aware of the status of Irori given recent circumstances?  I got an invitation to the convention as a delegate of Irori's faithful after writing a letter explaining my situation along with a second letter clarifying that I had not previously sworn any oaths to any hellish powers.  I wish to ensure there are no issues between Irori's Church, my monastery, and the government."  Possibly a bit vague, but Theopho seems to read into things well?

Permalink Mark Unread

"As with most churches, it's not well-established so far. I haven't inquired how many priests of Irori have been approved for the Convention; I'd suspect you're not the only one, and Knights of the Godclaw arguably count, but I doubt it's many. Irori does not choose His priests prolifically, from what I've heard, especially not north of Nex or west of Qadira."

"I would suggest you cease breaking the mundane law as much as possible. Eiseth's path is not Irori's, and while he is not a god of thief-catchers, I do not think he will be as forgiving as she was in setting your personal Law against the Law of society. And certainly the government will not be forgiving of any crimes they catch you at, blessed by an approved god or not."

Permalink Mark Unread

The advice about the church is useful, and Eisethia is pleased at the thought she might have a high station as the church is establishes itself.

Well, she hadn't intended to ask about Law and legality (which apparently Theopho thinks of as Law also), but Theopho seemed to know to answer anyway?  "That is-" she means to say sensible advice, but then she realizes she has no idea how to go about learning the Law of society much less what it actually is "uh where would I learn about the Law of society.  Eiseth's church did not see fit to teach any of it?"

Permalink Mark Unread

"I see." He probably shouldn't be surprised, but he is. "Well, at the moment, it's rather badly chaotic, as no one is quite sure which parts of Asmodean law will be kept, and which parts replaced with Iomedan law or Galtan law or old Arodenite law. Still, you can safely assume that killing, theft, rape, and extortion are illegal, though lawless people will try to extort you anyway and thieves are everywhere. Self-defense is probably fine, and I can't imagine Irori would fault you for it. And, well, this Convention is all about establishing the foundation of the new law, so... we'll get to see it done, and perhaps make it."

Permalink Mark Unread

That mostly makes sense?  "Is there a common standard on how thoroughly I need to make sure people aren't intimidated in the course of ordinary bartering for it to not count as extortion or theft?  And as for killing... does that include forbidding proper, er- I mean especially intense training and sparring with some risk of death?  I was holding off on it anyway until I had the spells to spare on healing, but if it is my Law at stake I would be even more careful about it."  The statement about the convention is more interesting, but she'll hold that question for now.

Permalink Mark Unread

"That would be legal by Asmodean law, certainly. Other legal codes it would most likely depend on their standard for how voluntary the training is on your pupil's parts; for an adventuring party to spar with each other to collapse is certainly legal, for strangers to fight to the same standard would typically be classed as a duel, which is legal in many places but with complex requirements that vary widely. If they all knew that was to be part of their training when they were accepted with the Sisters of Eiseth, or could leave your tutelage if they refused to do it, I do not think it would have any effect on your Law, and likely it would be fully mundanely legal."

"As far as extortion and theft, intimidation is broadly legal as long as direct threats are not made. Demonstrating that you are very dangerous and unwise to offend while haggling is difficult to outlaw, and I think only Andoran and perhaps Osirion try. From what you said about the former priest of Asmodeus I would guess you were toeing the line of extortion, or perhaps over it, but it would be hard to say." Doing unto him as he has surely done unto many others, so Theo's not going to be crying for him, but that's not really relevant to her problem.

Permalink Mark Unread

She takes a moment to consider his words?  They mostly fit together?  "I suppose I'll continue to be cautious about it for now.  Many of the Sisters began their training as unwanted children committed to the Sisterhood by adults and even now stay for lack of anywhere else to go, so I suppose it stretches the letter of the law.  The truly dangerous exercises didn't start until adulthood*, but I never felt I had the option to leave, not that I even considered it."

"As to extortion, well that is sensible enough.  I might have crossed the line with that priest, but I think someone else did him in since I visited him, or else he fled and abandoned all his property, so I'm not likely to have any trouble with it.  And ordinarily yes, I tend to keep things limited to the implicit, so that shouldn't be too much of a problem being more consistent with avoiding threats."

And now to a more interesting question... "And what's that you said about the convention?  I had assumed it was a chance to demonstrate loyalty, swear oaths of fealty, and perhaps come to more specialized arrangements between the government and whatever parties had the strength and leverage to ask for them?  But you made it sound like something even bigger?"  She had assumed it was a foreign way of describing common Lawful exchanges done in mass, but maybe it is even more foreign than that?

*16 years of age under Chelish law

Permalink Mark Unread

"A common opinion. But no, having been a citizen myself, I understand the purpose of a Constitution rather better than most. The way I've explained it in the past is by analogy to the relationship of Church and Crown under the Thrunes. The Crown is the temporal power, and for most situations it is the royal law which matters, but there is, in some sense, an avenue of appeal: if Her Infernal Majestrix had passed some egregiously unLawful rules, or suddenly decided to be excessively Good, the Church would have challenged it, and within limits they could be expected to win that challenge."

"A constitution, once it is passed and established, is rather like that. Rahadoum has their First Law, yes? 'No mortal shall be beholden to a god.' And no matter what their councils or local governments say, if they pass another law that contradicts that, it will be challenged, and struck down, because the First Law and the rest of the constitution takes precedence. And a constitutional convention is where the major powers of the country assemble to try to agree on a new constitution, one which will become the basic law that Her Noble Majesty de Litran is prohibited from Lawfully overriding."

Permalink Mark Unread

She takes a minute to work through the idea carefully.  Meeting your servants (and implicitly potential opponents) in advance to negotiate could be quite Lawful and logical.  Gathering together weaker opponents (for she would have thought the Queen holds more power than Nobility and Religious Delegates) is tricky, as allowing them a united front against you is risky, but perhaps the Queen is that clear in her dominance?  But allowing them to set an absolute precedent (and thus placing the Crown's Law at stake) seems like too large of an opening concession.  Possibly even treasonous to take advantage of if the other Nobility and Religious Delegates leverage direct rebellion as a possibility?  This seems like a delicate matter, even as open as she has been with the Watcher so far, she needs to remember there is some things even an ally cannot be trusted with. (Eisethia is used only to the honesty between Sisters and the wall of secrecy towards outsiders, an intermediate level of trust and honesty is proving difficult for her.)  

If Theopho is watching carefully, he might see a deep tension pass beneath her stoic exterior.

But there was one aspect of his description that also puzzled her and seems like safe ground to move forward on…

”Watcher, you mention ‘major powers’ and I and other religious delegates will strive to grow towards that standard, and the nobility are indeed a major power, but the elected delegates seem like they may be more varied, with not all nearly as wise and informed as yourself, and to call the sortition candidates a ‘major power’ seems like a joke, or perhaps some subtle ploy or pawn in this game that is beyond me?  If you could explain further… ?”  The possibility of a subtle ploy only occurs to her after she proposes it might be a joke, but saying it out loud, she is now worried she is already missing key moves in the political dance.

 

Permalink Mark Unread

"The thing to remember there, is that Catherine de Litran was born a Galtan, and a member of their first revolutionary parliament, and Archmage Cotonnet was a revolutionary as well. They believe, quite strongly it appears, in democratic representation; government of citizens, for citizens, rather than a monarch controlling subjects. Her Majesty is weakening her rule on purpose, with this exercise. Even though this philosophy is perhaps the strongest rejection of Asmodean doctrine possible and the majority of the delegates will thus be hopelessly confused about it."

"So yes, half the room will be people with no distinction; but to the eye of a republican like Her Majesty, they represent the interests of a much larger group, all those people who could have been selected. As Cyprian's armies show, if you mobilize all those people, you can make them very dangerous, so it's not ridiculous to want to consider their side, but that's not why they do it; they do it for philosophical reasons."

Permalink Mark Unread

The reminder that the Queen and one of her Archmages are both Galtan snaps things into a worrying clarity.  They are deliberately flirting with their own destruction out of... pure chaotic principles?  Spite towards Asmodeus?  The uncaring attitude of legendarily powerful adventurers above such mundane considerations as civil war and revolution?

Maybe there is a saner intent backed by their sheer strength?  If the Queen bring things towards the edge of destruction and then brings them cleanly in line, that would be a clear showing of her own strength.  Framing it like that Eisethia can almost see an angle she understands.  'if you mobilize all those people, you can make them very dangerous'... is this a demonstration or test then?  And it also shows that the Queen can rally the masses around her?  At the same time she bring the nobility and clergy to heel?   Perhaps playing them against each other skillfully, showing her own political prowess in addition to the confident image of pure adventurer strength behind it?

"Is this meant to be a-" she searches for the right word that is not treasonous and properly differential "-demonstration then?  That she can bring own philosophical principles to bear against Asmodeanism and prevail with clear strength and discipline?  That seems... like a worthy challenge to one of her skill, given the pitfalls Galt."  There, proper respect and loyalty for the crown while leaving the question open for the Watcher. 

"I'm still not sure I see my place in it?  Should I be watching for how the clergy's interest will clash with the nobility and masses?  Should I be looking to provide the Queen with the opportunity to show her philosophy's dominance?"  It occurs to her, after saying this, that the Watcher, as an Elected, may actually be more aligned with the masses, and thus his advice is suspect.  Well, at this point, it would be best to pretend to agree to all his suggestions, and then later review them for schemes against the interests of the clergy.  But isn't he a clergy himself?  So even though he was elected, he should still be (relatively) aligned with her?  Eisethia is even more aware that she needs to get skilled at this as quickly as possible.

Permalink Mark Unread

"I don't know Her Majesty's mind itself, but I think this is not mainly a demonstration of anything; rejection of Asmodeanism, perhaps. But revolutionaries, even former revolutionaries, do things like this because they think it is right. Good, mostly, but Andoran believes in this sort of thing and their elected leader is a paladin, and he's far from the only one to have combined Law and democracy and considered them aligned. When a constitution succeeds, the institutions it creates build up a new social order, and republicans believe that social order is superior to one reliant purely on the monarch."

"What Her Majesty has requested of you as a religious delegate is that you represent your interests and the interests of the Church of Irori in Cheliax as you see them. Whether you do so is your own free choice, and you are very unlikely to be punished whatever you choose to speak or vote for, even if you choose to be entirely corrupt."

Permalink Mark Unread

Well, she's not going to be (Unlawfully) corrupt obviously?  But overall, it seems almost too good (perhaps too Good) to be true?  If it's a trap, its the most obvious trap Eisethia has ever heard of.  Well, if it is a trap, presumably the obvious part is a distraction from some subtler catch or trick?  Still, she's decided to play at apparently accepting all of Theopho's advice as is, and then carefully considering it later.  Taking his advice at face value, the obvious response is...

"So, voting to represent the interest of myself, Irori, and Irori's Church... I could vote on a constitution to make Crown support of all proper churches assured?  In both legal privileges and financial support?  And, well, it would be natural to include in the constitution a reasonable definition of proper churches, such as all churches and institutions of Lawful Neutral and Lawful Good Gods?"  There, some obvious enticement for Theopho.  He's probably already worked out how in his own role as a delegate he will avoid whatever traps he sets for other delegates, but, given the interests he should have and the way he has presented the situation, he will have to respond in some way, at least to keep up the pretense.  His bluff is likely better than hers, but she's better at reading people than preventing herself being read, and she can think things through (and perhaps seek other counsel and allies) in the time before the convention actually starts.

Permalink Mark Unread

"That's a reasonable policy to support, yes. I'm likely going to argue for whatever terms exclude Evil gods to be precise about it. I also have some personal priorities I intend to advocate for, to varying degrees of selfishness."

Permalink Mark Unread

Right, even though his God is Lawful Neutral, Erecura is still a hellgod and the wrong wording could see her not included in whatever the final terms are.  Eisethia is trying to not to get too excited about what is (probably?) a trap of some kind, but she's already starting to think of what terms she should put forward and how they will interact with those of the nobility, clergy, elected, and even the masses (even rats can grow dire given the opportunity).

"Of course.  Well, I think my own priorities should be straightforward enough.  I'm no expert at politicking, but I think I can already start to see how groups of interests might emerge and push for various terms, especially as it becomes clear even to those less informed as yourself that the Queen genuinely means to push through with her principles.  Did you have any particular strategy in mind that isn't so secret you can share?"

Permalink Mark Unread

"Nothing I can straightforwardly share. Look at what groups form, try to triangulate and compromise where something I, or you, want to push for might sit between them. Bluntly, I expect it to be too confused and chaotic for complicated schemes to have much success. It seems optimistic, to me, to assume most delegates will realize that the Queen is genuine. Many will, surely, but I expect not most."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Well that's good general advice.  Perhaps I am being too optimistic, not everyone will manage to find someone like yourself to take advice from." 

So he doesn't expect most people will actually buy into the trap, or isn't trying to sell it to many other people in the first place.  The simplest strategy of letting some others speak first will thus be inadequate to verify the trap isn't a trap, as it would take too long to verify and thus tempt the inpatient into speaking too soon.  In the now less likely event it isn't a trap, she will have to sacrifice some initiative in order to play it safe. 

"Well, with that matter discussed, I have just one remaining set of questions.  Hopefully they aren't too revealing of my own secrets.  You are a wizard as well as a cleric, and well read on all sorts of variations on types of spellcaster, yes?"

Permalink Mark Unread

"Reasonably so, though there are too many types to know them all."

Permalink Mark Unread

"I've given a read of some of the more basic texts, but nothing seems to match.  I have some unusual variant of cleric magic.  I can strengthen myself for a round, as is often described as a feature of the Strength Domain.  And I can strengthen my cure light wounds spell, as is often described as a feature of the Healing Domain.  But I don't think I'm getting a spell slot specifically for Domain spells.  Additionally, I can't seem to channel energy in a full radius.  But I can spontaneously cast inflict light wounds several times without even using spell slots for it!  I am not formally trained of course, but a textbook for newer Asmodean clerics I read through didn't seem to suggest any practice or skill I was missing on my end, so I've been assuming Irori saw fit to give me a nonstandard empowerment.  Any identification or clue you might have would be helpful, especially if it means I can guess what abilities I might develop as I grow stronger."

Permalink Mark Unread

"I'm not directly familiar, I don't think. I've heard of empowered priests who could not channel, and non-priests who can, but not with enough examples to form patterns. At a guess, Irori chose to empower you in a way that relies less on spells and more on the physical gifts and training you'd already begun with; it seems characteristic. But that's only a guess. As long as your spells genuinely need the holy symbol, you are a genuine empowered priest of Irori, and the rest you can work out with training and experience."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Fair enough.  I had intended to do continue training and improving either way.  And I have confirmed my spells depend on my symbol of Irori, yes."  It's still good to have confirmation she isn't some other kind of weird non-priest caster and thus risk her convention spot (and stipend).

"And so one last question."  Wow how to say this in a way that doesn't offend him... "You've managed to maintain the ability to channel positive energy by staying Lawful Neutral, correct?  I've checked my own aura, it is a strong aura of law and a weaker aura of evil... I had considered, if maintaining Lawful Neutral doesn't require sacrificing too much effectiveness, it would be quite nice to be able have spontaneous cures instead of inflicts.  Would you have any advice on the matter?"

It's an open ended framing, but the Watcher seems quite adept at cutting to the core of issues.  Hopefully that same insight doesn't let him see insult in her question.

Permalink Mark Unread

"It's hard. I had to go out of my way to do Good regularly to keep it up, and I'm less inclined toward Evil than most people in Cheliax, I think. I think it's been a bit easier this last year since the war, but not that much so, other than being able to legally free my slaves. You want to avoid hurting others except when very much necessary, and to do favors for others without any expectation of them being returned. Healing the poor is reliable, or giving to charity; donating to nurseries was the best I found nearby. I expect your habits from serving Eiseth will make it a slow process; they are probably Evil in ways you wouldn't think to consider."

Permalink Mark Unread

She had already expected not being able to train her students properly would be hard enough.  But 'Evil in ways you wouldn't think to consider' is additionally challenging how will she even know to alter her behavior!  Still, healing the "poor is reliable" is actually promising, she can afford to waste expend a healing spell every few days if it eventually means she'll get a lot more healing to work with.  'no expectation of them being returned' is hard, but she's already thought of something she has to spare and indeed expects nothing back for.

"Difficult, but understandably so.  Thank you for all your advice Watcher.  You can-" and she realizes, with her lightly mysterious opening, she actually forgot to introduce herself.  "You can ask for Eisethia at the Crematorium Monastery (I'm going to begin identifying it more openly as a Monastery).  Whether you think of a priority at the convention you would like an ally on or perhaps a case where physical 'self-defense' might be needful and Lawful or some other small favor I seem suited for."

Permalink Mark Unread

"I appreciate it. Wisdom and good fortune to you."

Permalink Mark Unread

"Your services are thought provoking.  I might send a student or two from time to time to them.  I'll see you at the convention."

And with that she turns to leave.